Saving this Union – a blast from the past post from May 2013

*Sorry, for the bfp guys.  This week is going to be insane, as … well, I’ll explain later but I’m going to be AFK except mornings and evenings for most of the week.*

Yesterday I went downstairs to watch an episode of Columbo.

It wasn’t one of my favorites, since I rather liked the guy you know is going to get killed, and this one had way more lead up to the ‘being killed’ than most episodes.

It was the chess tournament episode, and here’s the thing: the challenger is clearly Russian.  He was also a good ol’ boy and you couldn’t help liking him.  Even if, like me, you were aware that the people they let out, even “athletes” (which chess players are sort of sideways) were vetted on loyalty to an evil regime.  (Not saying all of them adhered to it.  Clearly a lot defected, but saying that they had to stealth better than I managed with all my might to stealth in a less evil regime.)  And even though this character is not showing as wishing to defect.

But he is almost little-boy endearing in his escaping from his handlers to go eat snails, and he is clearly a good person in coming to the rescue of … well… thinking he’s coming to the rescue of the guy planning to murder him.

And it got me thinking.

People are weird creatures.  Very weird.  They can believe the most outrageously evil stuff – like that people can somehow be forced to become mere automatons in the service of the state; or that those who’ve worked hard for something should be despoiled; or that a particular race/culture/ethnicity is the repository of all evil in the world; or that a particular gender is not quite human – all while remaining at heart good people.

Were there good Nazis?  Almost surely.  And I mean good people who were Nazis.  And I don’t mean just the ones who had no clue what was going on in the camps.  I mean of course NO ONE WHO KNEW THE DETAILS (the details were unforgivable) but any number of people who thought other people were “cleanly” or “Humanely” being put down and who were essentially good people in everything else.  They just believed Jews (and gays and gypsies) must be exterminated for “the greater good.”  I bet you there were people who believed this who would forego their last morsel of bread to feed a stranger, or take off their coat on a freezing night to give to their neighbor.  And I bet you some of them too KNEW Jewish people and wouldn’t approve of THOSE being killed, making a compartment in their minds called “but he’s not like other Jews.”

Were there good communists?  Of course there were and are, in the same way there are good Nazis.  These are people who think only of the end they desire.  “I want everyone to have a good meal” etc.  They look at the glossy pictures of celebrities wasting in a night sums that would support a family for a year, and they think “why do they need to do that?” From there to thinking all private property should be abolished, it’s a step.  It’s a particularly easy step if your society has long ago foregone teaching real economics or real individual ethics and teaches that all bourgeois virtues come from having bourgeois wealth.  (And also teaches that if you’re poor it’s somehow more “authentic” to be thuggish and uncouth.)

Why am I bringing this up?  Do I think we shouldn’t condemn the “good” members of these evil cults?  Do I think that their good intentions justify their actions?  Do I think we should surrender, because some of them are “good”?

No.  Quite the opposite.  I do think in the “how we got where we are” that some of the older “right wing” – republicans, libertarians, anyone to the right of Lenin – got where we are by doing exactly what I just said.  They knew these people.  They were good people.  They had good intentions.  And up through the late eighties it seemed like the march of international communism couldn’t be stopped, which led to…

The entire attitude we see in RINOS today and which makes us howl and rage, and which is “Their hearts are in the right place; maybe they won’t screw up this time; we will just try to slow them down.”

That misguided tolerance has got us where we are.  It isn’t just the left’s intent and determined long march through the institutions – though it is that too, particularly mass media and mass communication institutions – it is also the soft certainty that these people are good, we like them, and we don’t want to offend them by speaking up.  Because they mean well, really.

The problem of their meaning well is that nowhere have their well-meaning intentions come to fruition.  From Asia to Europe, everywhere communism or socialism has touched it has brought misery and poverty.  And there’s no point at all talking about societies not being “quite right”

Everywhere a touch of economic freedom has gone, even hampered by the society or the culture, or the fact it was so watered down as to be ridiculous, it has brought prosperity.  For a case study compare China and Hong Kong.  North and South Korea.

Yes, this post is in a way a companion piece to the civil war in science fiction, and to “being normal.”  The civil war in science fiction is a mirror of the civil war in the larger society.  (Only we go to battle wearing Spock ears.  Deal.)  Only I think the sides are more balanced in the larger society.  I think the left outstrips the right in science fiction, at least among published authors and those who read NOW.  Because everyone else has been run off.

In the larger society, it’s anybody’s guess, though I think if the issues were brought to point, the left has gone so far left that it commands maybe a quarter of the population and a lot of those are impaired in some way.  Compare the tea parties to the OWSers, not just in size, but in slice of the population.  (And if all you know of tea parties are the media portrayals let me assure you they’re wrong.  I attended two in my region when they first started.  Not only was it not just old white males, but more than half the people were female and we had a slice of minorities probably larger than the general population in this white bread city.  In fact, probably, the larger group was Hispanic (which is to be expected, here.))  And before you bring up the results of the last election: first – unimaginable levels of fraud.  I said it, I stick by it, I saw it up close and personal.  It might or might not have involved a fifth column in the challenger’s campaign.  I think it did, but that’s my opinion.  Second – a media which reports nothing.  Now, still, most of the population has not heard of Benghazi.  Third – the media portrayal of the opposition as the “church lady” circa 1950.  And it’s no point at all saying that the republicans shouldn’t have furnished them ammunition.  Do you have any idea how difficult it is to make sure a group that large and that diverse NEVER slips?  The same media who never mentions goofs like Guam tipping over, or the events in Benghazi is quite ready to jump on malapropisms like “real rape” when it comes from the opposition.  And for now, at least, the media shapes “normal” for a good part of the population.

As all groups that are getting suppressed, stigmatized and written off the national discourse, anyone to the right of Lenin has been getting upset.  And considering the effect that the economic policies to the left of Lenin (No?  Crony capitalism is always an effect of communism.  More or less dressing of it is the only difference.) are having on most of our lives and livelihoods, people are getting VERY upset.

I’m hearing more and more “It’s going to come to shooting.”  I have a sinking feeling in my water that it might very well come to that.  I’d prefer not, though.  Look, I have sons.  Also, we do not live in a nice world.  If our world were really the black-and-white world the liberals believe in, where the USA is the big bad wolf and everyone else is a sweet little lamb who wouldn’t hurt anyone but for fear of the wolf, a civil war might not be a bad idea.

Of course if the world really were like that, we’d be dealing with a species other than human and perhaps communism would work.  Who knows?  May be worth an SF story.

But the world is not like that, and the US even if it is rapidly flushing generational wealth down the toilet is still much wealthier than most of the world, and is way wealthier than most of the Americas.  (This btw is taken by the communists as proof of malfeasance.  It’s a religious dogma.)

While we are involved in a civil war – and let’s assume it’s only half as bloody and half as long as our last one – do you think the other nations of the world will sit still?  Forget a Chinese invasion (though G-d knows you shouldn’t) or Russia getting involved on one side or another with a  view to ruling portions of our country when all is done (and if you dismiss that, you should study the roles of France and England on the past civil war) and just think about the people who hate us and who think (and our media has HELPED this perception) all their woes are our fault, and who  think they’re accumulating virgins in heaven – and prestige on Earth – by hitting us with acts of terrorism writ large.

How many cities do you think we’d lose to random acts of revenge?

What I mean is that it might very well come to that.  But do you want it?  Talk about setting us back generations.  Yes, I know you’re furious and I’ve heard the “we have all the guns” boast.  It’s not true, okay?  Yeah, we have most of them.  And sure, we probably could win in days.  Except that you forget how many third world armies would gladly fight on the other side, once it got started.  And would be promised everything they want if they do.

Oh, sure, they’d probably still lose – but I’m predicting we’d all be wading in blood to our ankles before it’s said and done, and parts of the country would be radioactive for a century.

Again, it might still come to that.  And I think the other side wants that – probably more than even the nuts on the “right” – because part of their religion (don’t fool yourself it’s not one) is the belief that history has favorites and that they’re it.  They think in the end they win.  (They might perhaps want to consult the Norse legends, to figure out which said was believed to win in the end.  Never mind.)

But before the shooting starts – in this moment in the heart of the storm – perhaps those of us to the right of Lenin should try something we haven’t tried before.  Perhaps we should try speaking out.

Look, I’m as cowardly as the rest of you.  I spent more than twenty years, between breaking in and finally losing my mind, listening to digs about “the rich” from people who could buy me and sell me outright; I spend years at parties and meetings listening to Marxist pap and not pointing out how stupid it was; listening to public figures on the right being denigrated as “stupid” when it was obvious they weren’t, etc.  And I shut up.  Because I wanted to make a living in my chosen profession.

I’m still not half as brave as I’d like to be, though I try to speak out if I’m present.  And yes, I know I’ll pay a monetary price.  But I don’t go out of my way to look for fights, because I’ll pay a monetary price.  And also because, frankly, I know many good people on their side.  I don’t want to upset them.

But consider—

My grandmother used to say “silence is consent.”

Consider that when they say ridiculous stuff in public like “the fat cats never pay” or other bits of Marxist agit prop and we stay quiet, they don’t know that we disagree.  And they take what they’re saying for normal and tilt further left, until you get stuff like “We live in an evil patriarchy” (in a society where women are LEGALLY given preference for almost everything and while these same people stay quiet on the societies that whip women for showing ankle.)

Every time we internally go “oh, that stupid slogan again” – every time we stay quiet because we like the people as much as we despise their stupid religion; every time we shut up for the sake of peace or a job, or …  We’re allowing “normal” to be moved farther left.  And most people want to be normal and fit in.  And the truly extreme ones then feel more justified in being extreme.

Every time our silence gives consent, what we’re giving consent to is the inevitability of eventual shooting.

You know those massacres that have happened in every communist paradise?  Here the would-be victims are armed.  To quote the title of some Baen anthologies There WILL be War.

Unless we stop it now.  Unless we’re as brave with our words as we eventually will have to be with our guns, if we stay silent.

I came out of the political closet and fought like h*ll to elect a man who would have been at best as statist as George Bush.  (No, he was not my horse in the race, ever.)  I did so because I thought it would keep us from the shooting war.

Now, it might be too late.  Or it might not.  Staying quiet and cleaning your guns might be expedient.  But is it the best for everyone?  What about the good people on the left?  What about the innocents who will be caught in this?  What about the rest of the world that will undoubtedly sink if the US as we know it vanishes.

Yes, we’re all ready to take our piece of flag and head to the bunker, to preserve the idea of the US until we can rebuild it.

But wouldn’t it be better not to let it pass from this Earth?

Speak now.  Maybe we can hold our peace.

135 responses to “Saving this Union – a blast from the past post from May 2013

  1. Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

    I remember reading that some Nazis in the extermination camps thought “Oh what terrible things I’m doing but it’s for the Good Of The State/People” not “Oh this is Great”. [Frown]

    • scott2harrison

      Many years ago I read in “The Ominous Parrallels” that the comandant of a concentration camp was given a medal (and not a minor one) for having his entire guard force turn out sober. These people did great evil, but at base they were not bad people. (They had to self medicate to live with themselves.)

    • I noticed a particular tendency to concentrate on their own horrible suffering, having to do these things, thus drowning out the sufferings of others.

      I’ve never listened to anyone complaining about his suffering “having”to do something since.

  2. c4c

  3. BFP or not, this post hit spot-on for me right now. I’m re-reading the later books in the Honor Harrington series, and I’m overwhelmed by the calm *niceness* of the Mesans, when they’re not plotting the violent disruption of human space. “Your mother (the BIOWEAPONS RESEARCHER) made something special for dinner tonight, and your presence is expected. It’s a celebration (because the devastating not quite-genocidal…-yet stealth attack is finally on its way.” What the actual hell. Okay, yes, fiction, but a pretty accurate description of certain mindsets. The ones that consider people to be objects that can be moved around to achieve the desired objective, rather than living beings with ideas and plans of their own, individually and in the aggregate.

    Those who say they’re doing things for The People ™ never want to do things for actual people.

    • Reality Observer

      Those always hit me with the incredible rarity at which a George Washington, or a Thomas Thiesman, comes along in the real world.

      Almost every government in the world seems to lurch from tyranny to tyranny – those who overthrow the old tyranny nearly always establish a new one on its ruins. But everything is OK! It’s our tyranny!

      • Of course, the alternative is to continue under the old tyranny because you might not succeed perfectly or all at once, so why try? And yes, I encountered that line of silencing argument here earlier this week.

        • Prudence indeed, would dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light or transient causes;a and accordingly, all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But, when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object, evinced a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such givernment, and to provide new guards for their future security.

          The problem becomes whether people can agree that the long train of abuses and usurpations is sufficient to demonstrate that the *design* is to reduce us to despotism, or merely the natural result of good intentions gone awry, which is much more difficult to fight.

          • The left doesn’t have “good intentions” except in their own minds. A tiger has only good intentions, from her point of view, when she plans to eat you alive.

          • scott2harrison

            No, I disagree with this. Most people involved have good intentions whatever the design is. If the rubber meets the road all that matters is how dangerous you are to our freedom, not what your intentions are. In fact the good intentioned ones may be more dangerous than the corrupt ones. They are more likely to not back down.

  4. The only thing evil needs to succeed is for good men to remain silent, I don’t remember who made the statement, but they caught, in one pithy sentence, the essence of our guilt. I say our guilt, because I’m as guilty as anyone in keeping silent.
    But no more.
    I will speak out. I will state when someone makes a stupid comparison, or point out that the plan didn’t work out for the Russians – or the Chinese or Romanians or who ever.
    And when they try to shush me for interrupting a private (!) conversation, I’ll loudly announce that they should have kept it private, rather than speaking where others could hear them. I’ll even practice comments and statements so they sound more off the cuff.
    Hey, I make up comments for characters – I can do it for myself.
    To misquote Lazarus Long, Freedom comes when you tell Mrs Grundy to Shut the F@##@ up, you evil B&*@@#!!

    • Edmund Burke
      All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.

      • Christopher M. Chupik

        Or, alternately, all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for the Good Men to do everything.

    • We are already engaged in a war for the hearts and minds of our fellow citizens. Unless we win that war any shooting war is destined to establish a Tyranny of the Right, one only slightly less vile than a Tyranny of the Left. (Pinochet over Peron, sure, but better to not face that choice. And Pinochets are almost as rare as Washingtons.)

      This is a war which cannot be won by remaining silent. Our foes having already seized the high ground of Mainstream Media (so that Brian Steel, the executive in charge of the CNBC debate, could be a 3-time Clinton White House staffer and still produce the Republican debate) we must fight them in the style of Francis Marion, following the leads of General Iowahawk, General Lileks, General Reynolds, General Scrappleface, General Correia and General Baldwin. We fight fight them on the FB, we will fight them on the Instagram, we will fight them in the blogs and in the Tweets; we shall never surrender.

      “I have only to add that nothing which may happen in this battle can in any way relieve us of our duty to defend the world cause to which we have vowed ourselves; nor should it destroy our confidence in our power to make our way, as on former occasions in our history, through disaster and through grief to the ultimate defeat of our enemies.”

      • The Other Sean

        How very…. Churchillian, RES.

        From the Nightly News of the NBC to the Evening News of CBS, a Leftist curtain has descended across our media. Behind that line lie all the old media elites, ABC, CBS, NBC, the New York Times, and NPR. All of these famous outlets and the journalists within them lie in what I must call the Progressive sphere, and all are subject, in one form or another, not only to Communist influence but to a very high and in some cases increasing measure of control by the DNC.

        In fact, it makes me feel as if a Leftist curtain has descended across our television news, obscuring

        • One of the items circulating today was a nine minute video of Joe Scarborough asking a very simple question – “Name one Republican who has hosted a nightly news show or weekend news show on any of the Big Three networks during the last fifty years.”

          • Diane Sawyer was a Nixon White House staffer,

            In 1970, Sawyer moved to Washington, D.C., and, unable to find work as a broadcast journalist, she interviewed for positions in government offices. She eventually became an assistant to Jerry Warren, the White House deputy press secretary. Initially, Sawyer wrote press releases and quickly graduated to other tasks like drafting some of President Richard Nixon’s public statements. Within a few months, she became an administrative assistant to White House Press Secretary Ron Ziegler and eventually to staff assistant for U.S. President Richard Nixon. Sawyer continued through Nixon’s resignation from the presidency in 1974 and worked on the Nixon-Ford transition team in 1974–1975, after which she decamped with Nixon to California and helped him write his memoirs, published in 1978. She also helped prepare Nixon for his famous set of television interviews with journalist David Frost in 1977.
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Sawyer#Career

            It can be argued that Nixon, while a staunch anti-Communist was no conservative.

            I enjoyed the part of the panel discussion when Scarborough posed the sort of questions a Democrat candidate could expect (not included in this clip.)

            http://www.msnbc.com/morning-joe/watch/joe–hire-some-professional-gopers-for-debates-557072963797

            Imagine the weeping and wailing, rending of clothes and gnashing of teeth if the MSM or Academia were one half so filled with conservatives as it is with liberals, or a tenth so sycophantic toward Republicans as Democrats.

    • I’ve started doing this. The looks I get are so worth the personal discomfort of making somewhat rude statements to strangers. I work on/above the 16th Street Mall in Denver. There is always someone asking you to sign something around lunch time.

      The young black man collecting signatures for Planned Parenthood was particularly surprised when I asked why he was working for an organization founded to abort black children.

      The environmentalists are the most fun. They are so stupid it hurts to hear them talk, but that makes it very easy to put them into cognitive dissonance brain-lock.

    • “We are the Little Folk we
      Too little to love or to hate,
      But leave us alone and you’ll see
      How fast we can bring down a [culture].”
      “The Picts” R. Kipling from _Puck of Pook’s Hill_

      • I tried to find Leslie Fish’s version performed by her, but I could only find it performed by Emerald Rose

  5. It should be pointed out that the probability of any third-world armies making it here to fight for the Left (or the Right, for that matter), is approximately nil, unless they come through Mexico.
    That having been said, I am in full agreement that a civil war would cost everyone far more than they would gain. Speaking personally, I would find myself shooting at far too many of my friends, either during the war or the war crimes trials. (And anyone who thinks that, if the Right won the war, we wouldn’t have to shoot some of our own if we hadn’t done it already is kidding themselves.)

    • I don’t agree that everyone loses more than they gain, if and when the words turn to knives. Our side gains our lives and the possibility of retaining/regaining our freedom. We are guaranteed to lose both if the other side wins, based on historical precedents.

      You’re absolutely right about the ending. Don’t let anybody kid themselves that this will be pretty. But please keep all the shooting at your allies until after the war is over and (hopefully) won. (Ref: Bosnia, January 1993)

      • I don’t agree that everyone loses more than they gain, if and when the words turn to knives.

        The Revolution Casino is a seductive thing, with dazzling lights and sounds that are oh so seductive. But never forget the odds heavily favor the house, and all but a rare few leave by the tumbrel.

  6. I figure the chances of Hillary being the Democratic candidate right at 98%. I’d say 100, but she could still drop dead from pure meanness. In which case they would run her animated corpse and probably still win.
    We’re seeing what seven years of leadership by an anti American socialist can do to harm our nation. I expect to see crippling executive orders and unauthorized “treaties” ramped up tremendously over the next 14 months, ending with a tsunami of last minute presidential pardons that will make what Billie boy did look like bush league politics.
    Then if Clinton v2 gets elected by playing the gender and victim cards while her party lies, cheats, and steals every vote they possibly can, well then we get four or eight years of more of the same with an even shakier, less competent, more greedy and evil hand at the helm.
    And at some point in those next eight years it will all crash and burn. As Thatcher famously pointed out, the problem with socialism is that sooner or later you run out of other peoples’ money. We’ve already done that, and have been living on cheap credit for far too long. And what cannot continue will not at some point. And then everyone addicted to free stuff will find that government teat snatched away. And then those of us with guns will need them to protect what little we have from those who have been told their entire lives that they get a free pass to take whatever they think they want or need. Before that ends I expect many of our major cities to become burned out wrecks.

    • Personally, I hope that she does get the nomination, because she’s the best friend the Republicans have got. Sanders would be hard to run against, since he appeals so much to the economically-uneducated college students and has no particular skeletons in the closet to speak of. (I mean, skeletons that Democratic voters would care about. I know that he’s said himself that he’s a nationalist socialist, but that won’t turn anyone off unless they know history, which the Democratic voters don’t.)

      Whereas Hillary Clinton has a hard time even looking like she really cares about people, and has enough baggage that a competent* Republican ticket could run campaign ad after campaign ad for months without repeating themselves. And even an incompetent** Republican ticket would probably pick up several percentage points running against Clinton.

      My nightmare scenario is Sanders at the top of the Democratic ticket. Whereas Clinton as the Dem nominee? Please don’t throw us into that briar patch, Democrats!

      * By which I mean a Cruz/Fiorina ticket.

      ** Pretty much any ticket without either of those two names on it, sadly.

      • A competent Republican ticket. Aye there’s the rub.
        I’d be delighted with either Cruz or Rubio, Fiorina as vice, and Carson as Surgeon General.
        I give Trump a lot of credit for saying things people have been wanting for someone, anyone, to say, but just cannot see him as POTUS.
        I fear that the Republican vested interests still desperately want Jeb, and will pull some underhanded back room primary tricks to make that happen.
        And given that Clinton will be the Dem candidate, given that the Dems have a long proud history of cheating their asses off, and given that at least a plurality of voters place the promise of free stuff far above the minor detail of electing a lying dishonest evil witch, I remain somewhat concerned.

        • “She’s a witch!”
          “So? We get free stuff!”
          “It’ll be possessed, you know.”
          “Oh, don’t be silly.”
          “Alright. It won’t be possessed. It will be REpossessed.”
          “By who?”
          “Think”
          “Wah! I dunnwanna! MINE! MINE! MINE!”

          Maybe there should be a book, what title? Perhaps.. John Q. Seagull.

        • … given that the Dems have a long proud history of cheating their asses off

          Which is why we should ignore the polling of the popular vote and look to the electoral college when assessing the race.

          The Dems and Republicans start at rough parity — the Dems have the NorthWest, California, Illinois and New England in the bag, it would require a major upheaval for the Republicans to lose The South. Look to which prognosticators are predicting which states as battlegrounds and only then draw your conclusions. If the Dems are fighting for Wisconsin, Michigan and Ohio the Republicans winning; if the Dems are fighting for Florida, Virginia and N. Carolina the Republicans are losing.


          See: potus2016[DOT]org/swing-states-election-2016/

          The wild cards in 2016 are the Hispanic Vote and how much of the African-American vote will turn out without Obama atop the ticket. (Keep in mind that the states where this vote can be reliably manufactured are limited and already likely to go the Democrats’ way.)

          Hillary may claim the “women’s vote” but that is a false metric — break out African-American women and the break becomes much different; break out married women and Hillary’s bloc becomes smaller still. Don’t believe the MSM bloc identifications: their purpose is to obscure, not reveal.

          Do not doubt for a moment that even the worst Republican candidate is far preferable to the best the Dems can offer. Cabinet posts, agency heads and SCOTUS nominations may go to RINOs but that still beats those to whom the Dems will give the spoils. Moreover, we can be confident that the MSM will neither provide cover nor excuses for for a Republican Benghazi, Fast’n’Furious or Crony payoff (see: Obamacare Exchanges, collapse of.)

          • No, the wild cards in 2016 is whether or not the Democrats can slip enough illegals into the voting booths to flip the electoral college.

            • You wish. They don’t need illegals, and anyway la gran salida is in effect. No. They made CO vote by mail. We’re done. We were done before with false absentee vote.

              • So there isn’t a peaceful or legal solution….

                • I don’t know. If people got really pissed off and a vast majority became aware of what is going on and said “STOP IT” it might work. Just disseminating their shenanigans HELPS.
                  The thing with the non-peaceful solution is 9 times out of 10 it doesn’t end well.

                  • As I said earlier in the thread, we know what submitting to the old tyranny will get us in the end. Overthrowing it may be a long shot, but it’s better than no shot.

                    • but this is not a tyranny of weapons. Not really. Yeah, in extreme circumstances, sure. So it can’t be overthrown with weapons. You’ll just get more of the same. … or worse.
                      What we need is to oppose the tyranny of lies.

                    • Sarah, I need to at least partially disagree with you. One of the reasons they continue doing this is that there are no real, personal, physical consequences for it.

                      Yes, the tyranny of lies is the root, but the tyranny of *liars* consists of physical human beings who see no bad consequences to themselves of pushing lies. As far as I can tell, responsible and responsive government is what one gets when the king knows that a sufficiently pissed off peasant can reasonably expect to be successful in killing him.

                    • They’re starting to see consequences. See Sad puppies, etc. They don’t like it. We need to do this more, in all fronts.

                    • We need not cooperate with them by going peacefully to the knacker. Calling “twaddle” when it is uttered is the easiest course of defiance. We are under no obligation to pretend that those declaring “War is not the answer” have even the slightest grasp of the question. We’ve no more duty to accept their “wisdom” than we do to accept Monopoly Money as legal tender.

                    • Steve and I will be attending Worldcon.

              • NOVEMBER 2, 2015
                EVERYTHING OLD IS NEW AGAIN: Clinton campaign attorney represented voting group now charged with registering dead people.

                11 Comments
                Posted by Ed Driscoll at 6:52 am
                http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/217869/

                Surely a GOP frame-up. No Democrat would register dead people to vote! Especially not with “brand new registrations which include multiple forms filled out in the same handwriting for residents who have already shuffled off the mortal coil.”

                Those Wascally Wepublicans! Is there nothing they won’t do?

          • There is really only one ethnic voting bloc in the U.S.- blacks. And one religious bloc- Jewish. Though that might flip sides. And then there are divides. Rural residents, who have to do much more for themselves with city dwellers, like be their own water and sewer company, plow their lands, eliminate predators threatening their livestock, etc., tend to vote conservative/Republican. City dwellers, using public transportation, garbage collected by tax money, only predators being other people- who they expect the police to take care of-, tend to vote liberal/Democrat. Traditional married couples (m-f), with children, tend for both halves to vote conservative/Republican. Especially so in rural areas. Single mothers and single women- liberal Democrat. Single men- the candidate that appeals to them. If they’re paying any attention at all. Single fathers are for statistical purposes non-existent.

            It’s almost like the Democrats knew they were creating new Democrat voters when they ignored Moynihan’s warnings about equating single moms by choice and widows.

        • Rubio is Jeb Junior. Except he doesn’t have that last name to give the game away.

          • The Other Sean

            I’d still take Rubio over Jeb. Also over Hillary, Bernie, Trump, or the current occupant of the White House.

      • Ask Sanders to clarify whether he’s an international or national socialist.

        😛

    • Reality Observer

      I’m not quite so positive of next year, Uncle. Which is one reason why I’m not starting the “dystopian” series from my list until at least the middle of 2016, or even later.

      I’d like to have a little time before it’s premise becomes obsolete (although “The Last Centurion” is still a darn good read).

    • …they would run her animated corpse …

      How would we be able to tell the difference?

  7. They can believe the most outrageously evil stuff – like that people can somehow be forced to become mere automatons in the service of the state;

    So many do it voluntarily it seems unreasonable that the rest cannot be induced by sufficient application of carrot and stick.

    or that those who’ve worked hard for something should be despoiled;

    “You didn’t build that!”

    True – my design would have been more efficient and cheaper, gotten results in half the time … but compliance with government’s (often contradictory) regulations and licensing and permitting processes meant I couldn’t build the business I wanted.

    or that a particular race/culture/ethnicity is the repository of all evil in the world; or that a particular gender is not quite human – all while remaining at heart good people.

    Ah, well, you’ve got me there, Sarah. They are, at heart, good people. Doesn’t make you any less obnoxious and disliked.

    (Checking the check box to check the check box is checked? Check!)

  8. Several years ago, I came to realize that we should own guns, and be trained in their use, because sometimes in the next twenty years or so, society might collapse, or we might have a civil war, or we might be invaded, or some combination thereof, and thus need to be ready for those possibilities, so that we could participate, or “run to the hills and hide”, or hold down the fort until things settle down again.

    There are days in which I’m afraid that such an event might arrive in much less than twenty years.

    I’m not looking forward to such an event. At a bare minimum, I’m not at all confident that we’ll come out of such an event (excepting an invasion of some sort, maybe) with our freedoms intact. If we do, it’s because we have a tradition of freedom at our core, that we’d revert to if something bad happened…but the Left and a good portion of the Right has been doing their darnedest to erode that core of our traditions…

  9. I was talking to my 14yo son last night about the state of the world, and just how much a 20 trillion dollar debt is, and what ‘preparing for the Zombie Apocalypse’ really means. He just looked at me and asked – “So why did you leave all this for me to fix?”

    I had to explain to him that just like any fight, our side can’t start it, but we by gum better finish it. But the look on his face when he asked me that question …

  10. I know you’re furious and I’ve heard the “we have all the guns” boast. It’s not true, okay? Yeah, we have most of them. And sure, we probably could win in days.

    I’ve heard that before.

    As Sun Tzu said:
    是故百戰百勝,非善之善者也;不戰而屈人之兵,善之善者也。
    For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill.

    Variant translations
    Hence to fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy’s resistance without fighting.

    The best victory is when the opponent surrenders of its own accord before there are any actual hostilities… It is best to win without fighting.
    https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Sun_Tzu

    • Absolutely correct. But in war, it only takes one side to start the dance.

      • True that, and when you dither, when you project weakness, when you convince the opposition that they can bluster and bully without resistance on your part, you can and will find yourself with but two options, fight or surrender.
        And I expect everyone here knows which choice our current fearless leader would leap at.

  11. Two items –

    Hitler’s mother’s doctor was Jewish. Hitler returned the favor by ensuring the doctor was allowed to remain at his practice.

    There were a lot of people who recognized that the various forms of fascism sweeping Europe in the early Twentieth Century were bad. And those people looked around, and noted that the only group that seemed to be actively resisting the various strains of fascism were the Communists. So they joined the Communists explicitly to fight the fascists.

    Similarly, there were a lot of people who recognized that communism was bad, and the only groups explicitly resisting the Communists were the fascist organizations. So they joined their local fascist groups. Foreign volunteers who joined the German army during World War 2 were usually grouped into SS units (Division Azul was an exception), and it’s believed that a number of the foreigners who joined these units did so expressly to fight the Soviet Communists. However, it should also be noted that purity of their early intentions doesn’t guarantee purity of their later actions, and afaik every SS unit committed war crimes.

    • The things you learn reading these comments. Division Azul? Never heard of it, and I thought I knew a lot about WWII. Looked it up- now I know more.

      • Franco also sent Germany a really big bill for the services of the Blue Division after it came home in 1944. Pissed off the Nazis big time, but they paid. They had no desire to take on the Spanish as they considered the Blue division the equal of any regular German army infantry division. Hitler said the Spanish were the only tough Latins.

  12. If,and it’s a big if,there were civil war version II,it would be a lot longer,and a lot bloodier than version I.
    We have much better weapons,millions would die,including many innocent people.
    The state has planes,drones,missiles and bombs-and they would use them against the “domestic terrorists” as the left is working so hard to label any one to the right of Lenin-with the help of the SPLC’s lies,half truths and obfuscation.
    DHS reports on “domestic terrorists” are nothing more than the regurgitation of SPLC lies,half truths,and obfuscation.
    Too few spoke up when the left began taking over schools,now that the takeover has been complete-for well over a decade,maybe even two or three decades,depending on who you ask,the kids that were ‘educated” by the left are just as bad as those who educated them.
    We have mindless kids-millions of them,and very,very few who think for themselves.
    We have millions of people who believe it is “the government’s job” to take care of them from cradle to grave,and that they deserve free food,housing,medical care and college.
    We have very few who believe in taking responsibility for their own actions-that,along with everything else mentioned above is a direct result of leftist indoctrination in our public schools,combined with endless leftist propaganda spewed by the media.
    The only way to get rid of the left is start replacing every elected position with people who oppose the leftist agenda,start local,move on to state level,then to federal level,that’s the only way to get rid of the left by working within the system.

    • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

      There’s always a question about where the enlisted men/women and lower ranking officers would stand if a new Civil War started.

      • Yeah,that too-there would be some who supported the state,and some who supported the citizens being falsely labeled as “domestic terrorists” for not following the leftists version of a utopian society.
        My guess,and I talk to a lot of active duty and ex military guys and ladies is at least 60% for the citizens,maybe 70%.

        • The vitriol spewed by the Left towards the military and law enforcement isn’t exactly winning the hearts and minds of either.

          • How much of the Black Lives Matter movement is an effort to soften the defenses, slowing LEO reaction times and making them more hesitant to take significant action. It isn’t as if the Revolution has a starting whistle, after all.

            • Strategically speaking, that is stupid. If the cops go down, and the revolutionaries wreak havoc, the resultant backlash will be terrifying.

              • I don’t disagree — but we’re talking about the “Reality-based community” here.

                Tip: proclaiming yourself “reality-based” is equivalent to asserting “I am not a crook” or “I did not have sexual relations with that woman.”

        • At the tip of the spear- ranks to Major in the Army and Marines, 70% is a lowball estimate. Flag ranks don’t count once the revolution starts- it’s the ones with the keys to armories who count. I don’t think SJWs are aware of that.

          In the AF, anyone with a flying billet can think- and whose side do you think that will land them on? Same with Navy pilots.

          Navy subs? They’re going to sit out a revolution. And continue doing what they do. Navy ships? Be a lively discussion in many wardrooms. But given the Navy’s function, most will sit it out. Except for the unique circumstances of the American Revolution and American Civil War (War Between the State) Navies really haven’t played much of a role in civil wars. The American Revolution was a civil war.

          • My own guess is that the Navy would sit it out —- until someone tried to bring in foreign forces or they tried something on their own. At which point the Navy would persuade them this was a Bad Idea.

          • Even some of the flag ranks wouldn’t automatically go along. MI might be ticklish, but the culture of ‘sir, you don’t need to know’ will probably swing against firing on their own.

      • There’s also a question of how many of those weapons they would be able to use because of collateral damage to groups they want to keep and infrastructure they can’t afford to lose…. like farms. When all your food by definition runs along supply lines in enemy territory….

  13. My thoughts on this today are pretty grim (chalk it up to strep and urinary infection), but the greatest problem is losing faith in our system of government. When you no longer trust the government, you look for those who at lease claim to have your back. The result isn’t revolution, but dissolution, if not actual, then in everything but.

    Right now there’s not much faith. Ask how many really think Hillery would do time for various alleged violations of the law, and that percentage is probably going to be low. Ask how many still think it makes a difference voting Republican when they just rubber stamp whatever the Democrats want. If it does make any difference, it’s a slight one, and if that seems overly grim, look to the first paragraph for a likely cause.

    • Putting HRC in jail would be problematic as she remains entitled to her Secret Service detail.

      As for differences between voting Republican and Democrat? There is a difference between voting for a president who will appoint Supreme Court Justices who might read the Constitution and a president whose bench appointees surely will not.

      We’ve King Augeas’ own stables to clean and it will not be done in a single term. We got into this mess by being impatient; being impatient won;t extricate us.

      This nation’s political entities are more Republican than they’ve been in a century, and the Republicans are more conservative than they’ve ever been. We are winning, no matter how far off that finish line appears, and the only way to win is to keep plugging away … and to accept that just as rust never sleeps, so too must defenders of Liberty remain ever vigilant.

      • scott2harrison

        Putting Hillary in jail is probably the smartest thing that the Democrats could do. In that one action they would neutralize the “Democrats are lawless” meme and go a long way towards restoring faith in the rule of law.

        • That would work right up until she and Billyjeff decided to rat out the backstabbers who “railroaded” her.

          Doubt ye for aine minute they not only know where the bodies are buried but have carefully preserved the shovels, picks and back hoes used to bury them? Along with plenty of pictures, document trails and other mementos of shared good times?

          What if HRC decides to cut a deal to eliminate jail time by naming names?

          Doubt not we should soon learn her head injuries were more severe than previously diagnosed and that she was sorrowfully abandoning her campaign and throwing her support to Joe Biden His Time, retiring to a sanitarium for a life of meditation and religious contemplation.

        • Obama despises Hillary as much as anyone on our side does. In 2008, he and his machine just pushed her aside, and his thugs insulted Hillary’s middle age female workers so badly, a lot of them dropped out for good. I won’t try to guess what’s going to happen with her and her people in the next six months.

  14. In an attempt to briefly lighten the mood…

    Of course if the world really were like that, we’d be dealing with a species other than human and perhaps communism would work. Who knows? May be worth an SF story.

    Starship Troopers from the Bug point of view?

    We now return you to the regularly scheduled discussion of the impending Zombie Apocalypse.

  15. Part of the rub, here, is that most of our fellow citizens are good people. Most of them live conservative lives, too, but have been bullied into compliance with the Leftist Agenda. That is why the Fetal Parts Industrial Complex calls itself “Pro-Choice” — it is a way of exploiting the laissez faire inclinations of our fellows. That is also why the MSM suppresses news of the harm engendered by Leftist policies, such as “Universal Pre-K” and “Head Start,” and the congenital corruption plaguing most unions.

    https://www.prageru.com/courses/political-science/left-really-right
    Unfortunately, “privately conservative but publicly liberal” no longer cuts it; we’ve pushed too hard to the margins and lost sight of the boundaries of sanity, so that we have, as Sarah noted at Instapundit “San Francisco neighbor says don’t call thieves ‘criminals’.” [ pjmedia[DOT]com/instapundit/217895/ ] or our schools punishing kids for defending the bullied or Raven-Symoné (who???? I no longer track celebrities) slammed for saying, “That school officer shouldn’t have thrown that girl, but she shouldn’t have kept talking on her phone in class.”

    We can not permit the MSM or the Proglodytes (BIRM) to control the narrative. We need to ask questions which challenge and undermine their narratives. We must expose the “men behind the curtains” manipulation of public opinion and encourage clear thinking.

    • The most sobering factor here is the kids who are backing the school cops, whatever they do. There are many kids, black and well as white, who just don’t care if a roided-up bodybuilder plays dwarf toss with the disruptive student as long as he shuts her the hell up so they can go on with their class.

      • the other side of it is: How much of a d-bag does one have to be that pretty much all your classmates feel you need and deserve a good body slam? It seems she worked good and hard to get her confrontation. And, from what I saw of the video, it looked impressive, but I doubt she got much in the way of bruising from that.

        • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

          Just to add, how many of us have wished to do something similar to an asshole but held back because the price of doing so would be worse than our enjoyment.

          As JP said/implied, it wasn’t “blind support for the Police” but was “she got what she deserved”.

          Note, this is not about “the cop did the correct thing”.

  16. I can’t buy that “the sides are more balanced in the larger society.” Maybe fandom seems one-sided at conventions (especially when many SMOFs are out to actively suppress any attempt by the good guys to gather), but in fandom both locally and online, there is an active and noticeable contingent of libertarians, a view that can hardly even be safely expressed in the “real world”, either in person or in the media. Even those who call themselves conservatives are usually part of the problem.

    What we need to do, I believe, is start by learning from the successes of our opponents. We need to organize drives to increase the turnout of pro-freedom voters, and set up boards that keep out lefty posters the way theirs keep out righties. We need to demonize big lefty donors like Soros, Buffett, and Gates the way they demonize the Koch brothers. And we need to create front groups that seize media attention by creating fake events the way BLM, OWS, and ACORN/OFA do for them — including the use of paid “demonstrators”. Take off the gloves and fight by the rules THEY are already using, or we’ll continue to lose!

    • The Other Sean

      Those tactics largely work for the left because the media doesn’t call them on it. I’m not sure how effective they’d be for those the media despises.

      • Also , they find it a bit easy to pay the like minded or fools to do their protests, whereas anyone likely to favor our side has something they need to do besides “occupying” something or other and any fools so willing would be focused on by the media as opposed to ignored like they are now (except in long shots to show the “crowd”)

      • forgot to add this, but the reason the TEA Party scared the begeezus out of the leftoids, and Establishment/left light Repubs was it was made up of folks who took time from work (these are the productive folks after all) to let it be known they were getting a bit testy over their treatment.

    • This strike me as being approximately as effective as using human wave tactics against the Chinese in Korea would have been.

  17. Unfortunately, I think that a Civil War/Revolution/Sad Puppy Uprising/Whatever is now inevitable. There’s too many people on both sides of the fence who actively want it to happen. In addition, the good people, again on both sides, who *don’t* want it to happen will eventually push back against the persecution – real or imagined – that’s being inflicted on them. You can only push someone so far before they push back. I for one am *not* looking forward to that inevitable push-back.

    But when It does finally happen, I think the SJWs and CHORFs are going to be in for a great big f***ing surprise. Reason being that the SJW/CHORF crowd is expecting military and police to fight for them. The same military who they decry as babykillers and dangerous, unstable psychopaths just waiting to snap, and the same police who they decry as racist murderers at every single opportunity. Yeah, there are probably some True Believing SJWs within the ranks, as well as straight-up bullies who’d relish the chance to oppress just about anyone, but those I suspect are the minority: most LEOs and military would probably say “F*** that” and join the Rebellion. And I’m not just pulling that out of my ass: I know a fair amount of folks who were firmly in the SJW camp when they joined the police and military, and who at the time would have gladly gone to war against Conservatives. Now the majority are still firmly Liberal, but they’re all so sick of being spit on and sh*t on by the SJWs and CHORFs that, if ordered to start rounding up adn exterminating Conservatives, they’d at the very least tell the person giving the orders to go f*** themselves, if not actually switch sides.

    • The reliability of the existing police or military is the reason why every revolutionary government change installs private-allegiance parallel structures of military and police (and courts, etc.).

      Both the KGB divisions and SS divisions were armed to a higher standard than the regular army units specifically so they could overmatch those units should anyone get any ideas. The same thing for the police – the KGB internal security and GeStaPo were authorized to subordinate any pre-existing police units, and both had the ability to call in significant paramilitary and ultimately military backups to put down any police uppityness. And the KGB/SS divisions and KGB/GeStaPo authorities all reported to the party, not the state.

      Any realistic attempt to pursue such foolishness in the US with any chance at success would have to include the creation of such a parallel structure of police and military units answerable only to the new overlords. In the modern era these new loyal units would have an additional complication that no past-era takeover had – the new units would need to gain and keep full authority over all US nukes, as any rogue non-party-loyal launch-key-pair-holders could decapitate the junta.

      • Patrick Chester

        The reliability of the existing police or military is the reason why every revolutionary government change installs private-allegiance parallel structures of military and police (and courts, etc.).

        A civilian national defense force just as powerful as the military?

        (Where have I heard something like that before…?)

  18. Fifteen or so years ago, I remember reading a copy of _Cowboys and Indians Magazine_ at a public library. Now, this publication has as much resemblence to the US West of the 1800s as I do to Audrey Hepburn, and focuses on the CA-DC-NYC-Palm Springs “western” crowd. It had an article about a log mansion built for a bi-coastal lawyer with 30′ ceilings, floor to roof glass windows, all sorts of head shaking stuff right out of the (stereotypical) Gilded Age. At the time I was pissed that someone would waste all that $$ on a place they said (per the magazine) they’d use three or four weeks a year. And that was just the heating and cooling costs, not the upkeep that irked me.

    Thanks be, I’ve outgrown that kind of reaction. I still shake my head at the log mansions (“what’s next, a mink-lined bathtub?”) but the “how dare they have that” feeling is gone. But how many of the younger set have been too indoctrinated to resist the pleasure of the surge of righteous anger?

    • Reality Observer

      I never got annoyed at people having more stuff (so long as they legitimately paid for it).

      Where I get pissed off is when they have more stuff – and make sure that nobody else can get more stuff. There is a special annex in Hell (next to the “faux priests” section) for the Al Gores of the world.

  19. I don’t think this is just a Left vs Right issue, since many of those supposedly on “different sides” are backed by the same masters. This is what eventually happens in all Empires, rot and decay, mainly from the top. There’s no true moral/ethical leadership with any power in our nation. Nobody wants to tackle the big questions, too many third rails, easier to manipulate and make money than sacrifice.

    The wealthy with foresight have deserted and diversified. Their gains are overseas along with their backup residences. They helped create the tsunami, they will flee before before it comes to a blood bath. They have written much of the remaining population off, they refer to the coming die-off as “The Culling”.

    • Wilmer McLean moved his family from Manassas to Appomattox to spare his family from any further battles. The surrender of Lee’s Army was signed in his new home. The stories of a man who moved to a remote Pacific island like Guadalcanal are apparently all apocryphal.

      Your “escape” home is overseas. Among locals. Who are all now unemployed and hungry because the U.S. isn’t importing anything because of the civil war, and isn’t sending tourists because… Do you have a private well armed army at that escape home? With the means to pay them? And feed them through the food shortage? And further- a means to ensure their loyalty? The U.S. props up the worlds economy, including the economy of those who DON’T like us. Being an expatriate American if the revolution comes will be more dangerous then staying and picking sides. Being an outsider anywhere will not be healthy.

  20. Keep in mind that the other side is so Milquetoast that a mob can be held off by a couple of men wielding shotguns. And the problem with Federal response is that if there is one thing Marxists will always fail at, it is logistics.

  21. When the Russian Communists imprisoned Gorbachev and sent troops out in the street to put down any revolt… they didn’t think of how to feed the troops. Old ladies came out with coffee and soup and said, you aren’t going to betray the people, are you?

  22. Having been to war in Vietnam I can tell you that civil war us just god-awful. But what was even worse was the aftermath. The prospect of war scares the hell out of me, the prospect of reprisals afterwards terrifies me, especially in those places where the Marxists win. And they will win at least temporary victories in many places. There you will see blood flow.

    Our gracious hostess is in large measure correct, it is absolutely necessary to begin the process of publicly challenging and discrediting the Left’s mendacious narrative. I used to be worried about not having the mot juste to skewer some leftoid nincompoop. But I found that even if I did not win a discussion my efforts did result in less noise. In war not every shot hits the enemy, in fact most do not. But the fact that shots are being fired serves to force them to keep their heads down.

    A large part of the problem we face today is the tragic fact that we as American have abdicated our civic responsibility to be attentive to and active in local politics. The Left’s insanity at the Federal level is noised broadly by the organs of propaganda. But they are just as active in our County, City and School Board government. Americans have lost the art and science of self government through lack of practice.

    Of all places in which to break the habit of passive acquiescence to the Progressive totalitarian agenda local government is the place best to do it. Of course it helps to educated and informed, not only in the issues at stake, but in the effective means of influencing elected and appointed officials. I have found no better school than the Center for Self Governance at http://www.centerforselfgovernance.com

    Invaluable. Highly recommended that folks get up to speed and form teams to press the Socialist agenda back and drive the Usaian agenda forward.

  23. Enlightening interview (done in 1984) with former KGB agent Yuri Bezmenov: