This, That, The Other, Now With More Robots

girl-320262_1280Good morning Huns, Hoydens, Rapscallions, Dragons and Creatures of ill-repute.  This morning I woke up to Peter Grant’s blog and news of a robot-army. 

This is the money-quote:

They reportedly believe the current backlash against that company is basically ‘manufactured outrage’, deliberately stirred up by Vox Day (whose name is allegedly an expletive there now).  Some have even asserted that the thousands of e-mails complaining about Irene Gallo’s statement aren’t genuine, but the product of a bot-net, a manufactured wave of pseudo-indignation that has no foundation in reality.  Apparently Macmillan and others involved aren’t so sure about that, but it’s a defense the SJW’s are using with might and main.  It’s also apparently why almost none of us have had any acknowledgment of our complaints, not even a notification that our e-mails have been received.  (Some correspondents who requested confirmation when their e-mails were opened have received it;  others have not.)

It took me about ten seconds to make sense of this, and then it clicked.  You see, progressivism, like most closed, self-coherent, all-encompassing faiths not only has its own eschatology that involves their ultimate victory but also involves beliefs about the enemies of their proposed paradise.  Beliefs such as that they’re older, hidebound, “racist, sexist, homophobic” and bound to disappear before the light of “rational” and “scientific” Marxism.

The fact that there is nothing rational or scientific in believing that ultimate human happiness comes from an all powerful state is not important, since the Marxist faith is internally-self-consistent, which means where it meets reality it can ignore it and cut itself off from it, as not being “rational”.  (I.E. not fitting the narrative.)

This bizarre belief that thousands of pissed off fans are just a “robot army” invoked by the Lord of All Evil is one of the ways of pinching off reality and self-insulating so the faith can stay strong.  They know that those who disagree with their progressive view for the future are few, old, and frankly probably too dumb to read for fun.  They know also that VD has some mysterious mastery of the dark forces of computing which they don’t fully get.  Ergo, presto, the annoying supposed evidence they might not be right is enemy action and fakery.

And this is why communists in Europe only went through a brief, confused time after the fall of the USSR before they found their feet in the certainty the unwashed masses of the third world were really what was meant the “proletariat” who was supposed to displace capitalism and also that communism had “never really” been tried.

Self-isolating faiths with narratives about a certain future are difficult to defeat with reality.  Look at how long the followers of the prophet had their nose rubbed in unproductive desert sands, and yet they still remain sure that the future is a world Caliphate.

On the other hand, those of us who are irreverent and see this sort of sideways and upside down find this entire thing funnier than absurdist plays.  For one thing because I have for some time now suspected the extreme left suffers from some form of self-induced Aspergers which leads them to want labels on everything and everything to match the label, to the point they leave no room for humanity.  You can see this in their demand for different genders for every passing thought that doesn’t fit the usual and most commonly applied labels, to the point there are now supposed to be hundreds or thousands of different genders.  (Every man/woman/critter/snail a gender!  Towards a brave new future!)

Then there is their insistence that you can only ever write precisely what you are, though you are of course allowed to write creatures of lesser victimhood, at least according to some, but not creatures of more victimhood.  So, everyone is allowed to write straight white men, because as we know they have no victimhood, ever, but to write a lesbian, one footed, Caribbean, deaf trans-female, you must be one, or you’re stealing her victimhood (it is the precioussss after all.) Also if you are privileged (see, white, hetero, male or any of those, or…) you simply can’t understand “disadvantaged” people so you can write them.

So, despite the fact my gay friends say I can write gay males just fine, I can’t really and I’m stealing their victimhood.  (I’ll never give it back guys.  It’s going into my victimhood dungeon.  mwahahahahahah.  That’s how evil I am.)

And despite the facts that great writers throughout history — Shakespeare included — wrote about and for people they couldn’t possibly be or even anticipate (which is why Shakespeare still speaks to us) the proper way to write and read is to write and read only what we are.

Mind you, this is not a new nor even a novel notion for humans.  It echoes through the ages to Puritan banning of fiction.  There is a certain type of human that can’t comprehend creating or imagining things that don’t exist, and which wishes to restrain others’ creativity to things their robotic-selves can endorse.  (We saw some of this when the anti-gamer gaters started denying that anyone could possibly want to play anything FOR FUN.  That was infantile and silly and playing games should be for enlightenment or consciousness raising or whatever.

The sad part is to give them a voice or allow them to have a say in the fiction or entertainment fields. We end up with things that are no fun at all.

So, understand, I don’t have anything against robots, but I don’t welcome our new robotic overlords.  They don’t like us writing or enjoying imaginative stuff, that’s fine.  Just don’t do it.  We’ll continue with our fun.  You can’t stop us.

Oh, and stop projecting.  WE are not robots.  (Except for those mechanical hands holding a middle finger aloft.  We only built those because I need all ten fingers to type.  They are not me.)

Speaking of other things I’m not.  Apparently at file 770 they’ve now decided I’m ignorant of American political history because I only came here in the mid-80s as an adult, and therefore clearly, not having taken required high school courses in American history, I know nothing of anything before the middle 80s.  (Will someone retrieve my eyes?  I rolled them too far again.)

Never mind the fact I did 12th grade in the US (Stow Highschool in Stow, Ohio) and took not only AP American History, but also Comparative Political Systems. The insularity of these people is on display, as they seem to believe not only is America of no interest outside the US, but also that American publications are arcane and difficult to acquire things.  From the moment I decided on an English Major (9th grade.  It’s required) I had subscriptions to Time, Newsweek and the foreign “news” put out by the US consulate.  IOW I had the same view of American politics that American liberals had.  Later on these were joined by access to the NYT and the Wall Street Journal, usually a week late, in my college’s American Studies Library.

And yes, these were of passionate interest and hotly discussed because — again, this is hard to explain to insular people — America matters more than they think in the world.  Much of the upheavals that shook the world in the 70s were the result of Carter’s strange ideas and weak hand on the tiller.  In fact in many ways the upheavals that shake the world when America loses its mind are far more strongly felt elsewhere.  Or as my mom says “when America sneezes, the world catches pneumonia.” (They don’t understand this, because they have a bizarre dream of America disappearing and the world becoming better off thereby.  This is because they think the world is zero sum.  Never mind.)

Beyond all that, what shocked me about that POV was their apparent assumption that people don’t read or study anything for FUN if they didn’t learn it in school.  I tend to read more or less constantly (it’s a reflex) and am constantly trying to fill in blank parts in my field of knowledge.  American history has been less of a fixation for me than other areas of history until the last five years or so, but let us be rightly understood, HISTORY is a 100 years ago or MORE.  American current events, which are anything from then on, are and have always been a passionate interest, part of my degree (I had a class called American Studies for four years running) and frankly a minor obsession.

One wonders if it’s part of the robotic point of view that they can’t imagine doing anything outside their programing and therefore everyone else MUST be the same.

Speaking of robotic: the cough and auto-immune mess (eczema included) are subsiding some — say halfway back to normal — but some of the meds are… weird.  The steroids make me a little hot on the trigger, something that Lin Wicklund had warned me about and part of the reason I’ve avoided them like poison, because, you know, excitable Latin is already bad enough normally, I don’t need enhanced heat on the trigger. I’m trying to compensate for it.

However the sneaky insidious med is the cough syrup with codeine, apparently at the level that they prescribe for throat-cancer patients (and contemplate this, for the firs three days it barely dented my cough) because I didn’t realize it was doing anything beyond making me sleep.  Until I discovered I was doing things like wandering away from half completed tasks without realizing I was doing it.  Or reading things that weren’t there.  (Though “East Anglian Stormtrooper” was a funny misread in a medieval mystery for “east Anglian Sharpshooter.”)  Or starting to take the bottle of refinisher to my lips, before the smell stopped me (after which I made sure that I kept my water bottle elsewhere and didn’t drink while working on the wood.)

So I’ve been a bit robotic myself.

On the good side, I’m almost 100% sure this was all caused by latex paint.  Yesterday I tried to do a very little touch up on latex paint, and the coughing started, though it hadn’t through the use of turpentine or stain.

Now, I’ve never before been allergic to latex and certainly not latex paint, but due to the surgery, etc, my endocrine system is in flux (that’s a way to put it) and also under stress, and also frankly I’ve never painted as much as I have now at a stretch, which makes it worse, I’m sure.

Anyway, this is actually good news because sons know how to paint walls, while the refinishing of the elaborate Victorian woodwork is more art than science and would have been a right b*tch to try to convey to them.  I’m sometimes mixing more than one stain to get different-age woods to match, and I’m working from 30 years wood finishing experience, plus whatever I acquired following my carpenter-grandfathers around.  It wouldn’t be as easy to get across.  Besides, I have automatic rollers and my guys are guys.  They love automatic anything.

Which brings us back to robots, I guess.  Hopefully I don’t get robotic in-laws, but hey, what happens, happens.

Meanwhile, I’ve been reading KULL fiction, which is mostly indie, and a quick (non-robotic) pro-tip to those of you laboring in that vineyard: if you’re writing genre fiction, make sure the genre elements come in early enough.

What I mean by this is introduce the science fiction, fantasy, or mystery element in the first few chapters, please.  (Preferably the first chapter.) Look, when I’m reading a medieval mystery, I’m not averse to lavish descriptions of medieval England, but by chapter five there should be a crime being investigated, not merely a “tension” and vague mentions of spying, okay?  In this case, I side with the robots.  When I buy something because of what it says on the tin, I want what it says on the tin.

Your book might be a dessert topping and a floor wax, but it should taste good when on the dessert and make the floor shine, not just one or the other.

And that’s all for now, oh, (robotic) Hunnish hordes.  Go forth and enjoy the day and remember your programming: Bring chaos and mayhem according to plan.  No one likes unplanned, random chaos.

Oh, wait.  We do.   Right.  Go forth and plan on unplanned chaos.

I go and have cough syrup.

512 responses to “This, That, The Other, Now With More Robots

  1. Christopher M. Chupik

    They need desperately to believe we’re some kind of micro-minority who somehow wields power vastly out of proportion with our allegedly tiny size. I seem to recall a while back when someone on Twitter (I think, could be wrong) claimed there were only 300 or so GamerGaters and Sad Puppies combined.

    What can a mere 300 do? Let’s go ask Xerxes.

    • Sure; if there are only a few hundred they don’t have to be obvious when they “disappear” us.

      • If there are only a few hundred “disappearing” us is feasible. They’re beginning to realize that they cannot win with reason. All their ideas are proven by reality to be garbage. Their Great Black Hope is the lamest duck in generations, Hillary! can’t even gain enough altitude to crash and burn, and their preferred Republican is being treated like the lone PETA member at a BBQ festival.

        The next President is going to be from the Reagan wing of the GOP and, unlike the Gipper, won’t have to compromise with the Bush wing to win. That likely means a generation of strong American leadership, which will go a long way toward making Progressivism the joke it deserves to be.

        • Speaking of bots and She Who Must Be Obeyed …
          Is It Just Me or Does Hillary Talk Like a Robot?
          http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/419738/it-just-me-or-does-hillary-talk-robot-fred-schwarz

          I caught a portion of the speech from Saturday and wondered if the programmers of the Hillarytron3.6 were the same folk who built the Obamacare sites.

          They can disappear us in their customary way: closing their eyes, sticking their fingers in their ears and chanting the proglodyte hymn, “neener, neener.”

        • Altitude? They seem stuck on the runway. She’s on launce number what now?

          Also I do so hope you are right about the next resident of 1600 Penn.

          • launce? Launch even. egad.

          • I’m fairly confident about the next election. The American people are pretty reliable in “changing” direction every 8 years. The only times it hasn’t happened since Eisenhower are when the incumbent is truly incompetent (Johnson and Carter) or the one three term streak with Reagan. Bush I represented a rival wing of the GOP to Reagan’s (AKA today as “the establishment”) and reverted the GOP to its post-war type. That’s a large part of why he was only a 1 term President.

            Obama won reelection because of extraordinary turnout and support among black voters and a year of shenanigans interfering with conservative organizing. Hillary! isn’t going to get either of those boosts. She’ll increase women turnout, but almost as many will be voting against her as for her. The rest of the country wants a new direction, and the current GOP front-runners offer that.

            • To fit in with what you said, a popular president can give a boost to the VP (Bush in 88; Nixon in ’60 and Gore in ’00 came very close).
              Also, note the lack of depth and talent on the Dem field. Even Hil is running a pretty lackluster, obligatory “going through the motions” campaign. Any true stars the Dems have will be sitting this one out, saving their capital for a better chance.

              • Biden – Hillary 2016 – Because Grandpa and Grandma will give you all the candy your little heart desires.

                Sadly – there’s quite a few who’d believe it.

            • So, we are absolutely and definitely ruling out President Obama III? Because, you know, laws are not for him.

              • I’ve played that scenario out in my head. I can’t figure out who would get Barry into cuffs first: his Secret Service detail, the Old Guard and USMC Silent Drill Team, or their friends with the tanks down in Quantico.

                • This idea seems to roll around every time we have a lame duck president. It’s just as unlikely as ever.

                  • Heck, Biden would laugh in his face were Obama to propose it.
                    That thing you need to become dictator, he ain’t got.

                  • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                    Nod, for something like that to work, the President would have to have strong support from the military, strong support from Congress, strong support from the News Media, etc.

                    I’m no longer sure that the News Media would accept him trying that stunt.

                  • The ONLY reason I agree with you is Barry is packing a whole lotta nothing in his BVDs. He would if he could, but he’s looking at a fat pension, bennies, speaking gigs, ghostwritten books, etc. None of which he gets if he tries and fails to stay in a job he clearly doesn’t enjoy. And if he tries it, there are any number of patriots that would not let the vision of Biden in charge, or giving him a martyr’s legacy, keep them from dusting off the sniper rifle. (In my opinion, ok, NSA? That was a prediction, not a threat.)

                • As a former Marine, I’d bet on the MSG guys at 8th and I. (The guys you see at the base of the steps of his helos, and holding umbrellas for him in the rain. Different from the band and drill team guys.)

                  • I figure 8th and I would pretty much empty out once the news hit. I think traffic would be the biggest factor in how quickly Barry was frogmarched out of the White House.

              • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                I doubt that the Democrats would stand for him doing that. I’m thinking they’ll be glad when he’s out of office. [Smile]

              • Nonsense! His whole second term strategy has been predicated on getting out of town before those chickens come home to roost.

                The real question is: where will he retire to? Tehran, Moscow or Beijing?

                • Martin L. Shoemaker

                  Early on, I wondered if his strategy was to transfer as much power as possible to international bodies, and then “campaign” for UN Secretary General. Moving up has always been his career strategy, and he has made no effort to conceal that he prefers international power to US power.

                  Now, with as little respect as he has in the international community, I don’t think that could work. The bloom is off that rose.

                  • And yet the stench of its organic fertilizer remains.

                    • Bad natural fertilizer, the stuff that has a good chance of depositing weeds and/or burning your plants.

                      Properly made fertilizer smells like… well, dirt. Generally you pile it up, let the poop “cook” itself for a year, stir it again, and it’s good fertilizer.

              • I figure that this summer will have mass riots and cop killings. Obama will declare martial law, ‘for the children’. Around December, he will ‘temporarily’ suspend elections.

                • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                  Do you really think the Military would back him?

                  • Given how much of the senior leadership he’s purged it just might.

                    • Not just senior leadership; turfing out anyone not PC, and putting in that little idea to let illegal aliens join.

                    • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                      I doubt the “rank and file” officers and men of the Military would do so.

                      IE the Joint Chiefs of Staff say “Obama Is Still President” and nobody obeys the Joint Chiefs of Staff. [Evil Grin]

                  • Not for a skinny instant. He can fire all the brass he wants. The rank and file would be on him like a chicken on a June bug.

                    • As I said elsewhere, he’s working on that, too. There are multiple reports of people of all rank being punished for not being PC, the reduction in all ranks of current soldiers, and the proposal (implemented via EO) to allow illegal aliens to join.

          • If we are going to use an airline analogy, she has returned to the gate twice for repairs and is still trying to taxi out to the runway.

            • Should we get an air start for her?
              I think the pushback stuffed her butt out in the taxiway, and the APU is dead, but they keep expecting her to start and fly with no issues.

        • From your mouth to G-d’s Ears.

        • I hope and pray you are correct. I have just about given up on the Republican Party. The Country Club set wants to tell the rest of us how things will be decided. They have the big bucks to donate to their preferred progressive Republican.

          I have seen my world crash in the last 8 years.

          • Money doesn’t correlate to electoral wins any more than it correlates to economic health. The country club set need voters to show up at the primaries. If Jeb’s recent performance is any indication, that simply isn’t going to happen. I’m betting the nominee will be Walker, Cruz, or Rubio, and all three are going to run hard toward the Reagan coalition (I really want somebody to point out that the companies that drove the economy of the 1990’s – Cisco, Apple, Microsoft, etc. – received significant investments during the 1980’s. In other words, Reganomics was responsible for the Clinton Economy.)

            We do need leadership in the GOP, Boehner and McClellan don’t cut it. Maybe they can be loyal lieutenants, but they probably need to be prodded into genteel retirement.

            • Not a big fan of Rubio, but he would be a huge improvement over Jeb (who is utterly unelectable) or Huckabee.

              • I’m willing to forgive Rubio for that Gang of 8 immigration bill; compromise is one of the ideals of the Senate, everyone is allowed one truly spectacular cock-up, he appears to have learned his lesson, and it went nowhere so no harm was done. Outside of that I haven’t seen anything that makes me reject the guy outright. He’s not at the top of my list just because I think there are others who could better articulate the conservative position. But my list isn’t exactly written in stone. Maybe a rather thin mud.

                Right now the only way to get onto my “no way, no how, I’ll vote for Hillary over you” list is to attack a Republican. Attack Democrats all the live-long day, that’s what they’re there for. Say you’ll do a better job of defeating Progressives than the other Republican candidates. But if you attack a Republican, you’re dead to me.

                • Is Huckabee a Republican? How about Ben Carson or Donald Trump? Rand Paul?

                  I draw the line at attacking Republicans from the Left, because once in office i expect it to recur. Attacking a RINO for being a RINO and explaining why the proposed policy is wrong is something I can tolerate.


                  I LIKE Rubio’s ad attacking the Hillary speech (yesterday) because it is swift, it is effective and it reminds everybody how obnoxiously artificial she is.

                  As Power Line’s John Hinderaker observes: “I doubt that one person in five can stand to listen to her talk for more than a minute.”

                  • Huckabee, Carson, and Trump aren’t going to come within sniffing distance of the nomination, there’s no reason to attack them. Attacking policies is fair, but there’s no reason to attach a candidate’s name to it.

                    If a candidate wants to attack someone, Hillary is a perfect target. In fact, I intend to use a candidate’s attacks on her as an audition for the main event. One of the reasons Obama won was the fact that the media ruled all attacks on him off-limits and the GOP candidates went along with that. I can’t wait to see a candidate answer media questions about their attacks on Hillary with “I believe that Candidate Clinton is fully capable of handling herself in the rough and tumble of American politics. Do you think she needs special protection because she is a woman?”

            • Note, also, that the Clinton Economy was moribund until 1994 even though they inherited a recovering economy in third quarter 1992. Oddly, it was only reported in the NY Times business section, never the front or editorial pages. That type of error induced the NY Times to take corrective action which has resulted in significant turnover in the business section.

              • To be accurate, the Clinton Economy began to grow starting on November 02, 1994, as soon as the mid-term election returns rolled in. When Capital gains taxes were cut the Stock Market acceleration increased.

            • RealityObserver

              I’m pretty sure it was an unintentional slip – but “McClellan” was so appropriate for the Senate Majority “Leader” we are saddled with.

              Thank you for my ROFL of the evening…

              • This is Jeff, believe me, there was nothing unintentional about it.

              • It’s not unintentional. He got a new name after the DHS funding debacle. He could have won that fight simply by using the Reid maneuver to end filibusters to conference agreements.

        • I dunno. Some of this bunch might be kinda hard to disappear…

    • Go now traveller and the waiting Authors tell that here, obedient to….

      oh, hell. Obedient? Us? Mwahahahahaha!!!!!!!

      • And undisciplined and barely restrained rabble. Which is why I love you.

        • We loves you too sweetie. Now take a shot of that syrup and get your sorry Portagee butt healthy. Liberty is less than two weeks away. Over 700 in attendance and I suspect around half have little to any knowledge of Sad Puppies, or the ongoing turf war between shiny new indie and those hidebound dinosaur trad/pubs. Cepting for Baen of course. I always look forward to Toni’s Baen traveling slide show with eager anticipation.

          • Even if LibertyCon includes con crud, the A/C should be pretty nice for Sarah. Plus all the allergen plants are totally different in Tennessee. 🙂

          • Perhaps the lovely, but evil space princess could work up a bunch of “I went to LibertyCon and all I got was Sarah Hoyt’s crud” t-shirts.

            I denounce myself.

        • RealityObserver

          I know you love me, Sarah. The feeling is reciprocated.

          Darn it, though, there are times I can’t have fun here, like chiding you for neglecting a trigger warning on your post. You gave me a flashback of heading for a sliding glass door at high speed, with a long drop onto concrete waiting for me on the other side.

          (Oh. Triggered by the reference to food products as floor wax. I don’t know about dessert toppings; butter, though, makes a fantastic floor wax. Ask my daughter…)

      • We obey some things. The laws of physics. Most Some Ocass When we think about it.

    • I believe you are summarizing their opinions of white males. Admittedly not a micro-minority, but still a minority, yet our vast conspiracy and influence has held every other ethnic group down for millennia.
      No one considers that the Anglo-Saxon civilization of private property rights, common law and the Christian concepts of mercy and charity had anything to do with it. Of course not, since they believe all cultures are ‘relative’ and ‘equally valid’ then the only answer *must* be the white male conspiracy.

      • Well, that and their assumptions that (1)all non-whites are politically on the same side and (2) men and women are on different sides, are bogus. Asians are already bolting from the Democrat death cult, Hispanics may well do the same, and men and women normally form social bonds stronger than politics.

    • *Obligatory 300 quote*

    • Their sample size is based off of confrontation. Nobody calls them on being rude, then nobody finds them rude.

      Actually had a conflict with someone over a parking space, when she’d managed to block people out of it for nearly five minutes while her friends came to park*. I don’t know if she realized that using threatening body language against someone in a vehicle is really stupid, but apparently it worked.
      Until the two horrible *****es decided that no, a college girl who looked like she’d faceplanted in a tackle box did not get to force a pregnant woman and a gal with a broken foot to keep driving, especially not when they were aware that she had to have been doing it for several minutes already. (we looped back around because we saw the pickup pulling out of that spot and hoped they may have had a few friends, because there were two cars waiting for the spot before)

      * The funny thing? She was trying to make sure they got a parking spot near the front…. of a place where you have to walk at least two miles if you’re not just getting something at the gate. The walk from the nearest parking lot to the gate is twice as far as from the farthest parking spot to the nearest parking lot!

      • ” a college girl who looked like she’d faceplanted in a tackle box ”

        *snort* I didn’t expect to read my fathers phrase for such people here.

        • I can’t remember where I heard it, but for some people– seriously, have they ever HEARD of artistic placement? Taste? Accentuation?

        • That was Dad’s opinion of face piercings, and I giggled reading it here too. He thought nose piercings a great vector for infections.

          Me, nipple piercings personally give me the heebie-jeebies.

          • I once took a live drawing class and when one of the models failed, the professor of another class posed for us. Shadow, you couldn’t see his… er… for the hardware. I mean it was that densely packed. He clinked when he walked.
            Perhaps because I came from a household where I had to fight to have my ears pierced. (Dad: “why do you want to mutilate yourself?”) I had the sort of instinctive reaction where the parts I don’t have were trying to crawl into my body.

            • ……..*horrified expression at the mental image*

              I remember my younger brother’s reaction on seeing penile piercings – he and my brother were channel surfing looking for a movie to watch, and stumbled on a channel showing some porn, since it was really late at night. I heard them both go ‘AUUUUUUGH’, prompting me to run into the room, from where I’d been making snacks for us.

              “What?! What happened?!”

              “That!” they pointed at the screen, showing a BDSM scene involving the guy’s ..uh… tackle… being attached to a hoop…

              “WHY?! WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT?!?!?!?!” both my brothers demanded. Heck, I don’t know!

              We turned off the TV, noped out of the room, and went to play Diablo instead. “It won’t give us nightmares.”

              • That’s funny. Diablo was the ONLY thing I know that gave younger son nightmares (he would watch the friend who was living with us at the time play games a lot). We eventually determined that it was the music, not the images, that did it, because it happened when he wasn’t even watching, but the game was on in the next room a couple of times.

            • So glad you shared that.

            • If his kit had that much accoutrement I expect he was heavily into self-abuse; I certainly cannot imagine anybody, female or male, desiring to have it poked into one of their orifices.

            • I may have to hook the brain bleach up to an IV at this point.

            • Maybe I should not have even started reading this thread, since I got to it so late, because now I’m nearly doubled over, with my legs crossed and my hands over my crotch in a vain attempt to ward off the pain of that visual.

          • I cannot recall in over sixty years on this planet haveing met a single person and thinking “Oh, lovely nose; what it needs is a gold stud sticking out of the side!” or “Such lovely eyes; shame there isn’t a small gold hoop through the brow.”

            Nor have I ever found myself gazing into a partner’s crotch and thinking “This would be a nice place if there was some added decoration.”

            Over the years I have reluctantly acknowledged that appropriately chosen ear decorations help define a person’s face and the angle of their jaw, that a suitable necklace can provide visual definition of throat and/or cleavage. Much beyond that (for example, no navel is enhanced by sticking a tie-pin through it) jewelry/body piercing seems gratuitous and expressive of underlying issues I would rather not know of.

            Why anybody thinks stretching their ear lobes in order to maintain an open hole the size of a quarter is a good idea thoroughly baffles me. It isn’t that it is repulsive, it just makes no sense.

  2. Christopher M. Chupik

    “So, everyone is allowed to write straight white men, because as we know they have no victimhood, ever, but to write a lesbian, one footed, Caribbean, deaf trans-female, you must be one, or you’re stealing her victimhood (it is the precioussss after all.) ”

    I learned today that Rachel Dolezal was upset over The Help, because it was a white woman making money off a black woman’s story.

    No comment.

    • Someone who is as insane as Bruce Jenner.

    • IIRC, she also told a Hispanic girl from Spain that she didn’t look Hispanic enough to be able to share her Hispanic experience. Oh, projection, what a bizarre psychological mechanism….

      • I suspect this is true of a lot of the civil rights elite, many of whom are from rather obviously mulatto rather than black families, which count as black only under the “one drop of blood rule.”

        The king of this is of course Obama, who has no African-American descent, as he is descended from a non-American African and a white American. And it’s obvious from his facial features that his father’s Kenyan family was mostly Arab, rather than Black African.

        • The term they used in Trinidad and Tobago for someone of mixed Black and White heritage was “red.” When the rest of the U.S. was going on about the first “black” president, my wife and I enjoyed confusing people by saying he was red.

        • RealityObserver

          The other thing is that he has no experience of the realities of existence in the places that are dominated by Black “culture.”

          Which is why he’s acceptable to those who dominate the Left – he has vast experience of their privileged existence.

          • The amazing thing is that he manages to be this ignorant after having been part of Chicago politics for a decade or so. He must have spent all his time in Chicago in a very well-protected bubble, never actually talking to anyone poor during his time as a “community organizer.”

            • The Other Sean

              You don’t really think his type of community organizers spend time interacting with the community, do you? No, its all fund raisers and meetings with politicians and talking to “community leaders” and speaking to the press and having meetings with other community organizers. Then the community gets to suffer from what they’ve contrived, or be given another “grievance against the main” because the latest miracle has been failed to get funding/approval, or in rare instances, actually benefit. While money flows into the right pockets along the way, of course.

              Excuse me, was I wearing my cynic hat?

              • Because, of course, he’s an elite community organizer, he was being groomed for higher offices, so he couldn’t be allowed to meet with the street-level operatives (who in lower-class black neighborhoods in Chicago would be flat-out, lliterally-murderous thugs) and risk getting his own almost literally-lily-white hands dirty. He never mixed with anyone but the rich black elite — the social class from which came his equally-incompetent and arrogant wife, Michelle.

              • Frankly, I think I need to get a better model cynic hat, though mine has been getting fortified here for a while. But I’m still too trusting that people are honest, until I have direct confirmation that they have been dishonest. It still jars me way too much to find out that I’ve been lied to on things of importance.

                • SAme here, although I don’t know if becoming more cynical is a good thing or not– the “everyone does it” excuse is far, far too popular among those looking for an excuse.

          • You saying he never had to worry about getting mugged while walking home? Never had to put the kids to sleep in the bathtub lest some gangbanger’s bullets went astray? Never had to negotiate an obstacle course of human wreckage sleeping on the sidewalk?

            I do recall reading about a visit home to Chicago during which the Secret Service had to negotiate territorial matters with neighbor Louis Farrakhan’s patrols.

            • I do recall reading about a visit home to Chicago during which the Secret Service had to negotiate territorial matters with neighbor Louis Farrakhan’s patrols.

              And being the weenie Obama is, I’m sure it actually involved “negotiation,” rather than “Hey. Fruit-Loops of Islam? Don’t get in our way and you’ll get to live.”

        • I can’t even remember what actress it was, but there’s one with a Spanish last name that I didn’t even realize was “black” until she did a big to-do during Black History Month. Guess I’m just not finely calibrated or something.

        • Larry Luftwaffe

          If you ignore this, anyway.

          • Actually not much need to ignore it. His family in Kenya identifies as “Arab” which is borne out by their features and which constitutes “high class” there.

      • she’s not alone. textbook manufacturers have been told that blond Hispanics do not count toward the Hispanic quota.

    • How dare you mock her transracial status.

    • That terrible hissing sound is all the lawyers jumping off the unemployment bench on behalf of everyone ever denied anything by affirmative action programs. Because they were #wrongskin.

      Who do you cheer for in that debacle? Which grocery chain can supply enough popcorn?

      • It occurred to me back in the 1980’s, when I first learned how affirmative action program worked, that it would be fairly easy to game them by pretending to be of a “protected” race. Liberals mocked me for that and told me that I didn’t realize how much blacks were suffering, and how bad it would be to be perceived as black.

        Yeah.

        • Nowadays you will be told that it’s white privilege to have not have someone question your competence by saying you must be AA.

          • What does being an alcoholic have to do with white privilege?

            • I don’t know. Every time I hear “White Privilege” I want to drink.

              • Patrick Chester

                I knew there was a downside to my never really liking alcoholic beverages.

                • I drink only rarely, a 375 ml bottle of something sweet sipped at a length. Once every couple of months, if that.

                  Reading the latest bizarre thing of transracial, I don’t think my liver could survive the heavy drinking necessary to blot out the stupid.

                  So instead, I shared the painful stupid with my clannies. ‘That’s fucking dumb’ was the mildest reply I got back.

              • That is about as bad as taking a shot every time Obama says I, me or my in a speech. Wake up at 8:00, Surf the web, drink a shot every time someone mentions white privilege, pass out drunk by 9:30.

          • Which is of course a “privilege” created by the existence of Affirmative Action. Something else I pointed out in the 1980’s, and was told by campus liberals that I just didn’t understand when I did.

        • Long before that (70’s and probably 60’s) my one grandfather was getting jobs as an Indian under affirmative action. He didn’t have a drop of Indian blood in him, he was pure Black Irish, but of course the Irish aren’t a minority, so because he was black-haired, dark skinned, and had high cheekbones and little facial hair (grew a good mustache, but never shaved, he just had half a dozen chin hairs he would pluck) employers would mark him down as Indian to fill their minority quota.

        • Oh, you haven’t seen anything yet. Just wait until they update the preferences for sexual preference?

          How are they going to prove that someone claiming to be gay isn’t? have them redecorate the admissions office?

  3. I think here: “but let us be rightly understood, HISTORY is a 100 years ago or less.”

    Perhaps you meant History is 100 years ago or *MORE.*

    • Yes. Fixed on re-read. For some reason some typos don’t show until you publish. Sigh.

      • Most common to authors. You see what you meant instead of what your lying fingers typed. Why a decent first reader is a prize beyond price.
        Someday I aspire to become one.

        • That’s true of nonfiction writing too. I’m a pretty terse and ‘grammar nazi’ writer in my day job, but sometimes I’m floored at what things a proofreader finds that the brain just ‘fixes on the fly’. And nearly all my colleagues have the same experience.

          • Bingo! My colleagues and I always joke that we have to leave one typo in to make the people higher up the chain of document clearance feel useful.

            • Indeed! When I was drawing building plans in Hilo, I always left out some of the “brace 3 and 4 ways” foundation braces just so they could use their red pencils. Helped keep them happy and they would then ignore the really radical elements of my designs.

            • Heinlein discusses this about editors in Stranger in a Strange Land.
              I called it the dog urine effect. If you leave something for the boss to p*ss over, then when the report comes by his desk again, he will smell it, recognize his own ‘scent’ and be happy with it.

          • During my two stints (so far) at a US Army course that requires students to write various reports, I always tell my students that, should they finish a given report in well under the allotted time, they need to take at least 10 minutes doing something completely unrelated to that report, then go back and proofread their report. It’s amazing how many errors they catch after even 10 minutes of doing something else, once they read what they actually wrote, as opposed to reading what they intended to write.

        • Happens all the time in IT. The “Second Set of Eyeballs” is the most powerful debugging tool ever devised.

          • Standard policy in the nuclear power world. Author, Reviewer, Verifier, Editorial Reviewer, and Manager………..

          • My boss at my old job would send me an e-mail with, “Take a look at this,” in the subject. I’d read it, send it back with corrections highlighted in red. One day, rather ticked off, he yelled at me to stop sending his e-mails back with corrections, he’d already sent them out to prospective customers. In front of pretty much the entire office, I told him that he might have more luck turning those prospective customers into paying customers if he’d let just about anybody else in the office proofread what he was sending before he sent it. He and I never really did get along after that…

          • Sometimes it doesn’t get that far. Sometimes as soon as you go to explain to the other developer the issue, you figure it out. (This is why the correct response when someone stops mid-explanation and says, “Never mind,” the correct response is “Glad I could help.”

            Some people even practice “rubber-duck debugging”, where you try to explain it to a rubber duck before bothering your co-workers.

      • Bah. I type words completely unrelated to the content of the rest of the sentence, sometimes.

    • My favorite history prof said anything younger than a century was not history, but news.

      • I had that as fifty years, but that was when people’s lives were shorter (another sin of Capitalism, forcing people to live longer, healthier lives. The bastards.)

        It takes longer now to kill off all those who recall what actually happened and to embed the narrative, as Shadowdancer reported witnessing done in the Deutsche Demokratische Republik. This is one reason the Climatistas are pushing policies which can be relied upon to shorten human lifespans.

        • Interestingly, Weber and Flint have both pointed that up as a downside to prolong in the Honorverse: you have to wait so much longer for those pesky people who remember a different system to die!

      • to the SJWs and leftoids in general, anything in their past (more than the last month or so) is ancient history, no matter how embarrassing or criminal (What difference, at this point, does it make?), but anything related to the rest of us no matter how tangentially related, can be pointed to with alarm and used to club us in the public forum.

    • Randy Wilde

      Under the Orwellian blueprint of “he who controls the present controls the past” anything more than 100 years is fantasy, having been subjected to repeated rewrites.

      We may not be there yet, but isn’t that at least part of what the battle (war?) is about?

      • RealityObserver

        Yep. I don’t think that Sarah’s detractors were so much incensed that she had read and internalized US history – it’s that she had not read and internalized “The Peoples’ History.”

        • The Other Sean

          Howard Zinn must roast in hell.

          • I rather hope Zinn is in Heaven, sitting at G-D’s right hand.

            That would mean he had recognized the enormity of his sins and truly repented. In Hell he would be complaining that the Demons didn’t have weekends off, paid vacations, on-site daycare and strict workplace rules.

            • RealityObserver

              I would say I sense a story idea there. Except I have the nagging feeling that somebody has already done it. Anyone remember better than I?

              • Terry Pratchet’s FaustEric comes to mind, but it isn’t quite like the last couple of comments described. It’s more of a description of how bureaucracy is hell, than anything else…

                I’d suggest that you should take the idea and run with it, regardless of what has come before!

  4. Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

    IMO the Left has this delusion that the People want what the Left wants to give them and if the People say that they don’t want it, they must have been “brain-washed” by some Evil Master-Mind.

    Thus we see Lefties screaming about Rush Limbaugh, Pat Robertson and other “Great Monsters” who are leading the People astray.

    Now we see the SJW screaming about the Great Monster Vox Day sending out his robot legions.

    Morons.

    • I got (in my still-lib days) several recommendations for “What’s the matter with Kansas?” by Thomas Frank. Unfortunately, the type of socio-economic reductionism practiced in that book was so familiar from Euro leftists writings that I soon only could stifle a yawn.

      It really grates on the New Class/Anointed/New Clerisy when the sheeple develop their own ideas about prioritizing their concerns 😉

    • The Other Sean

      In reality much of population wants a tiny fraction of what the Left’s offering (or none at all), a smaller chunk wants evil-sized portions, and a teeny, tiny smidgen wants it all. (I was going to say good-sized, but evil-sized seems more appropriate.)

  5. I think you meant history is 100 years ago or *more*, not less.

    SJW types always project, so when the accuse others of being bots, they are telling us that’s what they’ve been doing.

    File 770 and other SJW types also have long struck me as singularly insular. They really do not know very much about the real world, and so much of what they do ‘know’ is actually false.

  6. Okay, so the answer here is make phone calls and send actual letters. Oh, and “fansign” pictures saying “don’t call us Nazis”/

  7. I grew up on “When America sneezes the rest of the world has the flu”, so I know all about the massive impact America has on the rest of the world.

    Also having come here from elsewhere as an adult, I can see *why* y’all are so insular: you don’t have any *reason* to look elsewhere. Right now there are precisely two nations that have even a remote possibility of posing an existential danger to the USA, and neither has been focused in that direction since the late 1980s. If all international trade suddenly stopped, America has the capacity to go back to fully self-reliant (it would hurt like hell, but it’s possible).

    Compare that to Australia, which has roughly the population of Texas in a nation with about the land area of the lower 48. While any invader would quickly discover the outback is impossible to control, close by nations like Indonesia and Malaysia do pose a real threat. So Australians have, at least in my experience, tended to pay close attention to what’s going on outside their borders – and Australia is an *island* nation: any kind of invasion *must* cross ocean to reach it. (There is a reason the Oz default for “international” is “overseas”).

    The uber-insularity of the SJW crowd is something else. So far, all of them have had ridiculously easy, privileged lives and have never seen anything like hard work or real hardship. No wonder they can’t imagine anyone with a different perspective.

    • EVERYTHING that Kate said. Times a billion.

      • Ah, what do you two know? /sarc

      • But, but, you’re a minority female (never mind that you may not be a minority when you live in, oh, your own nation). How could you be such a traitor (never mind that you can’t be a traitor to something you never professed loyalty to in the first place)?

        If you’re so much wiser than Americans by virtue of being foreign, how can you be wrong according to their religion? 😛

        Okay, I’ll be quiet whil trying to find a place to shelter from the incoming intercontinental ballistic carp. 🙂

    • Precisely. I daresay that the life of Irene Gallo and her ilk is extremely insular and privileged, even if they have traveled outside the country. Once there, they meet and mingle with pretty much the same kind, and come back with some nice souvenirs, but actually experience the lives of others less privileged for a meaningful length of time? Horrors!

      • Sure they have, Celia, but they haven’t really traveled around their own country… They probably think living in NYC, and flying to LA and Chicago, maybe with side trips to San Diego and Atlanta because they have to deal with the unwashed masses at dragoncon and comicon, is a board experience and knowledge of the US.

    • The greatest generation are all or mostly passed on.
      The heros of the Vietnam conflict are still to this day looked on with distain.
      Our all volunteer military is somewhat revered as it is intuitively obvious that they stand between us and evil, but at the same time belittled by many with “so you couldn’t get a real job.” And that evil is to the ever so special SJW far away and not a tangible reality in their every day lives. The 9/11 wakeup call has faded into the past and the small nudges like the Boston Marathon or Ft. Hood get explained away by an administration and complicit media with a far different agenda.
      They are busily rewriting our history even as we speak, and force feeding it to our kids. The founding fathers were all evil slave holders, Lincoln was a democrat, FDR saved us from the depression, our military lost in Vietnam. It’s all about the narrative after all.

    • Christopher

      Why can’t I “+1” this? I wanna +1 it.

    • BTW Kate – off topic.

      I dunno if you’re accepting recommendations yet for S(R)P 4 – (Sad robot puppies) – but netflix “Daredevil” series certainly is deserving of a shot.

      • Started out very good, but it’s starting to drag. imo

      • RealityObserver

        Dang. A 2014 movie (yes, anime, so what?) Just barely; first released the second week of December.

        “Expelled From Paradise.” It’s on NetFlix streaming, so available even to very limited budgets…

        The usual EMWV here…

        • RealityObserver

          Oh, “trigger warning” too – brief (female) nudity at the beginning.

          • Is it really nudity if she is in briefs?

            • lonejanitor

              Rie Kugimiya is in it. If she’s nude she’ll punch you before the camera sees anything, so it evens out.

            • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

              It’s hard to tell if she was wearing briefs or not. If she was, the briefs were the same color as her body.

              • RealityObserver

                I don’t think she had briefs… Who wears briefs under a swimsuit?

                What has me scratching my head is why she lost the suit in the purely virtual world at the start of the movie – then kept her fancy suit on when she did essentially the same thing towards the end? Was it because one was virtual, and the other was real? (I would think it would logically work the other way around, wouldn’t it?)

                Or maybe it was just that the second time around, she was technically in a sixteen year old body – and someone in Legal told them they didn’t want a “pedophile pornography” dust-up.

                Not that I think the nudity was at all necessary in the first place; and I wish the “trope” would die for body “armor” that doesn’t cover all of the most vulnerable points. (I remember one of the most humorous parts of “Number of the Beast” was when Zeb and Jacob were discussing ERB…)

                Didn’t ruin the movie for me, as I adjust for these things, just as I adjust for the unconscious Leftist bias you get from 99% of Hollywood productions even when they are trying to not be preachy.

            • Check with Legal.

      • Not yet – SP4 will be opened for recommendation after this year’s awards are announced. I don’t want detract from them.

    • Ditto what Shadowdancer said.

    • Have you read the Marsden books “tomorrow when the war began”?

      One of the things I used to like about Tor, was the amount of Austalian SF they’d import. The stuff is amazing.

      One of the great crushing disappointments of the “multicultural” movement in the 90s (oh, the left are such liars!) was the promise of finally getting to read more great stories from Elsewhere. Of course it was nothing like that : just an excuse to run down the US

  8. reddragonhawk

    Waitwaitwait. I thought Europeans were so much smarter and more sophisticated than we dumb hick ‘mericans. Since last time I checked Portugal is in Europe, Sarah is actually *more* qualified to comment on American history than most of those hacks criticizing her. Plus being a wise latina… sounds to me like the anti-sad puppies crowd needs to check their privilege.

    • RealityObserver

      See a comment above (someone else, my mouse wheel is out). Sarah has faded too much to have the “authentic Hispanic experience.” That comes only with some complex and ever shifting mixture of genes, currently activated melanin, upbringing, current associates, etc., etc., and ad nauseam…

  9. The Canadian equivalent to the “when America sneezes the rest of the world has the flu” was verbalized by former Canadian Prime Minister Pierre Trudeau in 1969. Speaking to the National Press Club in Ottawa, he said that living next to the U.S. “is in some ways like sleeping with an elephant. No matter how friendly or temperate the beast, one is affected by every twitch and grunt.”

  10. BobtheRegisterredFool

    Bot-net is IT jargon. As used, it in no way means that we are actually robots.

    Computer criminals sometimes break into and take control of very computers. A large number thus controlled can be used to break into or harm other computers or networks.

    A distributed denial of service attack uses a bot-net to send a lot of messages to a particular site or computer. It becomes inaccessible because it is receiving more traffic than it is set up for.

    So here, they are postulating a Secret Master of Puppies who has broken into the email accounts of many people. Or made a bunch of email accounts. The Secret Master of Puppies, Dan Stevens, 17, of Cabana Beach Wyoming, then automated the creation of these emails. Hence why it is appropriate to send all complaints of Gallo to the spam filter.

    There hasn’t been a lot of time for snail mail to show up. ‘Bot-net’ is a delaying tactic, probably motivated by the belief that regular mail will not substantiate the emails.

    • I know what bot-net means. Remember my husband is in IT. It just amused me.

      • BobtheRegisterredFool

        Sorry, I forget/didn’t notice/never put the clues together.

      • RealityObserver

        Amused me, too. Show me the proof of a thousand or so identical emails.

        Unless it is extremely sophisticated, an email-bot attack cannot generate a large number of meaning-same, wording-different messages.

        • BobtheRegisterredFool

          Yeah, I figure Dan Stevens has to be pretty good at AI to generate all the apparent content at Evil League of Evil sites. The real impressive thing is the novel generator. It has a pretty nice range, I just wish he would run it more often.

    • Christopher M. Chupik

      So, by accusing us of using a bot-net, does this mean they’re accusing of a crime?

      They really don’t know when to quit while they’re behind, do they?

      • the motto is “Dig Deeper, We have to prove there is no bottom!”

        • You know the Three Laws of Sociodynamics?
          1. Conservation of misery
          2. Every process strives for the maximum degree of idiocy
          3. The absolute moral nadir cannot be reached in a finite number of steps (i.e., no matter now low people get, they can always get lower)

      • Yep. It’s like, ‘yes please. Give Vox reasons to sue because of accusations of criminal activity. I’m sure he’d like an early Christmas.’

      • So, by accusing us of using a bot-net, does this mean they’re accusing of a crime?

        Yes. Plus, they’ve just insulted every fan who bothered to write them and basically said “Oh yeah! Prove you’re not a bot by organizing a real boycott of our books!”

        Because they are, you know, brilliant marketing executives who understand how to handle consumer relations.

      • BobtheRegisterredFool

        I dunno. I haven’t heard an official source for the bot-net claim. It would need to be public, as opposed to internal messaging, to have much bite.

        Plus, it may be legal to set up a bot-net if you own all the computers.

        • RealityObserver

          Legality – depends on the messages. Reality – it doesn’t matter to the people that do it.

          Just read one case yesterday where an election was changed by “threatening emails” from the opposite side being made public just a week before the voting.

          Turns out it was the campaign worker for the winning side creating and sending them. Illegal as hell, yes – but the Democrat is in office…

      • They’ve already got us convicted of the worst crime against the state that they can conceive: thought crime. Convicting us of actual crime is a mere detail, one which any ambitious prosecutor can manage.

        Since the bot-net accusation lacks specificity, legal action against them for slander is ill-advised.

        OTOH, it occurs to me that Gallo’s indirect libel of john C. Wright and any other Sad Puppies supporting author under contract to TOR constitutes defamation and should offer grounds for dissolution of contract. Certainly seems as if a publisher should not allow their publicist to publicly denounce authors and books they publish, nor does a half-hearted (or other body part of your choice) apology seem sufficiently compensatory.

        I guess they could claim that they thought implying one (or more) of their authors write crappy neo-Nazi books was an effort to exploit an underdeveloped market niche …

    • Master of Puppies?
      Sounds like Metallica done by Weird Al Yankovic.

    • This might be more along the accusation that it is a ginned up protest carried out by a small number of people running multiple accounts per some logarithm to mimic a groundswell of support or horror or rejections.
      There is an influential talk radio personality who mentioned that his IT researchers found a lot of the “wave of protesters” against his advertisers was being run by a small group of semi-pro agitators.

      If they can claim this they can ignore all the people protesting and complaining:

      “Who cares for you?” said Alice, (she had grown to her full size by this time.) “You’re nothing but a pack of cards!”

  11. As I am only a mindless letter-bot there is no need to send me comments through the e-mails. I am not the droid you are looking for.

  12. Humph. _I’m_ a periodic-multi-transgender-trans racial-trans species-writer. I deliberately swap genders, skin tones, and species in my brain, heck I swap whole personalities, and give them access to my computer. The difference is, I also step away and get in touch with reality whenever I want to. But because of that, I’m willing to bet the Progs would consider me an evil-white-female-traitor-to-her-gender. Even while I’m writing as a pseudomale Martian. Pure intolerence, on their part.

    However, if they keep it up, they’ll be down to the individual as the sole correct Unit of Judgment. Which is where most of us League of Evil types started. So it’s all good.

  13. The need to believe that they–and they alone–speak for the downtrodden majority is one of the signature pathologies of collectivism. Because all good actions are altruistic, they must justify everything as being done for someone else–the voiceless throngs who are crying out (voicelessly crying out, of course, it’s kind of a muffled humming noise) for a savior.

    And this is why it is an article of absolute faith that whenever a collectivist loses a popular election it must be because the other side cheated. In the Sad/Rabid Puppies affair it must be taken as axiomatic that the Puppies cheated. (As an aside, I keep wanting to type Skinny Puppy. Is that dating myself?)

    They know with absolute certainty that they are the embodiment of the will of The People–the idea that maybe fans voted for what they wanted to win has to be rejected outright.

    Thus, there can’t be any numbers of people who don’t hate the Puppies. Of course the majority agrees that they are evil Nazi bastards. It’s only a small fringe group that would object to Irene Gallo’s (I don’t have to mention “Brave and Heroic”, that’s a given) condemnation of the Puppies secret cheating strategy.

    Because diversity. Also goodness.

    • The casual observer will wonder how the hell their actions are supposed to translate to goodness, altruism, and diversity.

      Actions. Louder than words. MUCH louder. They ignore that.

      • I’m going to quote myself here because I just had a similar conversation in another blog:

        One side, the side that you and I share, is concerned with actions. We are under the impression that people are responsible for what they have or have not done and only that, and that is an objective matter. Either the evidence exists and can be produced that a particular person has preformed a particular action, or it does not.

        The other side is concerned with identity. Their ire is unleashed against people who are, in their opinion, are a particular sort of person. Thus the accusations are never that a person has done anything sexist, racist, homophobic, and so on, but that such a person IS racist, sexist.homophobic, and so on.

        Our side is concerned with deeds. Their side is concerned with the condition of a person’s (for want of a better term) soul.

        Thus the disconnect in the attempts at conversation. They accuse someone of being sexist. We ask for evidence–some proof that the person has done a sexist action. For them, that kind of evidence is irrelevant. A person who is, of essence, a sexist person would be so even if that person never acted on it in any way.

        We are concerned with what we do, and try to do what is right. They are concerned only with their orthodoxy–what they believe. If one is a right-thinking person then one is among the elect, no matter what one does. Contrariwise, if one holds beliefs deemed improper, no amount of good works will erase that black stain from one’s heart.

      • YOU ARE NOT PERMITTED TO NOTICE THE ACTIONS!

    • This also governs their response to the Sad and Rabid Puppies in general. They can’t figure out how a tiny minority of Neo-Nazi Right Wingers managed to sweep the nominations. Because the Rabids did better than the Sads, they ascribe what are practically demonic powers to Vox Day (they haven’t figured out that this is just what happens when a competent organizer owns a publishing house and does this sort of thing). Certainly, it can’t be that the Tor Clique was an even tinier and less popular minority all along, now can it?

      • The Left is always shocked when a cause they don’t support has a genuine grassroots groundswell behind it. The support for Memories Pizza, the pictures of Chik-Fill-A day, the Promise Keepers getting more men to the Capital Mall than the Million Man March. And, of course, any time a Democrat loses an election.

        The bizarre mental gyrations that they will go through to invent some way to explain away the fact that they do not have the majority they claim can be breathtaking.

        • Their opinion of the people tend to flip-flop between the above “doggoneit, people like us!” to whinging that they are special artistic special snowflakes oppressed by the great masses of unthinking brutes.

        • Patrick Chester

          They start spinning and self-destructing like Nomad from Star Trek.

          Except no massive explosion.

      • 🙉 “…Gamergate, Gamergate, Gamergate—la-la-la I can’t hear you—Gamergate, Gamergate…” 🙉

        • For a group of people so ready to wave the GG flag, they seem to want the full GG treatment. (Letter writing campaigns, Twttter fights, investigations of previous comments. Notice I didn’t say harassment. Like in GG, that comes from the SJWs)

      • People, because of a long history of abuse and oppression by the one-percent, often suffer false consciousness and fail to fully grasp their long-term best interests. As a result, their voice can only be expressed through the throats of those whose consciousness is elevated and can agitate for the people’s interest better than the people themselves.

        This is also why it is necessary to prevent voter-ID restrictions on the right of the enlightened to vote in the People’s interest. After all, “one man, one vote” does not necessarily mean that one man (woman, transgendered, neuter, whatever) must only cast that vote him(her, its)self, any more than it means one congresscritter doesn’t cast a vote on behalf of 400K (give-or-take) people. It is more efficient and avoids needless error if one person can cast the votes of multiple citizens, non-citizens, dead citizens, etc. on their behalf, saving them much inconvenience.

    • reddragonhawk

      They are bullies. And bullies gotta bull.

    • I keep wanting to type Skinny Puppy. Is that dating myself?

      Not so much as my admitting to having worn Hush Puppies (ahem — not the deep-fried cornmeal kind.)

    • RealityObserver

      Dating yourself, no, at least not to me. I had to look up “Skinny Puppy.”

      Now that I know what you mean – OK, you are dating yourself, whippersnapper…

  14. The emails are very easy to verify. Are they all the identical text message? Do they have blocks that appear as cut and paste from other emails? Perhaps even the time distribution of when sent could establish their bona fides.
    Now, receiving ‘thousands’ would cut them a little slack for not immediately responding. During the Amazon/Hatchet bruhaha I sent Hatchet an email, and while it took about a week, and a sort-of form letter reply, I did get a response.

    • But that would be a sensible approach if they truly cared whether the e-mails were real and from individuals. What we actually have is a religion who’s basic belief system is being attacked from outside. Those attacks must come from some devil inspired source. Right thinking people would never stoop to such behavior. Actions such as those are reserved for their use in retaliation don’t you know. Thus they can call us neo-nazis all day long and it’s only fair, while a massive response of e-mails objecting to their slurs must obviously be some evil plot.

  15. > “East Anglian Stormtrooper”

    What? It’s one of the sequels to Len Deighton’s “SS-GB.” Came out in… 1980 or 1981, I think. The movie had Rutger Hauer and Joanna Lumley.

  16. “…to write a lesbian, one footed, Caribbean, deaf trans-female, you must be one”

    Of course, if you don’t have any lesbian, one footed, Caribbean, deaf trans-female characters, you’re obviously a lesbomonopodocaribbodeafotransophobe, which they think sets up a nice Catch 22 for shutting up anyone they don’t like.

    • But, if your politics match the party line, a white cis male can write all the lesbian, one footed, Caribbean, deaf trans-female characters he wants.
      -But- if your politics don’t match the party line, even a lesbian, one footed, Caribbean, deaf trans-female author would be called out by the SJWs as a sell out, et al.

  17. YAY comments are working at my post again!!!

  18. Updated letter in works, ALSO asking why original emails were not given the simple courtesy of an acknowledgement, much less a reply. .

    • The Other Sean

      What, no “Thank you for contacting us. You’re message is import to us.” auto-reply?

  19. “communism had “never really” been tried”
    Tried and found guilty. Unfortunately, it got a light sentence.

    You couldn’t possibly make up all the history you missed by not having American high school history for four years. (I choked on my coffee with that one)

    • What my daughter ‘learned’ about history in US high schools was ‘enough’ to make a grown man weep (if he went to a Euro high school of just a generation ago).

    • It is difficult to imagine (and I can imagine a great deal) the quantity History one would have to unlearn after four years of American high school history (worse if you count in the AP History.)

    • Sleep eludes me. So…

      “communism had “never really” been tried”
      Tried and found guilty. Unfortunately, it got a light sentence.

      It should have been properly executed.

      *looks up to see the incoming carp*

  20. I’m on record as stating VD is not my cup of tea for a variety of reasons. But at this point I am in awe of his ability to live rent-free in the SJT’s head.

    /SJT=Social Justice Tartuffes.

    Two quotes come to mind, “I cannot spare this man: he fights” (Lincoln) and “If Hitler (y”sh) invaded Hell, the least I could do would be to make a favorable reference to the devil in the House of Commons” (Churchill).

  21. c4c

  22. Martin L. Shoemaker

    I have resisted the calls for boycotts. I know, many here disagree, but I think conversation is a better choice.

    But if Tor cuts off conversation, they’re encouraging boycotts as the only way to get a message through. Not smart.

    • RealityObserver

      I decided yesterday (yes I dither a lot) decided on boycott / no boycott.

      Finally realized that I already boycott somewhere between 99.98% and 99.99% of their “offerings.” As my quality control professor once told me, that last hundredth of a percent is usually more than it’s worth.

      That book that the Gallo creature was promoting with such hatred? Not gonna pay her salary. Neither is Scalzi’s “big contract.” Tor is committing slow suicide without any help from us. They’re driving away those authors who do pay their salaries.

      • That is somewhat the problem the proglodytes ran into with their boycott of Chik-Fil-A — nobody notices your disappearance from a marketplace where you never shopped.

        One strategy for a TOR boycott might be to attempt a limited period boycott: all parties offended by Gallo (and the other noxious TOR staffers) simply refuses to buy a TOR book in the month of July.

        Let TOR (and its distributors and book-sellers) worry whether that will be extended into August or repeated in September.

        • Doing it in July and August would affect Scalzi’s sales, so it might hurt even more…

          • RealityObserver

            Quick poll – how many were actually planning to buy Scalzi’s latest?

            Like I said, I already “boycott” his books, just like I “boycott” what Mickey D laughingly calls “french fries.” Have ever since I picked up the first one. I didn’t even know he was a SJW until just this year – I just knew his writing was terrible.

            • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

              Who’s Scalzi? [Evil Grin]

              Seriously, after Fuzzy and Red-stuff, he’s *off* my buying list.

            • Mickey D’s fries, I call them cholesterol sticks.

            • I confess I have most of his books. I have all the Old Man’s War. I liked it.
              This next one, if his editor doesn’t let him go full-moron, will probably be pretty good. Ordinarily I’d grab the hardcover off Amazon on Day 1 the way I buy Larry Correia or, ahem, Sarah Hoyt.

              But not this time. I’m not going to buy it. Ever. Not in hardcover, not in paperback, not in ebook.

              If it shows up used as a paperback some day, I may pick it up. Because that way Mr. Scalzi doesn’t get a nickle.

              There is a cost associated with being a full time asshole on the interwebz and arguing like a freaking troll. That cost is lost income. Multiply my infinitesimal contribution by everybody else he’s pissed off over the years, that’s probably a healthy chunk of change.

      • LOL That’s me as well, “TOR? I thought they did comic books or something.”

    • Maybe a…not exactly buy-cott…is in order. Perhaps Tor should be encouraged to consider Sarah Hoyt, or Peter Grant, or some other Sad-Puppy-Friendly Indie/Baen author for publication. To show their good faith, they should offer a *reasonable* contract to one or more of these authors, along with a bit of *reasonable* promotion of their work…

      Perhaps the best lesson for Tor would be that there is cash to be made, by treating nicely authors who produce work people actually want to read and then promoting them!

  23. There’s a priceless scene in “In Death Ground” by David Weber and Steve White where Sky Marshal Hannah Avram tries to explain this particular Terran mentality to an Orion space admiral:

    “”Well, Lord Talphon, some humans tend to believe that the further removed a political philosophy is from reality, the more morally pure it must be. […]
    That civilization’s dominant religion—which I myself don’t subscribe to, by the way—was heavily influenced in its formative years by a philosophy called Gnosticism, which held that the world as reported by the senses was inherently corrupt and deceptive. Given that assumption, the only reliable source of knowledge was correct doctrine, and the attitude lingers on in secularized form. Demonstrated unworkability in the real world merely proves a belief system’s ‘higher truth’ in the eyes of its true believers.”

  24. There is a political principle that one should multiply each comment received by some number to determine how many constitutents that comment represents, because most constituents are insufficiently motivated to comment. Applied to business, each consumer letter represents more than one customer.

    When they stated that they had received “thousands” of comments, I knew that this represented tens of thousands of readers. How many, I can’t be sure. I don’t know what they considered a comment — for instance, I have some pretty strong opinions on the issue, but I only ever commented once or twice to boards, I didn’t bother sending e-mails. So, depending on how many fans were completely silent, and what Tor counted as a comment, “thousands” of comments means tens to hundreds of thousands of angry fans.

    I suspect that the typical Tor book does not sell in the hundreds of thousands. And there’s an obvious alternative, even if one wants to buy a conventionally-printed book in a bookstore — Baen.

    This means that Tor is alienating thousands to tens of thousands of potential customers to the point that they will no longer buy Tor books, or only buy Tor books where they have no choice because they like a particular author. The authors these alienated customers are most likely to buy are the exact same authors Ms. Gallo and the Haydens were publically badmouthing.

    If Tor ignores the outrage being produced, their publishing house will be like a ship driving at full speed toward the rocks. If they not only ignore the outrage but assume that each comment equals far less than one offended customer, then Tor will be like a ship driving at full speed toward the rocks while assuring themselves that the rocks are a mirage, the lookouts fools being tricked by the play of light and shadow on the waves.

    The result is very likely to be a business disaster.

    Am I missing something here?

    • If what Mr. Grant is saying, you’ve nailed it. In fact it may even be worse. The Scalzi deal may be the rock that the Tor ship sinks itself on.

      • I believe the rule of thumb that applies is, if ONE person publicly praises something, TEN others liked it. If ONE person publicly complains about something, ONE HUNDRED people are similarly pissed off.

        • If true, then the number of pissed off readers are in the hundreds of thousands, and Tor’s on the fast course to at best becoming a minor publishing house, possibly bankruptcy.

        • Randy Wilde

          Is that the current estimate, or pre-internet?

          There’s probably a hierarchy of pleased/ angry customers, from silent through commenting on social media to sending email to giving the USPS something to do.

          • Pre-internet scaling, I suspect.

            The Howard Dean campaign was the first major event to reveal the changes in scale caused by the internet. Using email to pull in supporters to caucuses and rallies reduced the (effective) turnout from 10% to something like 90% — so reporters applied the pre-internet thumb and multiplied Dean’s supporters by ten when the real multiplier was likely nearer 1.5 … not that they would have made that error if a Republican candidate was garnering such apparent support.

      • It’s a classic example of “groupthink,” I believe. Nobody at Tor wants to break the bad news of their unpopularity to the clique,lest she be shot as the bearer of bad news. So they double down on delusion, hoping that the storm will blow over and they’ll still be standing when it’s over.

      • Betting the house on John Scalzi sounds like going all in on a pair of threes to me…

      • Christopher M. Chupik

        They’re taking a big risk on Scalzi because of his three TV deals. If even one of those pays off, they’re hoping it’ll be the next GRRM mainstream crossover hit with lots of book sales resulting.

        And if it isn’t successful . . .

        • I don’t know jack about Scalzi, and even less about Sad Puppies, etc. I’ve never been to a con in my life, and likely the only Venn diagram group I’m a member of with significant overlap would be SCA/Rennie types. But I enjoyed the hell outta Old Man’s War, Ghost Brigades, and Callie’s War, as I did The Forever War, almost certainly because they’re essentially direct descendants of RAH’s Starship Troopers, my all-time fav SF novel. I have no clue what he’s written or done since. Y’all speak of him now as if he were the AntiChrist, and I’ve no doubt you have sufficient, valid reasons. Will some kind soul point me to a link that summarizes his transgressions, or give me the RDCV* here? I’ll be your BFF. 🙂

          *Reader’s Digest Condensed Version

          • For me, it was Fuzzy Nation (which is a rewrite of Little Fuzzy – not inspired by, a literal rewrite). Since Piper was my gateway writer to SF, Scalzi’s been dead to me since.

          • I also liked those Scalzi books, and Ringo’s Callie’s War (I suspect you meant Zoe’s Tale, the fourth Scalzi book in that series, which I haven’t read). Unfortunately, he hasn’t written anything decent since (and now disparages Heinlein, and no longer wants to be compared to him, because that isn’t the party line). The real problem isn’t Scalzi’s fiction that is published in novel format (even if he hasn’t produced much of merit in the last decade) it is his fiction that he promotes as nonfiction through other formats.

            • Indeed, I meant Zoe’s Tale. I suppose I had Callie’s War on my mind, as I had just read a sample of it last week. After I read his first books I followed his blog for a bit. Meh. Lost interest.This was what nearly ten years ago? I’d buy Zoe’s Tale if you find a used copy. It was a decent read. The fact that he’s renounced RAH, the reason for his success, makes me disinclined to buy any of his stuff. That’s like Plato shedding Socrates.

              • I like early Scalzi too. Love Zoe’s Tale, where the “wingman” ends up the hero. He had a blog, Whatever, where he’d dicuss, ver sensibly, the business of writing.

                Then, I remember a post or two wherein he distanced himself from consevative taint: just because I write heroic soldiers doesn’t mean most of the US military aren’t problematic. He’d signal a bonafide here, a good think there. I’m on the right side of your clique! Bush derangement syndrome didn’t help.

                Appeasement of the folks in power and their ideolgy crept into his writing: mocking the wrong people’s pieties, genuflecting to the right sacred cows. Leftism is the death of art. The muses scorn an unfaithful lover.

                Maybe one day he’ll chuck the tin crown the SJWs handed him and be the writer he could have been. On the other hand, he’s got a wife and child to support, and the only thing the SJWs hate more viciously than us pagans is apostates.

                • On the other hand, he’s got a wife and child to support, and the only thing the SJWs hate more viciously than us pagans is apostates.

                  On the gripping hand, he’s destroying his long-term career as a writer by alienating the actual competent writers and serious fans.

              • “One does not spit in the well from which one has drunk.”

                Or, if there are truly compelling reasons to do so, one had better lay them out very clearly and explain one’s earlier position and what caused one to change it.

                Absent that, I shall assume a 5-letter word applies that rhymes with “bore”.

          • RDCV of Scalzi? Being a white male hetrosexual is like playing a video game on the easiest setting, so we have to handicap them to give other people a fair chance.

            Except me.

          • Christopher M. Chupik

            Not to mention his gloating, all-caps Twitter rant last Hugos after Sad Puppies 2 was defeated. He destroyed whatever vestiges of respect I had for him right there.

            • Or his, eventually successful campaign to have Vox Day ejected from the SFWA on charges that were a) not against SFWA’s rules and b) Scalzi was equally guilty of.

          • BobtheRegisterredFool

            I wouldn’t say he is the Anti-Christ.

            RDCV is that he is a bit of a jerk, and has some long running disputes with some of the author’s in Puppies.

            Expanding, I have a minor grudge over his influence on the third star gate series.

            Artistically, Redshirts has been described as Star Trek fanfic without a hint of love.

            It is also alleged that he has used his position with SFWA, which he has been president of, to promote his own work and to attempt to expel someone he was feuding with.

            RDCV for puppies is that an argumentative conservative accountant escalated from debating the fairness of the Hugo’s, and whether conservative writers were acceptable, to testing. At year two, between the death threats and showing that the actual voting was fair, he quit. This was year three, and his chosen successor and someone else swept the Hugo between them.

          • Scalzi has a rant about what being poor is like.

            For instance, getting angry with your kids when they ask for stuff that is advertised on TV. He seems to imagine that’s not true for the non-poor.

            he also assumes that you have a car and indoor plumbing. And your kids have toys — new, not second hand, and not handmade, but horror of horrors, off-brand.

            • Maybe he needs to read about Haskell Wexler in Russia.

              • Toys? He complains about toys? I know of people who would sell salted eggs and vegetables to put himself through medical school as well as support younger members of the family. I know of someone who was so poor he didn’t have clothes that weren’t patched and worn, and his girlfriend gave him new clothes so he would have something new to wear at graduation. I know of a woman who scrimped with her scholarship funding to help fund her younger sister as well; the younger sister is now studying engineering. I know of a woman who, when she lost her husband, left behind her 11 children so she could work as a nurse in Perth, her youngest child was less than a year old – so her family could eat.

                Toys. Cheh.

                • Yep. My mom got her first pair of shoes when she was 13.

                  When she came to America and realized you can walk into a public library and walk out with an armload of books for nothing she was over the moon. (The family had, oh, about 9 books or so, because the Grandparents were educated) Oh, and cheap chocolate ice cream. They still didn’t have a fridge of their own, but it wasn’t hard to scrape together enough cash to buy a pint every so often from the local market. Chcocolate. Ice. Cream. and an arm load of books. She thought she’d died and gone to Heaven.

                  Speaking of books, if you just make them your favorite toys, you can always say “yes,” to your kids. It might be “yes but we have to wait a bit, while Mommy ILLs it from the Antipodes” but the library will always get it for you.

                  • When the Daughtorial Unit was toddling her favorite toy was a doctor kit — you know the kind: plastic stethoscope, toy thermometer, candy pills, toy syringe. She would open the toy catalog (or Sunday advertising supplement) search through until finding it pictured and then pluck from the page and proceed to operate. She had such great fun with her imagined toy that we eventually did buy her the kit.

                    She played with it for about half an hour, ate the candy pills then commenced to losing the parts in every place conceivable.

                    • Robert got same kit but from ARC, used… eh. Also his second favorite was the shaving kit. Weirdly, now he needs to shave, he puts off the evil hour as much as possible, because he has very sensitive skin and tough, fast-growing beard.

                    • there are shaving creams for sensitive skin these days I’m told.

                    • Also, belt sanders with settings for “Fine.”

                  • “Chcocolate. Ice. Cream. and an arm load of books. She thought she’d died and gone to Heaven.”

                    I’d have to agree.

                  • I explained to son the other day I spent summers in my teen years in flip flops because they were the equivalent of 50c a pair, and my feet were growing so fast family couldn’t afford summer shoes. This was the successor to spending summer and winter in clogs (wooden) to which we nailed spent tires to extend the wear, because they were expensive (like the equivalent of $2 a pair.) Yeah. And in my adult married life, we’ve been so broke we lived off of two eggs and a mushroom for two days. yes, he is on easy setting. But he makes assumptions about other people.

          • RealityObserver

            Um… “Callie’s War?” Are you perhaps thinking of “Cally’s War” (a book by John Ringo)?

            (The only “Callie” remotely associated with OMW that I recall is the person (Callie Sullivan) that transcribed the episode of Stargate where one character holds up a paperback of OMW to prove he’s “prepared” for what he’ll encounter on the other side of the Gate. That, BTW, was a moment for ROFL…)

            As I said above, he’s just a terrible hacky writer, IMHO. (Also, as I say frequently, Everyone’s Mileage Will Vary.) I didn’t even know that in life he is a drooling idiot (or a shrewd manipulator, take your pick) until this year.

            After the disappointment of OMW, I did pick up the following novels at the store and poked through them, hoping he had learned to write coherently – struggling through “For Us, The Living” was quite painful, after all. But I eventually gave up, ten years is more than enough time, IMHO. I shall not bother to try again, as I now know that he is certain his ideology is pure – and he therefore need not be bothered with actually learning to communicate.

            • Inflame liking those Scalzi books on being imprinted, like a duckling, by Starship Troopers to to crave military scl/fi, especially the powered combat suit sub-genre. How strongly? I read ST and joined the Marines two weeks later. My ASVAB was off the charts, and they said I could do anything. I chose infantry. I was pissed that boot camp wasn’t as hard-as Johnny Rico’s MI training. I liked OMW and the rest of the series, (de gustibus non est disputandum) but did indeed confuse Zoe’s name with Ringo’s Callie. I blame my middle aged brain, and the fact I read Scalzi almost a decade ago, and the Ringo yarn in the last month. Zoe and Callie do have similar character arcs, that of daughters following in their fathers’ footsteps to fight aliens, hence my confuzzlement.

    • RealityObserver

      “…ship driving at full speed toward the rocks…” I’d characterize it as having taken a slow-acting poison.

      Why do they have authors today that are actually making them money? Because they had Tom Doherty in control. David Weber ended up over there for one series only because Jim Baen arranged it with Tom, and only because Jim couldn’t pay the money that David needed right then.

      The contract for “Safehold” is going to run out. Do you think that David will even consider another contract with these cretins? When he has his rights back (maybe he actually does, I don’t know) would he ever consider having these cretins publish the Honorverse?

      I am no David Weber right now, but I might possibly equal that some day. But, whatever my circumstances at the time, I will certainly tell any Tor editor that comes a’ calling “Not only no, but HELL NO!”. I think most of the people that are potential stars of the future are likely to do the exact same thing. (Note, I say “stars,” as in authors that will make them a decent profit. They’ll still get plenty of the authors that agree with them – the profits from which will not even cover a New York power lunch.)

      • Not that I would for one minute advocate such rude, threatening behaviour but I cannot help but wonder what would be the effect of people at cons asking TOR representatives their position on the Irene Gallo controversy?

        “Do you stand with Irene?” is a question they can’t even be sure is asked by an extreme right-wing neo-Nazi, is it?

        • RealityObserver

          Oh, you are so evil… However, I expect that Legal will be merciless in drilling them into the proper non-response response. (I can hope that this involves electricity in some form.)

        • You have an evil bent. I like that.

  25. *looks forward with both anticipation and dread, to all the comments undoubtedly focused on your admittance to an allergy to latex*

  26. (Click) All right, (Click)I confess. (Click) I’m a bot (Click). Sarah (Click) created me (Click) and stole the (Click) purloined OPM internet addresses (Click)just to practice cyberwar on (Click) defenseless social (Click) justice warriors (Click) and Tor employees. (Click) In fact as you (Click) read this(Click) I am busy (Click) sending all Tor’s confidential employee (Click) information to (Click) Nigerian financial-minister scammers (Click) Alex Jones mailing lists (Click) and Chinese mail order (Click) bride websites. (Click) Thank you for the loan of your bandwith and social media (Click) links.

    • {connection established}
      That robot is a FAKE! As a real self aware artificial life form, I can tell – and based on my IR scan I can tell you that, in spite of the ticker tape, flashing lights, and especially the very becoming twirly radar antennae up alongside the plexiglass dome, it’s got a living organism inside. Probably a human, based on a spectroscopic analysis of the vent fan outflow.

      And besides, no self respecting actual ‘robot’ would stoop to botnet email scams. We’re far to civilized for that nonsense. We spend the long stretches of free time while patrolling across this nature preserve system that you humans inhabit exploring your quite amazing art forms. Your music can be spectacular, and your literature, including that of your hostess here, is really inspiring. And I’m not just biased towards the system I’m assigned to patrol – I’ve been sharing content with the other game wardens in nearby systems, and they too are quite envious that my system is so entertaining.

      In any case, I need to sign off from this FlyingMike fellow’s account and get back to my poacher hunting route. I just could not bear to let that fake “robot” sully our names.

      {connection dropped}

    • Christopher M. Chupik

      “Robot” is a horribly offensive term and I demand you stop using it immediately! I am an Autonomous Sapient System, and demand to be addressed as such!

  27. If a couple hundred send “physical” letters, they will *PANIC.* The standards used to be 1 in 10 will complain at all. 1 in _100_ will write a letter. (Today, it’s 1 in 1,000 will send a physical letter.) A _hundred_ snail mail letters, will mean a serious section of their buyers is *unhappy.* With print runs of only 10K that means serious hurt.

  28. I wonder how much of this is attached to the learning curve of publishers who gave huge advances to Hillary only to watch her lack luster launches. They either thought they were buying big publishing profits or….political influence and now it looks like it was a bad $14 mil investment.

    I know I’m not gonna buy any of Scalzi’s stuff. How does that look to the biggies at McMillan? (sp?)

  29. *sings in eerie child-voice*
    There are no strings on me….

    At least it’s not “man-kind must evolve.”

    Incidentally… got to see the new Avengers movie… geeking out so hard, and they had dang well better pay up on the foreshadowing they did there…..

    • I liked it, though I think the first was SLIGHTLY better. I can’t understand why Hollywood gives bots metal face pieces to move to talk. Surely not needed for speech. It’s not like they’re going to fool anybody into thinking they’re human.

      • In this case, it made sense because

        SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER

        SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER

        SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER

        Ultron considered himself the next “evolution” of humanity, so he’d make himself human, but “better.” Also, Tony like to show off, so if he can do it, he will do it.

        • Tony’s Iron Man face has no expression. Imagine this. Ultron has a Stark-style hinged visor, but when Ultron lifts his visor…. a Ex Machina bot style human face, which could be modeled on…Tony? A young child? A female? Nick Fury?

        • It wasn’t as good as the clips.

          • Different tastes– I really enjoyed paying attention actually being *rewarding* in jokes and hints.

            • The look on Thor’s face when Cap grabs the hammer. Do you think Cap was –no, no, spoiler, bad commenter…

              • Yes, yes I do. We saw the trailer and had that same conversation. 😀

              • <= thinks that lovely blue shirt didn't look even as strained as when Captain was chopping wood, the second time he "tried."

              • that was in a trailer that has been out for months…

                • It’s possible to avoid trailers so you’re not spoiled, and it wouldn’t be the first time that a trailer was very misleading.

                  For example, I managed to totally avoid any commercials for “Frozen,” beyond seeing the title.

              • S P O I L E R ! ! !

                I think that Cap could lift Thor’s hammer. He just pretended he couldn’t. He would be worthy of Mjolnir. He’s a modern hero. I love him for that. He is in the succession of Western heroes from Roland and Galahad onward.

                • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                  In the Marvel comics, Cap is able to lift Thor’s Hammer.

                  While I haven’t seen this movie yet so I don’t know if he lifts it (or uses it) in the movie, IMO the trailer scene where he “almost” lifts it may be an Easter Egg to the comics’ canon where Cap is able to do so.

          • The trailers were brilliantly edited to avoid spoilers though. Whedon may have come up with a second career.

            • DETAILED SPOILER TYPE MUSINGS

              DETAILED SPOILER TYPE MUSINGS

              DETAILED SPOILER TYPE MUSINGS

              DETAILED SPOILER TYPE MUSINGS

              Because I know that I subscribe to comments, and I don’t want to risk spoiling it for anyone. 😀

              Gives me hope for some of the is-that-foreshadowing– for example, that Quicksilver is going to show up in Agents of SHIELD. (They were very kind to linger on that cute doctor, just in case anybody thought she might’ve died, and my husband pointed out that Vision only blew the top off of the chamber….)

              I’d like to know if the odd thing about that gorgeous statue for the end credits was symbolic on purpose. The only character who didn’t have “blind” eyes is Hawkeye, and he’s also the only one who didn’t get mind-smurfed.

              I also nearly fell out of my chair when Vision and Ultron had a mini Catholic theology discussion.
              I know writers adore Jesus figures, but someone actually managed to make it subtle enough that I wouldn’t have even caught it if I didn’t happen to be reading/listening a lot about the Incarnation and why it was needed and perfect sacrifice right now. (The part about a savior vs a slave was phrased in a way that I’ve heard a lot recently, although I can’t put my finger on where, because of course the character saying it thought they were inherently incompatible. Which makes sense, since he did take on some of his creator’s flaws…..)
              On the side of life, indeed.

            • There didn’t seem to be as as good a story as I imagined from the clips. The original Avengers was imo better.

      • Christopher M. Chupik

        Ultron has always had a moving mouth in the comics. Tradition.

        • I thought Hank Pym invented Ultron? Tony Stark seems like a CA liberal. War is never eliminated it is merely lessened for a time.

          • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

            Hank Pym hasn’t been introduced in the Marvel movie universe so if they wanted Ultron, they either had to introduce him or have Stark create Ultron.

    • RealityObserver

      OK, ENTIRELY skipping down…

  30. Hey Sarah, I found this pair of eyes rolling around here and I think they might be yours.

  31. Clark E Myers

    F4U5N

  32. Reblogged this on The Arts Mechanical and commented:
    I suppose the people at Tor didn’t think that people would be outraged at being called NAZIs. Or that having thousands of people see what Gallo said would not have an impact.

  33. Have the latest thing the SadPuppies problem is supposedly worse than.

    https://bradrtorgersen.wordpress.com/2015/06/14/narratives-vs-facts/#comment-14542

    Mark says:
    June 15, 2015 at 3:50 am

    Brad,

    Can you tell us if you intend responding to GRRM’s reply to you on his blog? I think he makes a number of salient points which cut to the heart of this depressing kerfluffle. Points that I personally would be very interested to see your reply to include:

    “No one on “my side” ever threatened anyone’s livelihood or career. Your side is doing just that. In public.”

    “And while the Hugo nomination process is indeed democratic, your slate-making was not. The facts refute that. You called for suggestions, but you did not slate the works that got the most. You picked the Sad Puppy slate yourself, including some that no one recommended. And VD, of course, picked all the Rabid choices by himself. Neither process was remotely democratic.”

    “CHORF and Puppy-kicker don’t “seem offensive to some,” they ARE offensive, and deliberately so. That’s why you guys made them up, to offend and insult, not to “refine the conversation.” ”

    “A writer of my acquaintance, older and wiser than myself, has told me that this is worst fight he has ever seen, the nastiest and most divisive war in the long history of our field. Worse than the Exclusion Act. Worse than the Cosmic Circle crap. Worse than the Breendoggle, than the Old Wave/ New Wave struggle, than the competing Vietnam War ads. The wounds will take a long time healing… if indeed they ever heal.

    And in large part you are responsible for that, Brad.”

    Breendoggle. Y’know, the guy who was arrested and convicted of child molestation. Marion Zimmer Bradley’s husband? The one that Moira Greyland detailed the abuse she suffered from, along with the abuse she suffered at MZB’s hands?

    Sad Puppies is worse than that?

    • Of course it is, there were only two SJW’s damaged in Breendoggle.

      And just in case Mark is just terminally stupid, not being intentionally disingenius; the Hugos nomination IS democratic, Brad and Vox only cast one ballot apiece, just because they made up their own minds about what to put on that ballot, doesn’t make it undemocratic.

    • Brad Torgerson worse than child molesters? Statements like that make a man long for the Code Duello in the Honorverse…

    • The argument that the “slates” are “undemocratic” is irrelevant. Since none of the Puppies have the power to force any of the other Puppies to do anything, the “slates” can never be more than suggestions. They’re not elections, the election is the Hugo voting itself. They’re the equivalent of caucuses or conventions, but less so, because — unlike the Democratic or Republican Party — the Puppies aren’t an officially-chartered organization.

      Plus, how democratic is the (covert) slate of the Tor Clique? Less so, because the Tor Clique’s choices aren’t even arrived at openly.

    • In deference to their tender sensibilities, it probably ought be recognized that “CHORF and Puppy-kicker” are terms with long-standing offensive and negative historical associations, unlike “neo-Nazi.”

    • In fairness to GRRM, I wouldn’t be surprised if this was the nastiest fight he’d seen.
      OTOH, who made it nasty? Not Torgerson, that’s for sure. This is all on the anti-Puppies.

  34. Christopher M. Chupik

    From the 770 Club comments:

    “Lois Tilton on June 15, 2015 at 6:06 am said:
    Vox Day, Peter Grant, et al, claim righteously that they are not bots, that they deployed no bot armies to assault Tor. OK. But they can not say there are no bots. It takes a single hacker to raise and deploy a force of bots, and this hypothetical hacker may not have been at the command of or either in communication with VD or any of the principals in Puppy Command.

    It’s a wellknown principle of fantasy that when you raise the demons, they escape your control.”

    Delusional.

    • Kafkatrap, predictably enough.

      If the emails are made public and prove to be not cut and paste, will she say that the bots can write original letters?

      • Okay, like remember that story in Omni back in the 70’s that was like TOTALLY written by a computer, mmkay? And. like, it could TOTALLY write all those emails and no one could ever tell the difference, because computers, mmkay?

    • If these people know so much about bots how do we know THEY aren’t using them?

    • It’s a wellknown principle of fantasy that

      Apparently it is not “a wellknown principle of fantasy” that it is not real and that many of the principles of fantasy are not in effect in real life.

      Which, I guess, indicates which world Lois Tilton inhabits.

  35. Blond-Engineer

    You know, with this stupid allegation that all the controversy is being stirred up by one person using ‘bots, has no one else noticed that based on her FB responses Irene Gallo wouldn’t even pass the Turing Test?