Paranoiacs Abroad

Yesterday I was thinking, always a terrible mistake, while I did the cat boxes and scrubbed the toilets (it was that kind of day) about how part of our problem today is not only that parts of our culture don’t know each other, but that parts of our culture actively know stuff about the other parts that absolutely isn’t so.

This is a problem for various reasons, one of them being that various parts of this vast and varied nation think they need the government to protect them from “those fellows over there’ who in fact have no intention of doing anything about/to them. And this is a problem because our system is not designed to give a centralized government that much power; our nation is too varied/different/peculiar for every spot to be justly ruled from a central location (take the $15 an hour boondoggle.  Btw, this is $2 less than than most medical interns make an hour, but I digress.  In some places in the country this is what an adult with practice in his trade — say retail manager — can hope to make, and you absolutely can raise a family on it.  In other parts of the country even $15 is poverty and destitution.  Having a centralized government dictate a minimum wage for everyone regardless of local cost of living makes as much sense as making only shoes in size 8 for the left foot.)

Now it’s always been normal, and it’s part of that human tribal thing, to believe that those guys over there, across the bridge and over the mountain are REALLY weird.

My grandmother as she got very old read newspapers full of marvelous accounts of women giving birth to snakes and other such odd “news”.  I almost swallowed my tongue reading Truth by Terry Pratchett because it pictured that so exactly.  No woman in the village would ever give birth to snakes, but we were civilized and nice, and who knew what those people over the mountain did?  If someone said they did and it was right there in the paper, surely the paper wasn’t allowed to print falsehoods, right?

This might sound like a bumpkin’s idea, but really it isn’t and there is more about this later.  All humans are susceptible to this to some limited extent.  And people who are quite shrewd in one or two areas can be absolutely dumb in things they don’t pay much attention to (see current election for examples.)

For instance, once when I was 15 or so, I needed to get to my high school at indecently early hours.  I don’t remember why, it’s entirely possible it was to finish an art project or to do some volunteer thing.  To get to the highschool I took a train from the village downtown.  We weren’t a station (though the village has one now) but a very informal stop at which maybe one in ten trains stopped (and sometimes scheduled ones forgot and I had to call dad from next village over to pick me up, or if it was early walk the five or six miles back.)  Anyway, the only train available before five am was full of people from the villages beyond the mountains, who came to sell at the big city fairs.  These were sharp people, and small business people.

However, it’s unlikely in those days that their remote villages even had good radio reception, and newspapers would probably have been difficult to obtain. While they were in the city they were working and would absorb any gossip they heard, but not seek out newspapers and news.  At any rate, likely, these people had third grade if that much, and reading might have been a chore.

I was sitting by the window, listening to them talk, and let me tell you, they sounded absolutely as smart as my parents or anyone else.  Until….

A young man with a Spanish accent moved down the carriage telling a story and getting money.  He was a refugee from the Spanish civil war, and all his family had been killed, and he needed money for a new start.

No, don’t tune your receivers.  There was no civil war ongoing in Spain in the seventies.  BUT these people hadn’t paid attention, had vague memories of hearing mom/grandma/great grand say something about a civil war in Spain. They opened their pockets and gave deep.

Rustics, you say.  And yes, it was always part of high culture to make fun of rustics.  Cozened literally comes from the con game in Elizabethan England where a con men would approach a new comer from the countryside, pretend to be their cousin and trick them/rob them.

But now we have something completely different.  While the Rustic in Elizabethan England was a stock character in London, if a person from London traveled in the countryside, it is likely after a while they’d become aware not everyone there was simple, or gullible.  They’d learn to see the countryside as it was, not as they were told it was.

The problem we have right now is that this is near impossible, and the divisions aren’t only geographic.  It’s very easy to set one race against the other, one orientation against the other, even micro cultures against the other.  (The number of times I’ve been informed I spend my weekends wearing Spock ears don’t bear mentioning.)

We’re back to not only the fact that we’re more pervasively immersed in entertainment than any people before, but also that our entertainment, particularly in movies, but also books, is designed to create “false memories.” We are supposed to believe that we lived this.  That’s what the narrative techniques do (if they’re good.)

I’m fine with that, as I read to enjoy being someone else for a time.  And it would be fine if for a while there every news channel, every sitcom, ever movie, every book hadn’t been a unified force selling the same version of reality.  Reinforced experience (aka the big lie) becomes doubly real because “everybody knows.”

Examples of “everybody knows” involve for instance that everybody knows Southerners will be hostile just because you’re not “from around these parts” and also that they’re all inbred ill billies; that no gay man can step outside safely at night without being beat to death; and that everyone on the right is not only Christian, but insanely, unthinkingly Christian and takes orders from their pastors.  And don’t get me started on the ‘murders of abortion doctors’ which many people think rival the numbers of Islamic terrorism, 9/11 and all.

And take the kerfufle over bathrooms and transgendered people using bathrooms.  BOTH sides behave as if they lived in an imaginary and very strange country.

The “You must let transgendered people into your bathrooms” people suffer from the “If you were a dinosaur, my transgendered love” syndrome, in that the only world they really know is the faculty lounge or the privileged country club where the right people assemble. They’ll believe anything of those people out there, beyond hte hill, including that those  people will stop an effeminate looking man or a butch looking woman from using the bathroom and demand they drop trou to prove their identity.  Seriously, what is this actual cr*p about the transgendered being unable to use bathrooms of their assumed sex?  I have friends who are butch women or effeminate men, (and most straight) and none of them ever got stopped at the door and told to prove they were male/female.  So if any transgendered person is making even token efforts to pass, no one is going to question them.  Because in the hinterlands, outside the enlightened faculty lounges, everyone knows people don’t match any label, and there is no defined “masculine” or “feminine”.  If someone looks like they sort of belong, we assume they know what their genitals are.

And then you get into the “but what if it’s just a guy who says he feels like a woman?”  Well, in saner times that would be idiotic, but nowadays it’s possible, thereby justifying a fear of the people against this.  OTOH when the people who say transgendered people are more likely to get assaulted in the bathroom of their birth sex, CANNOT be referring to people whose external appearance entirely and congruently matches their birth sex.

(As for fears your kids will be assaulted, I feel for you, but you realize no one is checking genitals and there are no bathroom guards, so people can and do sneak in and assault the unsuspecting, anyway.  Yes, yes, no reason encouraging it, but seriously.  Making a law against people using the other bathroom would obligate you to check genitals, and you know that we’re not going there either.  Ideally, as a friend suggests, we should have individual bathrooms, like the “family restrooms” available in airports.  This would both equalize the male and female bathrooms — one always over the other always under supplied — and permit people like me who only have children of the other sex, to keep an eye on them when they’re frankly too young and nuts to be trusted in there alone.  And for reasons unknown to me, women objected to Robert in the ladies’ room when he was little more than 3 and to Marshall at 6.)

What you have here is extreme suspicion of a vast majority (people outside the academic lounge and the entertainment industry) built by all our entertainment and news, until people decide a slightly less butch male and more butch female walking into a working class bar would get beat to a pulp for the crime of looking different.  Which is insane.  And which makes every little subgroup feel they need the government to protect them.

This is a dangerous road to go down, because no minority fares well under a totalitarian regime.  That is, the same people who help usher in the tyrant, because they think they need protection from their co-citizens, are the ones who end up suffering the most under it, because in the hard times that accompany tyranny, minorities must be made invisible or destroyed.

Yes, there are new ways to reach the public, and I’m imploring you, if you have an ounce of talent, start running blogs, writing books, doing what you can to wake our co-citizens out of the unrealistic consensus reality that is pitching them against each other.

We must — must — stop seeing each other without the blinders of the ideas pushed on us by those who would be our masters.

Only that way can we remain free.

Because when we get to the point we need the government to tell us where to go to the bathroom, the hour later and the situation far more serious than I thought.

 

 

 

371 responses to “Paranoiacs Abroad

  1. or we end up all in some kind of weird enforced minorities… in smaller and smaller and smaller boxes.

    maybe even eventually, we’d reach the preserved protected minority of… the individual.

  2. YellowShapedBox

    Most immediately destructive of these conceits: black people are supposed to be terrified of law enforcement; women are supposed to be terrified of men; a Native American leaving the reservation has essentially surrendered to genocide.

    • i would say more ‘fear to the point of hate’ than ‘be terrified of’

      • that is it, with hate toned up, and fear lessened so the hate overcomes, then ride the hate into power.

        • YellowShapedBox

          And then you’ve got the power, but you’ve lost the potential to be happily married and the capacity to enforce laws against violent felons.

          I wonder how much could be done if we just got these paranoiacs to think, like a worldbuilder, about what their own win state would look like?

          • I wonder how much could be done if we just got these paranoiacs to think, like a worldbuilder, about what their own win state would look like?

            Not much. They tend to already have fairly strong visions of what they want and tend to have difficulty imagining the consequences. Sure badspeek and badthink would be outlawed, but only bad people do those things so no one good would be hurt by the laws. In their worlds the bad things and negative consequences would only happen to the bad people. They don’t think about how resources are limited and that all consumer goods have to come from somewhere. They imagine the government to magically provide everything they need and that people will only have to do what they want and that they’ll be able to make money for it, even if it’s just playing videogames at home all day.

            I mean that woman, what do people here call her, Speaks with Cabbages? wrote about what her perfect world would be and it’s like reading something a videogame villain would write if they were asked to describe their goals.

            • YellowShapedBox

              I’m not familiar with this and a search for “speaks with cabbages” turned up nothing. Could you find a link? Sounds entertaining, at the least.

              That said, just giving up on anyone with the wrong opinion seems like a bad tack.

              • BobtheRegisterredFool

                ‘Speaks to plants’ or ‘speaks with plants’. Or maybe talks to or with plants. Crazy feminist leftist troll we had who apparently believed that Vegetables could carry on their side of the conversation. If Mary is to be trusted.

                • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                  Worse, apparently that woman believes that women can have (and had) children without male help.

                  IE the Evil Male Conspiracy convinced women that the only way to have children is to allow men to f*ck them.

                  • OMG. She thinks that women being segregated from men is good for them because they can now bond with other women freely and do not have to waste time learning how to avoid being raped by men.
                    Obviously she never had female relatives. Mine all sniped at each other endlessly…still do…and the men hid from it.
                    OMG

                    • Feminists demand that we allow them women’s only spaces to be safe. I agree but only on the condition they never come out.

                    • I wonder how many people who are demanding female only safe spaces, etc., are also demanding restroom equity, or whatever they’re calling it. :-/

                    • “Obviously she never had female relatives. Mine all sniped at each other endlessly…still do…and the men hid from it.
                      OMG”

                      You’ve obviously been in some of the same places I’ve been, and possibly with some of the same family members… Or, very close parallels.

                      Any idiot who thinks that women were these oppressed wretches, abused victims of the patriarchy, back in ye olden times, is delusional. I think I could just about demonstrate that a large part of the reason men went out raiding and making war was just to get away from all the female politics going on at home. You don’t know how many times, growing up around some parts of the family, that the “safe spaces” being sought were those well away from the women–Like, out in the unheated barn doing unnecessary chores to try to stay warm, while inside the female civil wars raged.

                      I’m here to tell you, I don’t buy the narrative put out by a lot of modern feminists, at all–And, it is because of this stuff that I’ve seen demonstrated in my daily life. Sure, there were some features of the “old society” which could be oppressive, but the point that many miss is that the oppression ran in both directions. It’s clearly a case of abuse when a husband beats his wife, but for some damn reason, when the wife won’t give her husband a moment’s peace at home, and is constantly nagging him about things he can’t fix, but which she wants changed, that’s not abusive? I know male relatives that went to early graves with relief, because of that sort of thing, and nobody ever raised the slightest concern that the wife was abusing the husband… Which, I think she clearly was. Poor bastard died some ten years before she did, and I think the biggest reason was he was just tired of the BS he got at home. He was dead within a year or two of his retirement, and I think he willed himself to death, to be honest–His wife had removed all the joy from his life, and gave him no respite. People who knew him when he was younger described a much different, far happier man. The amazing thing to me was that nobody ever saw what she was doing as abuse, not her kids, not her friends, not anyone else–But, she hounded a decent, if somewhat inept at life, man into the grave.

                      Of course, that’s what I saw as an outsider. Maybe there were secrets I wasn’t privy to, but you could see the evidence of what I’m talking about if you spent more than a day around them.

                      Men may be bigger and stronger, but the sad fact of the matter is that in a contest of verbal wits and personal interaction, they’re often witless striplings, while the women in their lives have spent most of their childhood and adult life honing the edges of their personalities to the point where they can gut someone in nothing flat. And, there’s only so much stress you can put up with–Work is a bitch? And, you’re coming home to deal with the same thing…? Guess why men live shorter lives, and why women so often get their way in personal and home matters.

                      I’d be all for true equality between the sexes. The problem is, the people currently agitating for it don’t want that–They want the playing field permanently slanted in their favor, and want none of the traditional responsibilities and duties associated with the “privileges” they’re in the process of attaining.

                      We’re at a moment of profound imbalance, in the relations between gender roles in society. Something is going to have to change, or a lot of men are just going to do what more and more are–Opt out.

                      Sad thing is, the majority of the victims of this BS, whether they’re male, female, or whatever, have no idea what is going on around them. They can only sense that the grand compact has changed, thanks to the efforts of their “betters”, and they don’t like it.

                      Too much of what goes on in society and human organization is unwritten and unspoken. I think we’d do a lot better, were we to get all this crap out in the open, and make it something we actually discussed, instead of absorbing it from our mother’s milk and popular culture around us, without thinking about it. The path we’re on right now is profoundly unhealthy, and making a lot of people utterly miserable, as they try to cast themselves into roles they’re entirely unsuited for, while ignoring the traditional roles they could have been stars in.

                    • There was a story/joke in Korea of one of their kings in ancient times who called all of his ranking nobles and advisers together and asked all of them who were henpecked to take a step back. All but one man did. The King called him up and asked him “How do you do it?” and the man gave him a look of astonishment and replied, “Oh! No, My wife just told me not to stand in a crowd!”

                      Many women today have forgotten the power the female gender always had. 😛

                    • Go ye and damage your brain on this one (which may have been the post that brought her to this site’s attention):

                      https://witchwind.wordpress.com/2013/12/15/piv-is-always-rape-ok/

                    • Your female relatives were not free to act otherwise because you were oppressing and colonizing them. Hence they were nothing but shells of people, having no independent existence or agency.

                      This, mind you, is a feminist position.

                    • ” restroom equity, or whatever they’re calling it.”

                      To do her justice, it is certain from other things in her blog that she would regard that as male arrogance and would object as strenuously as she dared. (She was, after all, frightened at all the hits that “always rape” post got; it meant men were conspiring to punish her.)

                  • You are a baaaad woman.

                • No, actually, she didn’t troll. She posted an infamous blog post about how all sexual intercourse is rape, and we discussed it here. Along with some of the stranger things on her blog, such as her belief that some women can communicate with plants and learn their properties that way.

                  • BobtheRegisterredFool

                    Mea culpa. Thanks.

                  • Yeah, well.

                    If it had not been for this place and some people who I respect here (one of whom posted a link) I would never have read her infamous blog posts. I don’t think I would ever have believed that anyone could have seriously proposed what she has.

                    She is definitely … unique … we hope.

                    • BobtheRegisterredFool

                      Robert Stacy McCain and Fail Burton/James May have reported about reading a lot of feminist literature. Plant girl doesn’t seem all that unusual in comparison.

                      It very much fits what I deduced some years back from reading a bunch of fantasy, and examining the official feminist stance on the Clinton serial rapes and other matters.

              • SheSellsSeashells

                I’m faaaaaairly certain it was a blogger with “windwitch” in her name. WordPress, maybe. It’s been a while since I saw that particular exercise in idiocy.

                However, if it’s entertainment you want, you can look up Alecto-spelled-with-two-Ls versus Joss Whedon. Just saying.

              • *giggles madly* Speaks with cabbages. That’s a new nickname to tag on the one we usually refer to as Speaks With Plants.

                Sarah’s linked to the blog, but oh man. That’s a pile of crazy there.

                • *grin* Nivenize her. We dub thee: Speaker to Broccoli!

                  • I like the member of the cruciferous family, including broccoli.

                    How about Speaker to Nettles?

                  • Niven-izing along those lines is often a very good thing. I spent an unfortunate amount of time with my (supposed) username on the computers at work set to “Speaker-to-idiots.”

                    At a past employer (early ’90s vintage), we chose to rotate engineers through front-line customer support for two one-week stints each year. This served the dual purposes of (a) teaching the engineers that real customers actually *cared* whether things worked correctly, and (b) ensuring that front-line support had fast access to engineering talent. In fact, it did both of those things very well indeed. But it was sometimes… challenging… for the engineers to remain professional and polite while on the phone with the customers.

                    After one particularly difficult rotation through front-line support, I modified the presentation of my username in the system “finger” database to show me as “speaker-to-idiots.” See, I’d had a few too many phone calls that went something like this:

                    “Take your manual off the shelf. Yes, take the shrink-wrap off. Now, open it to page 324” (or whichever page had the correct index entry). “Good. Now, in the middle of the page you should see an entry for . It refers you to page 124. Go there. Great! In the middle of the page, you’ll see a paragraph beginning…”

                    “I’m SO glad I could help you solve your problem!”

                    I should note that the product was a high-end optimizing compiler for embedded systems — a six-figure piece of software at the time. As a small company with limited resources, we provided a truly excellent manual with **good** trouble-shooting resources, clear explanations, and reference information on just about everything the customer might plausibly need to know. We were hoping to limit the customer support calls to the problems that were actually unusual, or difficult to fix, or otherwise beyond what a manual could reasonably address.

                    Hah!

                    Our allegedly-educated customers preferred to call customer support rather than even attempt to crack open the manual. Sigh. Hence the interaction that relatively-politely rubbed their nose in the fact that they could have looked up the correct answer themselves in less time than they just spent on hold waiting to talk to customer support. It rarely took more than two or three interactions like that before a customer would get in the habit of checking the manual first.

                    • That should have read “… should see an entry for [problem customer was having].”

                      Blasted angle-brackets!

                    • and also:

                      “…see a paragraph beginning…”
                      [pause while customer starts reading…]
                      “I’m SO glad I could help you solve your problem.”

                    • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                      Then there were Operations Staff that were told “always call the programmer in charge” instead of “reading the documentation”.

                      The programmers were Told To Document Problems And What Operations Should do but the Operations Supervisors still told the operators on the spot to Call The Programmer In Charge When There Was A Problem.

                      I hated those late night calls. 😦

                    • Not a tech support story, but something shared to me recently:

                      “How do you make it so I can connect to WoW using TOR?”

                      I’m told the response given was “You idiot.”

                    • “Niven-izing along those lines is often a very good thing. I spent an unfortunate amount of time with my (supposed) username on the computers at work set to “Speaker-to-idiots.””

                      Heh. That’s funny. 🙂

                      We had a writer at Twisting the Hellmouth who was also a tech support weenie and went by “Speaker to Customers”. Don’t know if he’s still active – I haven’t seen anything new posted by him in a long time.

                      We had a member at Renderosity for awhile who thought it was cute to dub me “Speaker to Forumites.” Which it was. Annoying, but cute, and mildly amusing.

                    • He’s been posting his GoT fic at ff.net recently

                    • “The programmers were Told To Document Problems And What Operations Should do but “ – ‘Drak

                      Ah… yeah.

                      At which point we discover that the only problem with that lay in expecting programmers to write intelligible documentation…

                      Kind of like sending out a memo that engineering has to write documents in comprehensible English, at which point you discover that expecting Engineers to be able to write comprehensibly is like teaching cats to be herding dogs.

                      That company soon went back to having us tech people write the documentation. Which meant that since I spoke both programmer and pidgin engineer at the time, I got stuck doing most of the translation. Don’t know what they did after I quit.

                    • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                      I hear you, but it was annoying to get a call for a problem that if they had the documentation, they could have fixed the problem themselves.

                      In some cases, the problem would have waited until morning as nothing depended on that program being completed. 😦

                    • “He’s been posting his GoT fic at ff.net recently”

                      Speaker? Cool. I don’t think I’ve seen anything from him at TTH lately. Good to know he’s still around.

            • They *do* think that resources are limited, and they think they are limited in ways that they are actually not. Many of them actually believe that government should be able to determine exactly how much of those resources any one person needs and assign their portion.

              They also somehow think that no one will ever ever make something they believe into government-prosecuted badthink.

          • Their win state would totally not look like Stalinist Russia or Third Reich Germany. just ask them, no really
            this time, They Will Get It Right
            any claims to the contrary are purest calumny

            heh, delusional

      • Fear leads to anger, and anger leads to hate.

        • I have always found that line of Lucas particularly annoying.

          Fear isn’t something evil–It’s the natural manifestation of experience coupled with an ability to see parallels between things. If the newcomers to your tribe’s hunting area have a predilection towards ambushing lone hunters and killing them, you’re entirely justified being fearful, becoming angry, and then hating the bastards for doing what they did. Following those lines, if you don’t get up off your ass and do something about it, they’re going to progress from killing lone hunters to killing groups of your hunters, and then progress to taking your women, killing your children, and running your hunting area instead of you.

          Lucas is a twat, and the majority of the bullshit he stuck into his movies is so much mindless twaddle. You can tell he never had to do anything “real” in his entire life, and is a spoiled brat who never matured out of that.

          There’s not a damn thing wrong with fear; fear is a great motivator, and a tool. I think Lucas was trying to insert some socially-acceptable thing about “not fearing the outsider” into his movie, and that’s what he came up with, never having had to deal with the actual reality of the situations he was pontificating about. Same with Herbert, only I have a lot less trouble with the Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear–“Fear is the mind-killer…” is an objectively useful thought-tool. Not so much Yoda’s yammerings…

          • The Litany Against Fear has the advantage of acknowledging fear, and fighting it.
            In a funny way, the Prequels have shown Yoda to be an idiot- a hidebound traditionalist unwilling and unable to see the danger of a resurgent Dark Side.

            • Terry Sanders

              The novelization says so quite explicitly. Yoda realizes how stupid he’s been partway through the duels with the Emperor. It’s why he retreats. It’s implied that Dagobah was where he went to spend twenty years trying to figure out where he screwed up.

            • Birthday girl

              Hey I used that Bene Gesserit litany against my mild acrophobia when I was painting way up high … it worked.

          • YellowShapedBox

            While it’s all well and good for most people who know it, the phrase “fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration” has a distinct way of not exactly making me any calmer.

            As far as science-fiction-inspired ways of coping with fear run, I haven’t yet been able to beat “pretend you’re an astronaut dealing with a malfunction.”

            • As far as science-fiction-inspired ways of coping with fear run, I haven’t yet been able to beat “pretend you’re an astronaut dealing with a malfunction.”

              Peril Sensitive Sunglasses. For a cool and relaxed attitude towards danger.

  3. it’s pushback.
    one side goes full turnip and the other side pushes back so hard, they are surpassing potato, approaching turnip in an attempt to counter.
    it is annoying

    OT
    Glad to hear the house thing is looking to be settled. I have an appointment to look at two today.
    Otherwise I have to make another for a rental here.
    Weather is chilly (36f, and it rained Texas Flood style last night) but eating lunch, looking at the water, I watched a Canada Goose decide to chase a Bald Eagle who was hunting the waves.
    Now all I need is for the storage places to call me back so I can off-load my overburdened truck.

    • EVERYONE I know who is going for houses is going through this same thing.

      • I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop on my house purchase. Thought it had, last weekend, but it looks like we’ll only be 9 days delayed.

      • I have been so grateful that we managed to buy last year. We had a couple snatched out from under us (one because the house couldn’t appraise for what they needed it to, and they didn’t have the spare cash to make up the difference.) On the other hand, we wound up with the kind of place we’d dreamed of, but not really hoped for. Smaller house, but we can fix that in a few years. 🙂 I think it’s been going on for a little while. I hope your ending is as happy as ours.

      • I’m going to go with the one here in town. Need to get money out of the bank and make the offer. The other, though nice and little was a bit way out of town. So I shall try for the oldster that will need a new roof soon, but is “stucco” on the exterior and in decent enough shape for rather less money. Hoping it pans out.

        • bid in, should know something tomorrow afternoon.
          Now if the rental I would like to look at would get back in contact with me.
          Looks like I will need to rent for a few months minimum. then again. the rate things are going, I’ll comit to renting and the house will go quickly.

          • I keep thinking we’ll commit to buying, irrevocably, and then the short sale will come through. 😀

            • Idm sure thas if ths paaces falls through, I’ll get the second choice available, then my previous secbond choice (with access to very high speed internet), will become available again.
              Went past it yesterday, sign still out front, place empty as a leftoids head.

              • pesky Chrome (the only brower not crahing for WP on my latop) keep adding random letters or leaing them opf. off. hos the heck noes two s”f” (th s was randov)
                egad
                tqwfrtyuiopasmdwghjklzxcvbddm
                e
                the above fare attemptns to type the keyboard letters in order

            • Update, I just got back in from a mad dash to the nearest existing branch of my bank for a cashiers checque for earnest money and bank printed proof of funds. They took my bid.
              Unfortunately, yesterday I went to do this, and collect some cash for a rental deposit, and the “branch” was gone, and the next nearest was shuttered but the ATM still worked. Got cash and had to head back to get the rental arranged.
              Once I got back in my room, sorted out the laptop again (using a really old install of WattOS now. no crashing so far!) and looked up branches. New Franken was now the closest (east of Green Bay, about an hour and a half to get there) and after offloading the truck at the rental, get the call, off I dash.
              Will go in tomorrow at 10am to sign, and fedex the paperwork in, then head back to Texas.

      • I am becoming highly alarmed about the prospect, and feeling it’s just as well we’re in an apartment and don’t have to worry about also coordinating a sale.

  4. There is an equally dangerous myth of the nobility of the other For example, the tragic recent case of the young European woman who choose to hitchhike to the Middle East in order to prove to the world that love could conquer hate or something equally inane. She was raped and murdered within a week of leaving home.

    I’ve heard less tragic but equally predictable cases from many liberals who decided that they were going to help the oppressed and found their cars broken into outside of the shelter where they were volunteering. The few smart ones reconsider their beliefs, but the majority blame themselves for having privilege or something.

    The bathroom wars are an example of this. I’ve seen so many people say that a “trans-person” would never be violent, but the sad fact is that people with gender identity disorders are drastically over-represented in prison populations. These are not people who are persecuted, these are violent criminals who are also confused about their gender.

    • I’ve seen so many people say that a “trans-person” would never be violent, but the sad fact is that people with gender identity disorders are drastically over-represented in prison populations. These are not people who are persecuted, these are violent criminals who are also confused about their gender.

      And that, right there is why I have the facepalm when I read about the bathroom stuff there. There’s this fantasy that just because a person is transgender/confused about their sexuality/minority/LGBT they’re somehow magically incapable of being bad, assigned special status like a winged unicorn.

      Personally, I think they’re people, like any other. That makes them just as capable as any other ‘group’ of crime, violence, etc. (Statistics actually make it sound worse, honestly, like the rate of domestic violence amongst lesbian couples being supposedly higher.) And then there’s the one about known offenders hiding themselves as trans so that they can screech about being discriminated against. (I personally do not believe they’re ‘real’ transgender people, but criminals who grab on to the group to get their ‘protected status.’)

      • Of course, the real crime which needs to be addressed here is sexual indecency/molestation/rape, whether it takes place in bathrooms or anywhere else. And yeah — the idea of checking the sex of everyone who uses a publc bathroom is absurd. The only way that would work would be if there were no stalls, only open toilets.

        • Do you know ANYONE who wants to check on the sex of everyone who uses the public restroom? I don’t. I do know a LOT of people who don’t want it to suddenly be someone’s civil right to use the bathroom of their choice and can sue any business or city or organization that has a women’s bathroom and asks them to please leave of they’ll call the police after they get complaints of some guy in the women’s bathroom/changing room/showers/locker room/ or sauna leering at them. It isn’t about checking the sex of everyone going into a bathroom; that’s not going to happen any more than it has happened so far. It is about maintaining the existing ability to keep boys from peeping at girls when they are in the privy or undressing. An ability that has worked just fine for 99.9% of people since we started having public restrooms and hasn’t yet led to genitalia inspections. Why would it suddenly lead to it now?

          • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

            Agree nobody wants to “check people’s sex organs” to see if they’re in the correct restroom.

            But the idiots can’t understand why a bunch of women don’t want a person who looks male to enter their restroom and even ignore comments about that issue.

            • No, yes, exactly. BUT they think that people who look male will be raped in male bathrooms if they “feel like a woman”. I mean, if people look convincing NO ONE QUESTIONS it. They just don’t know the real world.

              • Principle: Hard cases make bad law.

                The Administration’s Civil Rights Division has been using Title IX to force schools to open not only their bathrooms, but also the locker rooms and showers to the transgendered. Separate private facilities is not considered an acceptable option. We are still suffering from the failure of the separate but (not) equal accommodations of the past.

                Right or wrong, not all students or parents are comfortable with this arrangement.

                • Yep. It’s not the toilets, though those are bad enough. Not being able to kick out the local perv, because said local perv has gotten wise to the New Law, and knows what to say? And the facility (school, Target, library, what-have-you) has deep pockets so they will enforce it? This ends badly for everyone.

                  And that’s without getting into the public showers, where there’s a strong incentive for pervy guys to play games with the New Tolerance Rules.

                  Because, misandrist as this sounds, the percentage of guys who perve is large enough to make everyone miserable if that corner of human nature is pretended away. There’s a reason you don’t tell your kids, if lost, to find “a nice policeman” but instead, “find a nice mother.”

                  Naturam expellas furca, tamen usque recurret

                • And “transgendered” is defined as “I feel like a woman”
                  Granted, for changing rooms in this case, make a private (preferably somewhat bare. I.e. not a privilege) one available to anyone claiming to be the other sex while in the body of one. Look, outside “I want to see girls naked” this will be very rare. It is simply by virtue of statistics.

                  • And yet the original issue was long-solved by the people who actually have it. My sister lived in a house where was the only genetic female. I visited and I don’t know if I asked of it another visitor did, but they had a simple answer to restroom issues: “Go into the restroom everyone is likely to think you should. Go into a stall and SIT DOWN. (Feet pointing the ‘wrong way’ causes problems.) That’s it.”

                  • Therein lies the problem, the Administration is not accepting separate changing rooms for those in transition as an appropriate accommodation.

                  • Patrick Chester

                    And “transgendered” is defined as “I feel like a woman”

                    So, sort of like this?

                    *runs for cover*

              • No doubt raped by gin-drinking blue-collar workers. If only those poor transgendered people could turn into, I don’t know, DINOSAURS or something like that … Hey, maybe there’s a STORY in that! 😀

          • Sigh. You’re misreading. OF COURSE no one wants to do inspections. But if you want to make a law that only people with a certain equipment can use certain bathrooms, that’s the only way it will be enforced. And it’s not going to be.
            This started by crazy people thinking that trans were being barred from public bathrooms en masse. They’re not, because if they look convincing NO ONE INSPECTS GENITALS.
            This is their public argument though. The private one is that you should be able to use the bathroom because you “feel” like the other genre. And still most of the time, people CAN and do go into the opposite sex bathroom. (I have, when there was a line, at airports. Not often, and with one of the guys as body guards, but needs must when the devil drives. (I’ve also done it twice without thinking, because I was plotting in my head. Guys gave me weird looks, which is what finally woke me up to go “guys. OMG.” But I was done and washing my hands by then.)
            The point is that this is a crazy fight. I completely — TRUST ME ON THIS — understand the concerns that prompted the law, because the other side is fucking asinine. HOWEVER countering with another law is thoroughly ineffective, except in the symbolic sense.
            Private “bathrooms” wouldn’t cost a hell of a lot more, but retrofitting would be a right b*tch in our pinched times. OTOH very convenient for parents of kids of the opposite sex.
            The point being, I’m in sympathy of those making the law to counter the nonsense, but please be aware it REALLY won’t change anything, and there have ALWAYS been pervs in bathrooms, and always will be. Your modesty is hard to guard, and parents should accompany their kids anyway (except I couldn’t, because they’re boys.)
            As soon as we can we should transition to private “rooms” restrooms.

            • William O. B'Livion

              Conservatives generally criticize Progressive policies by saying some variation on “that won’t work”. Progressives generally criticize Conservative policies by saying some variant of “That is mean”.

              > This started by crazy people thinking that trans were being barred
              > from public bathrooms en masse

              No, this was started by leftists who needed or wanted another “you’re mean” stick to beat conservatives with. It’s not an accident that this is coming up in an election year when the Left has such horrible candidates that they talked a very rich clown into running as a Republican.

              If you can clearly identify a male in a woman’s toilet then he should be one of “red faced, apologizing profusely and backing out at full speed”, have a pipe wrench in his hand, or be arrested.

            • William O. B'Livion

              Oh and:
              > Private “bathrooms” wouldn’t cost a hell of a lot more…

              With modern building codes yes, they would.

            • Reality Observer

              I’m trying to imagine the international symbol for “distracted writer” restrooms.

              Not that it would help…

              • That’s easy. “Opened manhole cover.”

                Of course, the one thing I’ve learned about “international symbols” is that they’re seldom obvious to anyone but their creators. I still haven’t figured out why “on” and “off” became a line and a circle, or why the city removed the old “WALK” and “DON’T WALK” lights and replaced them with the international symbols for “joshua tree” and “backache”…

                I inherited a Dodge truck. The HVAC system is an utter mystery, apparently using “color” and random symbols. The owner’s manual is probably still sitting in the original purchaser’s drawer somewhere… I can randomly move controls until something useful happens, but that’s awkward in 75mph traffic.

                • I still haven’t figured out why “on” and “off” became a line and a circle

                  I always equated it with binary (1 and 0).

                  • Unlikely. The average person has no clue about binary. I can do binary arithmetic, but if they’re ones and zeroes, I don’t see any connection to “on” and “off.”

                    • BobtheRegisterredFool

                      If On is: |
                      If Off is: O

                      | would be a simplification of the diagram for a closed switch, indicated a closed circuit.
                      O does not look much like |, and helps remind you of Open Circuit.

                      If I’ve gotten it mixed up…

                    • It’s patriarchy. (runs.)

                    • Yeah, I know most people don’t know binary… that’s just how I think of it. Visualizing it as a light, a “1” means the light is on, and a “0” means the light is off.

                      Of course, I’ve also had someone at work tell me I think sideways.

                    • Well, I checked several pages returned in a search for “origin power symbol”, and they all said it was referring to the binary, but I actually wonder if it didn’t originally referred to a time when “In” and “Out” were the “On” and “Off” positions of the power button.

                • Civilization moved away from hieroglyphics for a reason.

              • No. We’d still go in the others. Both those times happened when I was writing six books in a year, and btw, it was because it was something I was used to, like a grocery store, with the plant reversed as they sometimes are. I was just following familiar routine, mind elsewhere.

                • Reality Observer

                  I’m trying to figure out whether your experiences are more embarrassing than when the Personal Positioning System says there is a door (where there is not), or that it opens the other way.

                  I haven’t done it as a writer of fiction (yet) – but I have had several humiliating (and somewhat painful) experiences when concentrating on a code problem.

              • Dragons trump gender

                • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                  No sane male Dragon would enter the female Dragon’s restroom. 😉

                  • Which is why we have two here, given Fluffy and the golden sea serpent in minion pool — or if you prefer, she-serpent.

            • Private restrooms are essentially unaffordable, at this point. Even in America, they’re unaffordable, because of all the construction issues.

              Here’s a point I think you’re neglecting, Sarah: I think you’re missing out on the problem we have with sexual deviants–And, I’m not talking about Rupaul, either. I had probably a half-dozen encounters, growing up, with adult men who behaved inappropriately in public restrooms, on buses, and a couple of other venues. And, believe me, I’m understating what these freaks tried–One of them required me sticking a Buck knife into his stupid ass, literally, to get him to move on.

              The root problem with this whole “let them use what bathroom they identify with” BS is that while you’re thinking of Rupaul, who I understand is a fairly delightful individual in person, and who would never take advantage of the opportunity to abuse someone else, the people against these changes to public policy are no doubt thinking of innumerable cases where sexual deviants have used people’s vulnerability in restrooms to conduct sexual assaults.

              And, those happen, a lot more often than gets broadcast by the media, and the victims of those assaults are usually the vulnerable. By design, most public restrooms are basically traps. You have to put yourself into a cul-de-sac in order to use the toilet, the locks don’t work worth crap, and the stall doors don’t go to the ceiling or down to the floor. If you’re a male, you wind up having to turn your back to the main room while using a urinal, and by the nature of the situation, you can’t watch your back.

              I’ll give you a tip, here, for free: If you ever walk into a male bathroom, for whatever reason, and find that someone has broken out the mirror above the sinks? Odds are fairly good that that didn’t happen by accident–Friend of mine who was a cop in California pointed that out to me as something done to make it easier to take someone by surprise in the bathrooms, and that they’d caught a couple of sex offenders who’d break those mirrors out deliberately, when they were setting up their “hunting areas”. Broken mirrors? Be on your guard–Those may not have been broken on accident, or by misadventure, but deliberately.

              This whole issue is another one of those cases where the deviants are warping public policy in the name of “rights”. The last time was during the height of the AIDS epidemic, where classic tools of public health were deemed “off-limits” because of the “sensitivities of the victims”. It was bad policy then, and it’s bad policy now. The population of genuinely abused transgendered individuals who are traumatized by not being able to use the right bathroom is a lot smaller than the population of sexual deviants who are going to try to take advantage of the changes in public policy. That fact is only going to be learned thru sad experience, and likely will become another one of those “unspeakable issues” in public discourse, while the quality of life for the general public is going to be vastly lessened.

              • “Here’s a point I think you’re neglecting, Sarah: I think you’re missing out on the problem we have with sexual deviants–And, I’m not talking about Rupaul, either. I had probably a half-dozen encounters, growing up, with adult men who behaved inappropriately in public restrooms, on buses, and a couple of other venues. And, believe me, I’m understating what these freaks tried–One of them required me sticking a Buck knife into his stupid ass, literally, to get him to move on.” – Kirk

                This. Yes.

                I had those experiences as a kid and teen, like Kirk. Like Kirk, I once had to ah… defuse the situation by showing him that I had a sheath knife and was capable of using it. (Texas kid in the 60s and 70s. Of course I carried a blade. Didn’t everyone?)

                People like our pre-op trans waitress when I worked at the Boston Sea Party are not the problem – even if a lot of them are currently agitating the situation into a problem. Dude looked like a lady. Convincingly. When the gang of us went out to country bars after work to dance (and some to drink), he/she went into the Women’s room. And presumably went into a stall, did her thing, then left it, did her makeup, and came back out.

                And no one gave a crap. Not even rednecks at a C&W bar in the mid eighties.

                At the very worst, he/she got some cat calls and rude jokes from a few half drunk Drug Store cowboys. Everyone gets rude jokes and cat calls at a C&W bar when spirits are high. No makey no big deal.

                The problem comes in when you have a much different situation, with a much different type of male who is not attempting to blend in and just take a leak and do his makeup…

                The Left has jumped on this as their latest “Hey, let’s outrage the Mundanes” shock tactic to try and push the Overton Window farther to the Left, and to legally harass the squares. And that’s all it is: harassment, and another front in the culture war for them, like gay marriage was. Once they win it, they’ll move on to the next outrage du jour. And the next.

                They are not helping the situation. They are not helping trans people. And yes, I know that I just stated the obvious twice, thanks.

            • The ‘feel’ part is where the sticking point is, honestly. I mean, I come from a country where the really effeminate trans/gay* population is capable of looking, often, better than a real woman. I generally don’t even recall any time where I notice the bading in a group of women in a restroom. The ones who look male don’t try to go in, I think, and the ones who look male don’t try to go into the women’s bathroom. There’s a line though, somewhere, before they’re allowed in, and I think it generally has to do with how comfortable the women are with the bading in question about going to the restroom, and really, when they’re part of the flock that goes to the restroom in a group (it’s a weird social thing) chattering away, nobody pays attention / cares.

              Probably, and I’m guessing here, because a mtf bading or one who’s at least willing to put in the effort of looking like a woman and passing is mentally accepted to be 1) not interested sexually in women, thus 2) not a threat to the women in the room. Most of them are likely to even still have the bait and tackle, so to speak, (since the surgery is expensive, though boob jobs are more common last I recall.)

              But I think for the most part, it has to do with comfort. Men would not be comfortable with a female looking bading coming out of one of the stalls. There’s a bit of willingness, I gather, to accommodate that on the female side of things, but with certain social rules (which, I admit, aren’t my purview because, straight, female…) that the bading community follow.

              I’ll stop rambling now. I’m not caffinated, and haven’t had enough sleep.

              *the line is somewhat smudged where I come from. Bading is a sort of catchall term for both male gays and male-to-female transgender, and crossdressing gay men.

              • In August of 1977 we took The Spouse’s youngest sibling down to Tulane to start college. Best show we saw on Bourbon Street in New Orleans was one that featured female impersonator acts. They had to work hard to create an illusion — as opposed to simply wobble what God gave them.

            • Hey! We could get a ton of those TSA machines. or put the TSA to work at restrooms (where they no doubt would be as effective at the job as they are now)

          • My understanding is that it was a defensive maneuver after charlotte ordered private businesses to comply. Seems to be a ‘Don’t spook the horses’ law but obviously it is discriminatory and badly misrepresented. For instance in NC the birth certificate can be updated to legal gender. Defense against that Chicago lawsuit where a private changing room was not enough.

            It is the misrepresentation that pisses me off the most. No, doctors of medics cannot refuse to treat you. A shrink or counselor doesn’t have to help transition is all. And so on. And meanwhile there is no need for understanding those that have other priorities.

            • The guy pushing this in Charlotte is a sex offender. So there’s that.

              • I will just ask what caused it. Too easy to get on that list sometimes

                • Google turns up that he was convicted of sexual molestation of a minor.

                  It’s a sad, but true, fact that when you stop to look deeper into a lot of these situations, the “activists” have very, very shady backgrounds. Not to mention, motivations.

                  • Ah. Damn. Ya…that is disturbing, especially since probably a number will defend him

                    • Knowing one of those, even that sometimes can be explained, but one realy needs to “be there” to make that call.
                      Know a guy who was gotten drunk, then a minor put in bed with him so the police would have some juicy “proof” when they showed up.
                      His lawyer was raking in the hours trying to get his name cleared, but as close as it was when I last heard, it was 3 years of being on said list and not a good clue that it would soon be cleared up. Lawyer was working on the minor trying to get a recant before she was able to be sued for false testamony as an adult in civil court (that was his tactic anyhow)

            • For those interested, the text of North Carolina’s HB2:

              http://www.ncleg.net/Sessions/2015E2/Bills/House/PDF/H2v4.pdf

              • And a follow up:

                http://www.wral.com/mccrory-wants-lawmakers-to-reverse-part-of-hb2/15637742/

                Specifically, the governor called on lawmakers to reverse a part of the law, known as the Public Facilities Privacy & Security Act, which prevents North Carolina workers who believe they’ve been wrongfully fired due to sex, age, race or gender from suing in state court.

                While the bathroom / locker room / shower issue is getting plenty of national coverage other provisions in the law — not so much.

          • Feather Blade

            “It’s about maintaining the existing ability to keep boys from peeping at girls…”

            And, let’s be fair, vice-versa. I can picture a bunch of twittering girls using the men’s to peep and mock.

        • > no stalls, only open toilets.

          Fairly common here in the South. Apparently some people are absolutely convinced that persons of the hummu-SEXual persuasion use them as trysting places, therefore they try to persuade them to go elsewhere by eliminating privacy for, er, elimination.

          First the doors to the stalls were taken down. Then they went to waist-high half-stalls. Eventually some places realized they could save money by getting rid of the stalls entirely, I guess.

          • Apparently some people are absolutely convinced that persons of the hummu-SEXual persuasion use them as trysting places

            Uhm…they do.

            If you are brave enough google “glory hole locations” and pick a city (there are multiple websites that display them and other hookup information). Plenty are in adult bookstores in the video booths but there are also plenty in public restrooms.

        • scott2harrison

          In more and more cases the doors are being removed from the stalls because of drugs or something.

      • scott2harrison

        ” the rate of domestic violence amongst lesbian couples being supposedly higher”

        I don’t think that this is a lesbian thing. Apperently the rate of domestic violence among gay male couples is significantly lower with straight couples in the middle. This suggests that the violence is a woman thing rather than a lesbian thing.

        • Preaching to the choir, my friend. I’m not particularly fond of my own sex’s tendency to be vicious, illogical, backbiting, spiteful, insecure, petty little bitches. With fistfights no longer an option for a lot of people in high school, the whole social scene has become, well, what used to be the girl’s side of high school – and it’s no longer limited to just school.

          Still, if it’s a woman thing, as you say, that’s still two women in a relationship, doubling the problem, especially when the natural inclination of two women is generally, to compete with each other for attention.

      • Ed Gein, like the character based on him in “The Silence of the Lambs,” was collecting women’s skins from murder victims and graveyard vandalism in order to make a “woman suit” to help him become a woman.

        • He apparently was also the basis for the killer in Psycho (the Hitchcock original), although that character had Mommy issues, and had dug up his deceased mother and dressed in her skin and clothes to “become” her.

      • the rate of domestic violence amongst lesbian couples being supposedly higher

        I have both direct evidence (holding off a neighbor’s ex-gf until the police got there) and indirect (discussions with lesbian friends) that at the very least belie the idea lesbians are sweet and loving and harmless. Those same friends have said that lesbians have more domestic violence.

        Then there is the well known truism in the S&M scene that no one plays harder than lesbians and even among straights the nastiest tops tend to be women.

        • Is anyone surprised by that? Anyone?
          My father gave me some advice once for breaking up a fight. If it was two guys, just get between them and break them apart from each other, and they’ll quit.
          If it’s two girls, break out a fire hose.

          • With two chicks fighting, set up a set of bleachers and sell tickets. Once they realize the amount of attention they’re getting, one of two things will happen: Either they’ll turn the fight into a riot when they attack the audience together, or the social embarrassment will make them stop.

            Had a pair of female soldiers going at it in the barracks one night, over roommate issues. I don’t know what engendered the fight, but I presume it was either borrowed clothes or boyfriends, with those two. They’re going at it, the Charge of Quarters runs over and gets me from Staff Duty, and I walk in on a fairly vicious running fight between not two roommates, but all six females we had in the barracks that night.

            How’d I restore order? Told ’em to stand fast, I wanted to go get some popcorn and a chair, and maybe sell some tickets. It probably didn’t help that I critiqued their outfits, and suggested showing some more skin, suggesting we could make more money if they were willing to take it outside into the basketball court, get some baby oil or mud, and wear bikinis…

            Cue the red faces and sudden retreats to their own rooms. Peace was suddenly restored, and amity reigned amongst women. I’d have never gotten away with that with a bunch of guys–The last time I had to break up a barracks brawl with males, it took a bunch of bigger idiots with pick-mattock handles to get their attention.

    • Reality Observer

      Hit the nail on the head there. Confusion about sexual identity is a disorder – mental, sometimes with a physical basis, sometimes entirely physical for a very few unfortunates.

      The problem is, as with all other disorders – where do you draw the line for where the disorder only affects yourself, and should be ignored, and where it affects other people (negatively).

      I have a disorder – I am a book hoarder (which probably makes this place a “safe space” for me). So long as it is only myself that trips over piles, or gets frustrated by not finding the book I’m currently thinking of, I can and should be left alone with my problem. But – if it were to reach the point of my stealing books from the library or a bookstore, or my house became a public health or fire hazard – that is when “society” would have the right and duty to intervene and either attempt to cure my illness, or at least make it more difficult for it to affect others.

      Now, I do have one major problem with the law – it should except those who have completed “transition” to the other gender, such as is possible these days. That is a major undertaking that those with the disorder of wanting to watch the other gender “do their business” are not going to go through.

      (I would note that there is one unconsidered purpose for the law. There are other laws on the books – everywhere, even in the bluest of States – that prohibit “exhibitionism.” Once one allows those who “identify” as the opposite gender, despite their physical equipment, to use the other bathroom, you cannot charge them with violation of the exhibitionism laws for exposing that equipment, such being necessary for the purposes of the restroom.)

      • Someone who has legally transitioned and has an updated birth certificate and other ID would be treated as his or her legal gender under these laws, regardless of birth gender. That has always been the case, and no one I know about is seeking to change that.

        • Reality Observer

          Ah. See another comment of mine here – obviously it wasn’t a big enough issue for me to do proper research!

          OK, that works for me, then.

      • Exactly. It is a tool to prevent bad actors.

    • The woman killed in a refugee shelter in… Denmark?
      Yep. The other is still human and sometimes has issues. Denying they have the full range of human behavior is one of the things the left does to ALL minorities. Except anti-communist minorities, of course.

    • Mt last violent encounter before gettingTFO of LA was a tranny who decided he/she/they was/were took over our bus at gunpoint and demanded the cops bring him/her/them Berry Gordy to express his live for him/her/them.

      Having a gunwaving tranny inside the bus and a swarm LA County Sheriff’s Deputies (we’re talking NYPD level shooting skills and judgment here) was not a comfortable experience.

  5. We got a nibble on our fix-‘er-upper.

  6. > surely the paper wasn’t allowed to print falsehoods, right?

    I’ve occasionally been astounded when encountering otherwise normal-seeming, well-educated adults who believe there is “someone” who authorizes, fact-checks, and approves the printed newspapers. And if there isn’t, there ought to be.

    “TASS is pleased to announce…”

    • The editor or publisher.

      • If the editorial board is composed of people who are all on the same end of the ideological spectrum, there will be gaping holes in their knowledge, their thinking, and their reporting.

  7. There’s also the Gell Mann Amnesia Effect (summarized below by Michael Crichton)

    Briefly stated, the Gell-Mann Amnesia effect is as follows. You open the newspaper to an article on some subject you know well. In Murray’s case, physics. In mine, show business. You read the article and see the journalist has absolutely no understanding of either the facts or the issues. Often, the article is so wrong it actually presents the story backward—reversing cause and effect. I call these the “wet streets cause rain” stories. Paper’s full of them.

    In any case, you read with exasperation or amusement the multiple errors in a story, and then turn the page to national or international affairs, and read as if the rest of the newspaper was somehow more accurate about Palestine than the baloney you just read. You turn the page, and forget what you know.

    We know the media gets stuff wrong – frequently badly and completely ass about – yet we still accept what they tell us about other people and places that we aren’t familiar with

    • Reality Observer

      More significant, though, is the “meme matching” effect.

      If you truly believe that wet streets cause rain – you will believe that article. If you are an absolutist Zionist – you won’t believe anything of the Palestinian article.

      Every one of us has that somewhere – but some (and most of the people here are among that “some”) know this, and try to get to the actual facts before deciding on our “belief” quotient.

      I mostly use the news (of whatever ideological bent) as a starting point – if it is an issue that I actually care about, then I start digging for the truth and falsehoods that lie behind every story. Which does make the media a useful tool.

      For example, the meme that “Donald Trump is a Nazi, because David Duke endorsed him.” Well, digging down, Duke didn’t actually endorse him, nor did the Donald embrace the lukewarm approval of that slime. (I have plenty of legitimate reasons to despise Trump, but based on actual fact, not media portrayals.)

    • Years ago I took a college class taught by a investigator for the city fire department. He brought in a scrapbook in which he had placed incident reports in with copies of the newspaper accounts of those incidents. He had marked all the discrepancies in the newspaper accounts with red highlighter. There was a enormous amount of red ink in that book and not a single article that didn’t have any.

  8. YellowShapedBox

    We can try
    To understand
    The New York Times’ effect on man!

    –Andy Scott’s ringtone

  9. I could understand an outright declaration that all bathrooms were to become unisex facilities. Everyone would be on the same footing.

    My objection to the “transgender” is that they create another privileged class. If I walk into the ladies’ room I’m subject to various charges from “disturbing the peace” to third degree assault. But if I say I’m feeling a bit transgendered at the moment, well, that’s all right hir, use any facility you want.

    Was there such a thing as “reverse thoughtcrime”? There is now…

    • Again, this is thoroughly unneeded. IF a person is transgender to the point of being “living as the other gender” they might look a bit “off” but no one is going to bother them. Because there’s enough born with the genitals who look a bit “off” (I used to have one friend you had to squint at her inconsequential chest to realize she was female.) And no one bothers them. This is not creating a privileged class, even, it’s creating a crazy-cakes class. People who feel different sexes on different days? Bah.

      • And I knew a guy (yes, he really was a he) who made the mistake of wearing a mesh shirt and revealing HIS hourglass figure. Fortunately for him he was thin and flat-chested.

      • Not always. Many years ago I knew a trans-gendered woman who practically lived in cute sundresses, complete with tasteful makeup. Unfortunately, she was built like a linebacker. She was living as a woman, and was post-op (so legally WAS a woman) but still looked like a big ugly dude in a dress. She regularly beat the living snot out of gay/trans bashers. It always amazed me how many dumb asses would bother her.

        On the other hand, also many years ago, I worked with a lesbian woman who was very plain looking, and fairly flat chested. She didn’t intentionally “live as a man”, but was often mistaken for one. Although, when she got really drunk when we were out at the bars she did tend to follow either me or one of the other guys into the restroom and pee standing at the next urinal over. Other than the occasional drunken use, she always went to the ladies room. I never did figure out how exactly she managed that trick, and I wouldn’t “peek” over the stall at another dude, so I sure wasn’t going to to her. I did wonder for a long time if she was secretly a guy until I saw her naked once (on accident)… and no… definitely not a guy. She finally admitted that she did the urinal trick because she knew it made her guy friends uncomfortable, which she found really funny when she was drunk.

        • Someone on another discussion thread on another website related an incident that their father had told them – he had seen it done in a public lavatory in Paris, many, many years ago; Pop was just going up to the urinals, when a girl in men’s clothes appeared, folded a postcard in half , unfastened trou, and basically used the folded postcard as a funnel into the next urinal over. Pop was so impressed that he quite forgot to be embarrassed.

          (My current WIP has a girl disguising herself as a boy for purposes of plot, so I took note of that stratagem. I think it would work very well, too — there was some sort of military project, a decade or two ago, to create a disposable cardboard funnel, so that female troops could pee in the field without practically getting undressed.)

        • Reminds me of the pancake hut in Nearby Larger City, where the gay bar one block down closed at 2am… same time as the redneck bar one block up. Dunno if I told this story here before or not.

          At the time I was crew for another show running in that town as a favor for a friend. We’d go eat at the pancake hut when the shenanigans went on. See, when the drag queens, in four inch heels no less, got to whuppin’ up on the rednecks, well…

          I got to see one particularly impressive specimen *pick up* one of said beery rednecks and toss him clear through a plate glass window, before opening a can on the other two. I gather he made a pass at one of the actual females in the group, and didn’t want to take no for an answer…

          *chuckle*

          Thanks for reminding me of that. Safely a decade or so in the past now, I can actually laugh at the things that went on!

  10. YellowShapedBox

    Anyway, I’ll just note that the proposed solution – Let Them Rent Typewriters – will be highly ineffective as long as it remains online. On the Internet, you almost never get new opinions worthy of consideration if you weren’t open to seeking that out in the first place. In the likely event that you can’t get a wide release – take it to the neighborhood, the bus station, the student plaza. Real life is unfiltered, and much more our game.

  11. Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

    What’s sad is that they don’t believe their “chosen oppressor class” would really fight back.

    Oh they have those “stories” about what happens if they “enter those areas” but they don’t appear to really worry about having to deal with a mob of the “oppressor class” coming after them. 😦

    • Exactly. The oppressor is all powerful but once they leave the oppressor roof no one cares

  12. The issue I’ve always had is the “Pro-life violence against abortion clinics is as systematic and pervasive as Islamic Terrorism.”
    The people who say this demonstrate truly appalling logic. If Christians in the United States were as terroristic as, say, the Muslim Brotherhood, there would not be a single abortion clinic outside of a few liberal enclaves. Instead, you would have abortion clinics run out of unmarked white vans, surreptitiously moving from town to town.
    Since we don’t have that issue…

  13. Here we have another example of a minority trying to create privilege for themselves in the guise of persuading the courts to mandate tolerance.Since this also serves the politicians who have gained political power by hopping onto the LGBT and feminist bandwagons, as well as the columnists and broadcasters who get viewers (and advertising dollars) by reporting controversy, and the lawyers who rack up billable hours by getting involved, the cause seems gather momentum, I certainly don’t know specifically what other organized interests are involved, but I see their shadows and I can feel the weight they are putting behind making this an issue. So, there is a counter-reaction by those who object to court-created law, of getting legislatures involved: which chiefly creates more laws.
    The fundamental problem here is that it is not possible to create tolerance and neighborly good will either by force of law or by stirring up controversy. Eventually, the buildup of absurdly asinine law in place of finely-tuned good sense becomes stifling, and law (both good and bad) is abandoned, while controversy threatens to rip society apart into warring tribes.

  14. And when the leaders place themselves above any and all laws the end result is not good.

  15. If someone said they did and it was right there in the paper, surely the paper wasn’t allowed to print falsehoods, right?

    This morning my mind is playing a great game of either pin ball or working on a connect the dots. It hasn’t quite decided yet. Anyway, a few of the things that are bouncing around in there as a result of the above statement:

    Logic and reason have very little to do with how things play out in the human world, nor what one believes should or should not be.

    My In-Laws and I were watching the news. The talking heads were holding a discussion about some or another spending rise that the Congress was proposing. One suggested that there was not the money available. During the commercial break The Father-In-Law and I agreed that the money wasn’t there. The Mother-In-Law insisted that as no one could not spend what they do not have the government must have the money or they could not pass such a bill. (I wish it were so.)

    and

    There is a song by Tom Paxton whose chorus runs:

    Daily New, daily views,
    Pick up a paper anytime you choose,
    Seven little pennies in the newsboy’s hand
    And you ride right away to Never Never Land…

    • Has your MIL never heard of this thing called credit cards?
      Is the concept of anyone writing a bad check totally foreign to her?
      The true crime is that our elected officials somehow believe that government finances work any different from what we poor wage slaves must endure.

      • The M-I-L believed that one should live within their means and pay what one owes. She was one of those rare people who paid off credit cards every month. She knew very well that there were people who wrote bad checks, they were either incompetent book keepers or criminal.

        What she just could not grasp was that our government could and would be allowed to do such a thing.

        • Sara the Red

          Sadly, a disturbing number of folks have forgotten one of the basic tenets of being a free-thinking human: Never, ever, ever trust your government. Ever.

          A disturbing number of people will happily say ‘Of course!’ if asked whether or not they trust the government…

          • The Other Sean

            What gets me is the progressives (often the same individuals, in fact) who both decry our government as untrustworthy, spying, warmongering, and controlled by the corporations – and shout that the only entity that can be trusted to solve “problems” X,Y,Z is….. that same government.

          • Government is simply the name for things we choose to do together.

            Like rioting and other examples of herd mentality.

            • And sending people to extermination camps. Yep.

              • Am I a bad person if, when that happens, I feel some schedenfreude when the various activists for sexual minorities and the members of those minorities are put in the same cars (or maybe even earlier cars) as my cis, white, mostly straight, able-bodied, Christian male self?

                • Well…you are a bad person but not because of that.

                • Reality Observer

                  Considering that I’ll probably be one of those up on the hill to pick off the train guards for y’all… I’m wondering if I’ll see any differences in who runs away faster, the Herbs or the Lady That Talks To Herbs…

                  • HerbN will probably head for your position to grab a weapon and keep the counterfire off of you.

                    • While Sarah is sneaking behind the guards with a knife. Or a stiletto heel. or part of a seat. Whichever.

                    • I hope I have the courage to die in the streets instead of a camp with head up, on the bounce, and still swinging when I go down.

                    • Me too. You never know, depending on how you feel when the call comes, right?

                    • Yes, but Sarah, you get the advanced version where you’re expected to be calling out orders while doing it. Don’t worry, though, you’ve got quite the collection of platoon sgts to ask for advice if you need it…I suspect some even would be worthy of the name Zim.

                • No. it’s human. And I will too. And I think they’ll be ahead of us.

                • Nope. Although if I’m still out I’ll probably at least try to sabotage the train.

                  • Beware the bookish ones. We’re read enough to get the basic idea and we’re crazy enough to try it.

                    “Gee, [author] got everything right except the part about when the cars would decouple. Cool!”

                    • Which series is it where the deadliest mercenaries come from El Greco, a planet previously home to a bunch of academics who, upon being invaded, looked up everything in their databases about guerrilla war?
                      I think it’s the Liaden universe, but I’m not sure.

                    • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

                      David Weber’s _In Fury Born_ (expansion of _Path Of The Fury_).

                    • Ah, thank you. I need to go re-read that.
                      (And get some books about the partisan war in Yugoslavia in World War, Part II: Son of World War, the Revenge. No, these are not a just-in-case-measure, whyever would you think that…)

                • “Am I a bad person if, when that happens, I feel some schedenfreude when the various activists for sexual minorities and the members of those minorities are put in the same cars (or maybe even earlier cars) as my cis, white, mostly straight, able-bodied, Christian male self?”

                  Make use of the opportunity to quietly strangle a few of them in the crush.

  16. LaFou, I’m afraid I’ve been thinking.
    A dangerous pastime.
    I know.

  17. As for fears your kids will be assaulted…

    There is no guarantee that same sex bathroom keep children safe from sexual assault. Sexual predators come in almost all* orientations.

    * I do have trouble imagining an A-sexual sexual predator, but the what a given individual might do has surprised me before.

    • I once took Marshall into a stall at an amusement park. He was… 5? On the way we passed a stall in which two women were OBVIOUSLY going at it hot and heavy. (There were two men and two sets of kids patiently waiting outside.) NOT sexual predators, obviously (though I disapprove of infidelity) but it made it very fun to explain to the kid. I BELIEVE I used “someone is not feeling well and the other person is helping.” Eh.

      • Oh dear. Yes. How unfortunate. I am so sorry.

        I don’t like the idea of being less than truthful to a child, but some questions are just not in the appropriate to explain it in this place and at this time menu – particularly with a child who might just continue to ask questions loudly and at length.

        • Which both of mine would, yes…

        • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

          I’m told that one time I saw a group of Nuns and some how I got this question about Nuns having babies.

          I don’t know how young I was but my parents told me to wait until we got home before getting the answer.

          So I kept quiet about that question until after an hour to two hour trip home, I immediately asked the question when we got to our house. [Very Big Grin]

          Note, I don’t remember how my parents answered my question. [Evil Grin]

          • Reality Observer

            Mine were in Catholic School – and the Principal told a parent’s group that they were asked that at least once every year…

            IIRC, the standard answer was something like “We already have so many children to take care of now…”

            • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

              I think about the only thing I knew about Nuns then was “It’s a Catholic thing that our church doesn’t do”. 😀

          • “Note, I don’t remember how my parents answered my question. [Evil Grin]”

            Its implicit in the name, son: they’re called Nuns ’cause they have none, they can’t have none, and they ain’t never gonna get none.

            • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

              Our family is Baptist, but they wouldn’t have joked about Nuns that way.

      • The Other Sean

        I went to an event and there was a line for the one, single-person, unisex restroom on that floor. There were like two guys and a woman ahead of me, and as we waiting another couple ladies and a guy got into line. Finally, after what seemed like an eternity, the door opened, and attractive blonde woman walked out… followed a few steps behind by a man with a really big grin. I shall leave others to draw the conclusions.

        • Reality Observer

          Yep. To me, the real problem most places is that there are way too few restrooms. (And, honestly, as a guy – I agree with the wife that there should be two Ladies for each Mens.)

      • Those women clearly had an unrealistic level of confidence in the hygiene of such facilities.

        I, having had jobs that entailed keeping public facilities tidy, if not actually clean, much less sanitary, am inclined to emulate our friends the bears … and go in the woods.

  18. “(As for fears your kids will be assaulted, I feel for you, but you realize no one is checking genitals and there are no bathroom guards, so people can and do sneak in and assault the unsuspecting, anyway. Yes, yes, no reason encouraging it, but seriously. Making a law against people using the other bathroom would obligate you to check genitals, and you know that we’re not going there either. ”

    Sarah, I thought you were above such terrible straw man arguments. It doesn’t become a problem only when an assault happens. What about privacy? Shame? There is a reason we have laws again peeping toms. There are reasons we didn’t let the high school boys shower with the girls after PE.

    In a sane world what happens when some guy is hanging out at the girls changing room of the municipal pool leering at girls? Now what will happen once it is his civil right to do so as long as he says the nagic ‘I feel like a woman’ words. Now he gets to sue the town
    for violating ‘her’ civil rights. The city worker who called security and the cop are then questioned by the FBI for civil rights violations. In a sane world what happens when Johnny would like to see the girls shower after PE? Porky’s aside, he is prohibited. Now he says the magic words, is allowed, and the school administrators don’t tell the girls parents what they let happen, then bluster and eventual shrug.

    So the city closed its shower changing rooms. Girls stop showering after PE, which generally goes away until the next ‘Move, Fatty!’ federal busybody campaign. Bathrooms become unisex (daddy’s will stop sending Maria into the womens room alone and will instead start going in with them to make sure, and just say the magic lie if questioned. Then shortly after when little Ali has to go real bad and the men’s room is full, daddy will take him yo the women’s, armed with the magic lie.). I don’t know what private gyms and Ys will do but it will probably cost a bunch and then everyone gets private changrerooms (sauna removed).

    Is it worth all that additional expense and inconvenience to solve a nonexistent problem? Hey, we’re a rich society. Signaling virtue costs money (preferably someone else’s).

    • I don’t worry particularly about unisex, single-room bathrooms, with a latch on the door – been there, done that in any number of military and retail settings over the last four decades.
      And I figure, given the actual numbers of post-op trannies in the world that my changes of sharing, or having shared a multi-stall ladies room with one are about on par with being kidnapped by space aliens.

      The concern is – what about those locker and changing rooms, and multi-stall bathrooms when a perv, stalker, peeping tom, rapist or pedophile cab simply claim to be feeling female that day, waltzes into the female locker, changing room or bathroom … and there is nothing that can be done, because the laws say he is allowed to do so.

      I’d think twice, about my safety, and certainly about my privacy. And there are women who very seriously object to being the object of some perv getting his jollies. I should tell the story of my daughter, who was visiting in Miami and out bar-hopping with another girl she had served with in the Marines. In the particular bar, there was a guy sneaking pictures with his cellphone – up women’s skirts. He tried it with my daughter – who asked him very nicely to get away from her with his damned cellphone – the first time. The second time, she smashed his cellphone on the bar, and began dribbling the guys head on the bar, like a basketball. She had bruises on her upper arms the next day, where the other people in the bar hauled her off him.

      The last she saw of El Pervo was him being thrown out of the bar, and no, she didn’t worry about him complaining to the police. He had been an absolute pest in the bar all evening, and really – complain about being beaten up by a girl?

      Yeah, stuff like that is going to start happening, when women begin to feel threatened in bathrooms and locker rooms. Won’t be pretty, but then being a perv ought to have some risk attached to it.

      • I’d have bought Blondie a beer, for that, if I’d been there.

        Thing is, there’s a bit of a problem with that whole idea that increased risk of receiving an ass-beating will reduce the number of pervs: A lot of them are aroused by the risk, and the ass-beating actually makes it better for them, offering heightened arousal and excitement. That freak probably went home and had the most ecstatic night of his voyeuristic sex life.

        Sad to say, but the only effective cure with all too many of these “types” is killing. There’s something irreparably wrong with the pleasure loop in their minds, and I don’t think it’s curable at this point. And, likely not for a long damn time–One guy I knew who had very similar urges, but who had the innate decency to fight them went on medication, and the only thing which worked also turned him into a passionless zombie. He effected his own cure later on, via suicide. Or, so I was told by someone who only knew half the story–The suicide may have been unrelated to the issues I knew he was working through.

        Dear God, I just want to know one damn thing: Why the hell did you make it so people keep telling me this crap, late at night on duty somewhere? I think I must have taken more “true confessions” from my fellow soldiers than our Catholic chaplain did, looking back on it. And, without the training to be able to set that crap aside, either… You’re left in a very dark place, if you have people constantly unburdening themselves with you, all the time…

        The most horrifying sentence I could hear, late at night when nothing is going on, and you’re fighting off the Z-monster? “Sergeant K, can I talk to you about something…?”. {whole-body shudder, remembering}

        • Likely because you appeared all detached and non-judgmental — and yeah, I got that also. People unbuttoned and told me the most … interesting and sometimes astonishing things, and all I really had to say was, “Ummm-hum,” and “Then what?”

          I don’t think Blondie would have missed your beer – she drank free the rest of that evening, although she was a little horrified by how much damage she did to him — as well has how much effort it took from the other people in the bar to drag her off him. She may have ration of the berserker gene in her, at that.

          • Yeah, I may have been asking for it…

            There were a couple of times when I was sitting there on duty with someone, and what came out of their mouths left me seriously wondering if I could ever sleep again, let alone anywhere in proximity to that individual. People who posit telepathy should also be positing utter, gaping horror for the telepaths, because based on what narrow glimpses I’ve been afforded into the human psyche through such late-night confessionals…? Yeah.

            The really bad ones usually started out like “Hey, Sergeant K… Do you think it would be weird if…”. And, the implications such conversations usually created in my mind? “Uhmmm… Yeah. Let me go get the duty weapon out of the safe, and we’ll just sit here with me holding it on you, until the MPs/Mental Hygiene people get here…”.

            Swear to God, every time I took duty for someone else as a senior NCO, and they provided the duty driver? Screwy Squirrel time. This is no joke, either–I had to call the guy I was doing duty for and tell him “Yeah… Ya know the kid you gave me for duty, today? The MPs came and got him. Can you grab someone else out of your platoon for me? No? Well, let me get one of my guys, then… You owe me, for this one–The duty log is already three pages long, and there’s still most of the day and all night left…”.

            Borrowed duty is always trouble, it seems, no matter who it is. I traded duty with a guy in Korea for him to go on pass with his girlfriend. Weekend I had it, huge series of fights in the club there on Camp Mercer, and a mini-race riot down at the gym. His turn? Oh, boy… I was laughing my ass off: We had a monsoon storm come through, and literally flatten almost every other tree on camp. I was out cutting trees down with my squad when he came up to me and said “OK, you got me.”, like I’d had something to do with the weather. Which was only fair, because I’d blamed him for all the shenanigans I had to deal with on his duty.

            • Patrick Chester

              I wouldn’t want telepathy unless there was an off switch for it.

              • Which is why I have trouble with any story that involves telepathy and empathy that doesn’t involve said individuals spending a lot of time building up defenses whatever they may be. (Not an issue if there isn’t a ‘passive’ form in the world… but still you take a peak in the wrong mind or at the wrong time?)

                • I think it would depend on when it “turns on”. if it was on full power as an infant? I would think they would learn to ignore all except the stronger emanations, unless they were focusing on it. And they would get enough exposure to “weird” to not get weirded out by it.

                  Just my opinion, of course.

                • Patrick Chester

                  That’s pretty much why I’d want an off switch. So I wouldn’t have to build walls, go live out in the wilderness, avoid all human contact, etc.

                  • The books “Very Bad *” (two books, with two different values of *) by Spider Robinson (published by Baen) involve a character known as “Stinky” who is a telepath who cannot turn it off. He’s developed many techniques for remaining as far as possible from the rest of humanity…

    • Nailed it.

      Real life: We have a guy we have to follow around to keep him from stalking the middles school and upper elementary age girls at the library.

      He hasn’t crossed the line yet, and we’re not using anyone’s daughter to get the “proof” we need to actually get him banned.

      Do you know what’s going to happen when he figures out he can say the Magic Words and sue us because we stopped him following them into the bathroom?

      Gah.

      • William O. B'Livion

        > Do you know what’s going to happen when he figures out he can
        > say the Magic Words and sue us because we stopped him
        > following them into the bathroom?

        Shoot, shovel and shut up.

    • Look — I’m not encouraging it, I’m just saying if people are close enough to their chosen sex, you won’t KNOW. Genital checking is the only way to be sure, and it’s OBVIOUSLY absurd.

      • Christopher M. Chupik

        Just wait until we get “smart clothing” with embedded sensors and the government can launch a new underwear surveillance program.

      • These are the crazy years. There is no such thing as obviously absurd anymore.

        • The Other Sean

          Everyday the “real” news is getting harder to tell apart from The Onion and similar satirical news sources.

      • If they’re so close to their chosen sex I can’t tell, then I don’t *care* what’s behind their zipper.

        But the laws that are being passed aren’t saying that; they simply depend on the person’s “feelings.” They can do whatever they want as long as they say the right words. But if you don’t say the words you’ll probably wind up on the sex offender list.

        • I know that. So reaction to the law isn’t crazy — because of that — but that is not what the mass on the other side is HEARING. The leaders, sure, but not the mass. And they’re NOT thinking.

          • But why would the leaders want the masses thinking? As usual it is a sledgehammer lawon a mosquito problem but based off a sledgehammer on an ameoba law.

      • The point of such a law is to have it available when there is someone acting suspicious in there, THEN they can use it when someone complains about the pervert who is spending too much time in the bathroom or locker room and looking at the girls and women in a disturbing manner.

        The fact is, such a law should not be needed, but the other side made it necessary.

  19. Christopher M. Chupik

    And while bathrooms become the bold new civil rights frontier:

    http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/25/asia/bangladesh-u-s-embassy-worker-killed/

    • William O. B'Livion

      > “He was the kind of person willing to fight for what he believed in,”

      No, he was the kind of person willing to talk and write about what he believed in, and maybe even engage in debate about it.

      But if he was the sort of person willing to fight for what he believed in then there would have been a shooting (it is possible to legally purchase firearms in Bangladesh. Difficult, but possible).

  20. Your premise has one major flaw: All of us on the right hand side: conservative, liberatarian, or just some flavor of odd, are inundated with stories both narrative and (at least attempted, or claimed to be) factual from the left-liberal-Marxist-urban perspective. News stations. Women’s magazines. Newspapers. Television. Pop radio. Movies. Books. Comic Books.

    So are the lefties and urbanites. So even if we don’t know or are related to lefties and urbanites, it would take a Herculean effort NOT to know what they think of themselves. They, on the other hand, have no such corrective.

    You perceive?

    So half your equation is correct: They don’t know what they don’t know. And the size of their ignorance is ginormous. Us? Not so much.

    Frex, we know the laws of the copybook headings, just for starters. And we know what kind of unintended consequences their stupid “But we need this new law for the FEELZ” regulations have done in the past. Because we are (or try not to be) ignorant of the past, and I mean what actually happened and not just the sanitized Marxist version.

    So no. This is an asymmetric situation. Fortunately your conclusion still works. The more reality-based narratives we can tell, the better.

    • No, but we tend to exaggerate how many of them are still completely insane. Most of them are just dupes, who fall for mote and bailey.

      • This is true.I suspect it has always been true. For example, Non-tribal Muslims who are perfectly nice neighbors (in England, they’re what Obama would call the bitter-clinger class) vastly outnumber the looney segment. Unfortunately the potential for violence from the completely insane holier-than-thou segment makes them largely irrelevant, outside of charitable concerns (can I hide them in my basement if fecal matter hits the rotary blade?)

        Our own “completely insane” rule the roost in the Academy, much of the government bureacracy, and the mass media.

        Fortunately, we’re dealing with twitter mobs and lawfare, which is better than getting burned alive, mass rape, stonings, beheadings ,etc. unlike the poor sods in the dar-al-Islam.

        But still.

        • William O. B'Livion

          > Non-tribal Muslims who are perfectly nice neighbors (in England,
          > they’re what Obama would call the bitter-clinger class) vastly
          > outnumber the looney segment.

          Polling says that “vastly” is a questionable statement.

          • Um. I believe it speaks to the necessary survival-virtue signalling involved. But whether you or I are correct, the need to appease the crazy makes the actual number of reasonables / useful idiots irrelevant.

  21. Frankly, I love it. This whole trans-gendered/sexual identity thing is completely unenforceable. So, when a dude wants to use the little girl’s room of the grade school, just to urinate… really… because yea “I feel like a little girl today”, eventually there won’t be a legal way to stop him. There is absolutely no way to PROVE that he doesn’t indeed “Identify as a woman”.

    So, if only in self defense (and to defend of our young ones from pedophiles*) we will be forced to insist that restrooms have stalls, and that those stalls aren’t peek-able (walls go from floor to ceiling and have actual doors). Frankly, this is what I would prefer anyway. For myself, I don’t really care, if someone really wants to look at my junk, more power to them (I may be an introvert, but I’m not exactly shy in that regard. Not that there is anyone looking anyway, I don’t kid myself, I’m not that attractive). However, I do have pretty daughters and such an arrangement would make it easier to keep them safe.

    * Please note, I’m talking about REAL pedophiles, not trans-whatever, or alternative gender ID who aren’t pedophiles. Geesh, it goes to show how sensitive some people are that I feel like I need to add this.

    • BobtheRegisterredFool

      Over-sensitive. Perhaps even contrived sensitivity.

    • Yep, this. And I too would prefer lockable, peek proof bathrooms. Again not for me. If people are nuts, and want to see me naked, that’s their issue. BUT I remember being out with two little boys and chicks getting all ‘et up if I took them to the women’s bathroom. I was the crazy woman outside the men’s room demanding regular “sound offs” from the boys. (Robert was THREE when people started getting upset about him in the women’s room. Yes, he looked older.)
      And who knows, this might repeat with grandsons.

      • I figure the first major step will be taking down the male and female signs for ones with “Urinals Available” and “No Urinals.” Take your pick.

        It’ll be interesting, seeing the result of the trials after the first few assaults–by dads on men they thought were peeking at their daughters.

        • There were once urinals for females, back before WWII. Best as I can tell they were only practical with skirts or drop-seat overalls, at least on the outer layer. I never figured out how they dealt with underwear. (well, it *is* a logical question when confronted with something that looks like it came out of the facility at the Star Wars Cantina…)

          Nowadays, at least in my area, almost all women wear pants. I’m guessing pants would make the whole urinal thing more trouble than it’s worth.

          • Ahem.In the really old days, women didn’t have underwear with closed crotches. That’s a newfangled thing that came with pantyhose and such.

            • Was there a buttoned flap, or were they something like the crotchless underwear from novelty shops?

              • They were pretty breezy, unless you were having your period or something. But since you were wearing an entire pantaloon apparatus as well as skirt, slip, etc., it wasn’t much like crotchless stuff today.

                I find this difficult to describe. You will need to find pictures of it. But it isn’t much different from similar medieval women’s garments.

        • I did enjoy the signage at a restaurant I ate at a few years ago in… New Zealand, was it? (Can’t quite remember…)

          There were two one-person bathrooms. Signs were: “People” and “Other People.” Seemed like a perfectly sensible approach to me.

          This is, of course, the *easy* case. Each room had one toilet, one sink, etc. and was intended for use by one person at a time (or parent with small child, or …)

      • Well… no you don’t. Not in public places. Because when you have those, you get an over abundance of the pervs who sell / do drugs, sex, drugs and sex, and alcohol.

        In the public library. Which is why they went back to lockable, somewhat peekable stalls.

        Unintended consequences…

        You have something that pretty well works for most people most of the time, that got hammered out over the generations, and you decide you need to toss it upside down and reinvent it? Ah well. Most of these folks are young, and those who are old enough to know better made the decision never to learn anything along the way.

    • Like that joke about the new Air Force recruit. “Gender: 15% male, 85% F-15 Strike Eagle.”

  22. Christopher M. Chupik

    I feel the washroom issue will resolve itself given time. I just wish it didn’t entail waiting for a lot of crap to happen first before people wise up.

    • Oh for the “good old days” when the confusion was having three doors: BOYS, GIRLS, FACULTY.

    • BobtheRegisterredFool

      It’s a real shitty deal.

      Rewarding the pissy instead of sending them back to the drawing board, for an argument that doesn’t depend on the inside of their own heads, gets you further suggestions with no basis in measurable physical reality.

  23. Anyone who thinks the bathroom fight is about bathrooms is crazy. It is the next step in shooting the wounded after the gay marraige “victory” by the left that we first saw with bakers and florists. In Minnesota it is extending to parents of fifth graders opted out of the boy “My Boy Princess” the parents of one transchild (ie, one child the parents want to use to make a statement for their own moral preening and that’s not the youngest I’ve seen parents claim their child is trans…the current lowest I know is two) demand be added to the curriculum.

    The inability of leftist activists to even slow down and consolidate their gains without shooting the wounded and upping the attack is going to fall very heavily on the transgendered. I keep my mouth shut when my trans friends talk about the hate out there embodied in these laws because all I would do is alienate them and make it so when the real hate hits* they wouldn’t trust me to help them.

    I worry I’ll have to do the same for gay friends too.

    It’s like seeing your friends not just standing on the tracks but running towards the train and trying to catch them.

    * Yes, I know there is real hate and prejudice experienced by them…I’ve heard the horror stories as recently as Saturday but I worry they haven’t seen anything yet.

    • Fortunately my gay friends are all libertarian-conservative, so they’re going as nuts as I am over this.
      But Herb, no, the point is not everyone who believes this crap is nuts. The sheeple have been conditioned by entertainment and “news” to believe this is needed and because they imagine everyone outside the magic circle is a bigot who would attack someone for looking somewhat ambiguous (again conditioned) they never stop and go “Waitaminute, if people look like what they say they are, no one CHECKS.”

      • I wasn’t talking about why the average person takes the side they do on this. I’m talking about the activists who decided to make this the next fight.

        Among my trans friend I doubt any would get stopped in a restroom. The one transman I’m close to might have a few more issues as he still needs to sit at all times but I suspect most of the time people will just assume he needs to “this time” and no one would actually track.

        Most of the horror stories I hear are related to finding intimate partners and rejection by family. The former gets really sad sometimes because even when the person has been up front about when the moment of truth comes they get revulsion due to scars and things not being “quite right”.

        We also seem incapable of discussing things like, “given the general mental health outcomes is rearranging someone’s entire body chemistry with corresponding health risks a good trade-off”. Besides, if gender is social construct we’re all indoctrinated to hold why do they need physical actions to be their gender.

        Some other cultures do have a social role for someone who wants to take on broadly the sex roles assigned to the other fidley bits although this seems to be most often true for men (male privillege!!!!)…even Arabs (look up Khanith on Wikipedia). I think we’d be doing a lot better on every measure: tolerance, caring for others, etc if we followed the advice of Danielle Berry who regretted her full transition saying, “Being my ‘real self’ could have included having a penis and including more femininity in whatever forms made sense. I didn’t know that until too late.”

        But doing something like that is work and not nearly as fun as making the hicks all pissy by fighting about bathrooms.

        • Admittedly I often question the mental health aspect. There is involvement of neurochemical imbalances so what are comorbidities. And I do not trust the handwave of ‘it’s only because BIGOTS!”

        • ” I’m talking about the activists who decided to make this the next fight.”

          They’re activists; it’s what they do. Like sharks, they can’t stop moving, or the water carrying the oxygen over their gills will cease providing enough oxygen, and they’ll die.

          Real-world effect is going to be that they’re going to keep pushing and pushing until they get feedback, which is, at this point, likely to take the form of a pogrom. They sense weakness where there is merely forced good manners, and when they get past those, there’s going to be a very unfortunate backlash. Of course, most of these activists aren’t the people who are going to suffer, so… They really don’t care. So long as they get their jollies being socially transgressive, and “making a point”, they’re happy.

          Some of these people I’ve encountered make me seriously wonder if they haven’t gotten something whacked out in the internal brain loop that feeds endorphins in when they attain pleasure–You ever see the positively orgasmic faces they make, when they’re in the throes of their “passions”? Yeah, there’s something deeply sexual going on, there–Or, damn close to it. It’s like looking at my Mom playing the slots, which was something I never thought would appeal to her. The whole “holier than thou” thing, the arguing, the apparent feedback loop they get when resisted? I really have to wonder if some form of sex drive sublimation isn’t going on. Couple of the freakier ones I’ve known, that’s been really, really overt, too–One lesbian who’d hooked up with the wife of one of the guys in my company (and, who left him for her…) was like that–She claimed she’d never experienced orgasm with a man or a woman, but when she went to protests and took part in them…? Bang, zoom, and with no physical stimulation.

          Come to think of it, she’s probably the number-one reason I’m so damn cynical about these people. Hell of an educational experience, meeting her and dealing with all the fallout she created in that couple’s lives. Toxic lesbian syndrome… She was so bad that other lesbians wouldn’t have her around, at all, calling her by some really horrid names.

          God, I just remembered–Had a really interesting run-in with a flannel-wearing likely-lesbian-looking woman up at the Sears in Tacoma. I was up there picking up tools for a project, and we hit it off pretty well going through the stuff that was remaindered and/or on sale. She mentioned someone I knew was active in the local gay/lesbian community, and I asked her, laughingly, “Hey, you ever run into X…?”, referring to the individual who’d moved in on (and, in with…) my friend’s wife. Her reaction? Huge eyes, and a “OHMYGAWD… You know her? I’m so sorry… So, so sorry… I don’t know what to say…”. I laughed it off, told her how I knew the person, and she just got grim, and said that was why that individual wasn’t welcome where she hung out, any more…

          All this was before the internet was a thing, so I suppose that the person I’m talking about went on to glorious things. I did find it funny as hell that “someone from her community” felt it necessary to apologize for their conduct, without ever even hearing me say anything about that conduct…

    • Oh, and the idea of putting kids before puberty through transition brings on berserker rage. This is child abuse, nothing more, nothing less.

      • A possible complicating factor is the high number of male transv who are HUGE. Very tall. I’ve met lots of tranv males who are taller than I am (6’4″), and a coworker gave me a nice Western style leather jacket because her brother was going total transvestite and was giving away his male clothes. Fit me perfectly.

        • Reality Observer

          I have known several women (from birth on, that is) that were also frickin’ huge. Tall, anyway – only a couple were really into body building, so everything else was “proportional.”

          Never caused me to doubt their gender, any more than a guy being really short ever did.

        • Yeah, we both knew one. BUT all the same, Charles, if they look more female than male, no one asks. Huge women exist.

      • Oh yeah. We have no idea what hormonal treatments will do to kids in the long term. Or what mental meltdowns they might have later in life.

        • Especially since it’s already hard to keep a study of adult transsexuals, it looks like.
          http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043071/

          Data is inconsistent with respect to psychiatric morbidity post sex reassignment. Although many studies have reported psychiatric and psychological improvement after hormonal and/or surgical treatment,[7], [12], [13], [14], [15], [16] other have reported on regrets,[17] psychiatric morbidity, and suicide attempts after SRS.[9], [18] A recent systematic review and meta-analysis concluded that approximately 80% reported subjective improvement in terms of gender dysphoria, quality of life, and psychological symptoms, but also that there are studies reporting high psychiatric morbidity and suicide rates after sex reassignment.[19] The authors concluded though that the evidence base for sex reassignment “is of very low quality due to the serious methodological limitations of included studies.”

          The methodological shortcomings have many reasons. First, the nature of sex reassignment precludes double blind randomized controlled studies of the result. Second, transsexualism is rare [20] and many follow-ups are hampered by small numbers of subjects.[5], [8], [21], [22], [23], [24], [25], [26], [27], [28] Third, many sex reassigned persons decline to participate in follow-up studies, or relocate after surgery, resulting in high drop-out rates and consequent selection bias.[6], [9], [12], [21], [24], [28], [29], [30] Forth, several follow-up studies are hampered by limited follow-up periods.[7], [9], [21], [22], [26], [30] Taken together, these limitations preclude solid and generalisable conclusions. A long-term population-based controlled study is one way to address these methodological shortcomings.

          http://thefederalist.com/2015/08/19/transgender-regret-is-real-even-if-the-media-tell-you-otherwise/

          The people who push reassignment pre-puberty also seem to have this air of ‘well, the kids will have gotten used to living as trans by the time they grow up, so it should work out better,’ then seem to just gloss over the fact that puberty is probably one of the biggest changes people have naturally per biology. Along with it, is this odd impression I get that they seem to think that children’s bodies are much like clay or bonzai, and if you shape it early enough, you can ‘train’ them to grow in certain ways or patterns.

    • The Other Sean

      On a tangential note, a Michigan man thought ducking under the train to flee the cops was a good idea. No, no it wasn’t.

      http://www.cbsnews.com/news/michigan-man-legs-chopped-off-train-fleeing-police/

      Hopefully, none of your friends go trying that.

      • Welp, he won’t be running from the law any more.

        • The Other Sean

          Thank you, Shadowdancer! I barely managed not to make that pun. 🙂

          • It’s a crime against humanity and sense of humor to resist it when that kind of opportunity presents itself!

            I’m still regretting not saying “It’s never lupus!” when that diagnostic panel of doctors was standing around my bed, and the young Indian doctor suggested that I might have it to the (white, blonde, blue-eyed, Canadian female) head doctor, who had two other female fellows with her – a brown haired lady and an Asian lady. The Asian one happened to be looking at me when I opened my mouth, saw me think the better of it, very carefully close my mouth and bite my lips. She raised her clipboard to hide the lower half of her face, her eyes laughing. She knew what I was making a clearly superhuman effort NOT to say.

            I turned out to have a different rare complication though – venuous insufficiency due to pregnancy.

    • Paul (Drak Bibliophile) Howard

      Sadly, their “defenders” take actions that create hatred where none existed before. 😦

    • Problem I have run into. Waiting to see if sibling is going to avoid vacation and holidays since I will be there and have stated my disgust at the shoot the survivors that I saw coming after the decision. It was not just the legal crap but approval that was wanted.

      • BobtheRegisterredFool

        And approval cannot be created by legal force. It is easy to coerce someone into concealing disapproval.

    • but I worry they haven’t seen anything yet.

      No, they have not. The building backlash is going to be very, very bad. If I were a trans/gay type, I’d be looking for a good hidey hole to wait out the storm.

      • BobtheRegisterredFool

        Repeat after me: I identify as a congenital bigot. Tolerance interferes with the expression of my true self, which I cannot alter in any fashion. Your vile hatred of my kind is oppression.

    • The gay friends I do have don’t have the issues the militants have because they know how to get along with other people, and are aware that society is not just ‘take take take’ but ‘give and take.’ It sucks, but the crazies are going to drag the sane ones down with them, and they’re the selfish assholes who never seem to get punished. TBH, the crazies on the militant LGBT side, I have no sympathy for at all. There’s a point where I’m like, “yeah, there’s nothing I can do to help you.”

      I’ve had to do that once too many times, for personal situation stuff, and after The Bad Shit’s gone down, and that friend is crying to me, saying, “Why didn’t you warn me?!” I ask “Would you have listened? Really? Because I tried as best as I could and you used to get mad at me.” A few of these people I’m no longer friends with, but I got a shamefaced, but honest “No, I wouldn’t have.”

      But goddamn, why the shit are we supposed to be responsible for advice that the fucking other person chose to discard, ignore or not take? Then the other person acts like it’s all ‘my’ fault for not trying harder.

      So yeah, my position is, “you’re not going to learn until you’ve burned your house down, so I’m going to stop putting out fires and let you do that because that’s what you’re wanting to do and hurting me to get to what you want to happen.” The LGBT movement lost my sympathy and my support a LONG time ago, because on my side, I never saw them treating me the way they wanted to be treated. LGBT people? are treated the way they treat me, which is no different from how I treat any other person. Apparently, that’s not good enough for the movement, and thus, they drove me away.

    • I remember an online discussion about a study that proved that two otherwise identical resumes would get different reactions if the volunteering was for the alphabetic soul or for some other progressive cause.

      Reaction: which cause? One associated with suing employers?

  24. So we’re going to end up with gender-mandatory clothes and behavior again, right? If you say you’re a woman, you have to dress and act like one. No jeans for you!
    Aside: got my ‘A Republic . . .’ t-shirt. Looks great, the pic ends three inches above my waist (pet peeve: t-shirts I can’t tuck in without hiding the picture). My husband is very happy I’m so pleased with my birthday presant.

  25. The danger is how most of these media opportunities are run by those anathema to reality and vindictive.

  26. I want my oldstyle ladies’ room with a nice couch in the anteroom, and maybe a nice nursing room attached for newstyle. What I’m going to get is burly lady attendants who double as security.

    Sigh. It was not all that long ago that stores and restaurants started having restrooms, so the ladies didn’t have to head home to pee. And now we are going to go back to holding it until you get home, and all the fun of kidney infections. Joy.

    And no, it’s not real trans people who I’m worried about.

    • Anyway, the burly lady attendants will hand me a towel and keep things stocked.

      • Portugal. An entire family living in the antechamber to the restrooms in the train station, and the lady cooking the family dinner on a propane stove on top of the sinks. She sold you tp and soap for a nominal fee.
        The attendant job paid so little, the only way to get people was to offer “live in.” I was so used to stepping over toddlers asleep on the front chamber, I didn’t even notice, till Dan freaked out. There was a family living in the men’s room too.

    • Lady attendants? That’s sexist!

      You’ll get Zit Boy and Neckbeard, because female attendants would be discriminatory…

  27. BobtheRegisterredFool

    Anyone have a link to the Hugo results?

      • BobtheRegisterredFool

        Thank you.

      • Anything worth reading?

        I don’t read all that much current stuff, and last year was the first time I paid to vote. So, I didn’t nominate and was planning to wait for people here to tell me whether it’s worth my money this year. 🙂

        • Depends. There’s a couple outright 4chan trollery short stories, but the fan categories and related works are pretty solid. Too bad they won’t get a fair shake. It was nearly a RP/SP shutout, with RP taking the lion’s share. So, if you liked the RP stuff last year, this year, minus the trololololol Space Raptor Butt Invasion (no, seriously), might be your cup of tea. Just don’t fall in love with the idea of any winning an award.

          • BobtheRegisterredFool

            The SJWs got some white supremacists in best novel. If one is more interested in good reads than participation, checking the SP or RP recommendations might be better.

        • BobtheRegisterredFool

          Aeronaut’s Windlass, probably Penric’s Demon, some say Seveneyes, Safe Space as Rape Room, Appendix N Book, Moira Greyland, possibly SJWs always lie, Erin Dies Alone, and Jeffro Johnson.

          Sad Puppies had endorsements for Perfect State, Slow Bullets, Brain Niemeier and Sebastian de Castell.

          ‘If you were an award’, ‘Space Raptor Butt Invasion’, and maybe some others sound like trolling options.

        • Butcher’s book is.

        • “The Aeronaut’s Windlass” is well worth your time, as is “Penric’s Demon.” I’m less sure about the others, as I haven’t read many of them myself.

      • Reality Observer

        Sigh. Looks like the war between the Noahs and the Rabids is on.

        I’m not going to bother this year; no place for a neutral…

      • Only thing I don’t really care for is Daredevil losing out to Jessica Jones. “Cut Man” was so great.

  28. And for reasons unknown to me, women objected to Robert in the ladies’ room when he was little more than 3 and to Marshall at 6.

    Hubby and I have twins, one boy and one girl. When they were little, they went into the appropriate bathroom for whichever parent was on hand. Which meant my son came into the ladies with me, when I was out with the kids. And my daughter went into the mens when she was out with hubby. That later felt a little weird, but there was no way he was sending her into a restroom alone at age 4. No one ever complained. The family restrooms are really nice when you’ve got little ones.

    • They didn’t exist when I had littles. And seriously, at 4? It’s not a matter of anyone perving on them. I worried sick he’d do something crazy like wash his hands in the urinals. I mean, you remember that age, right?

      • Reality Observer

        Worse, those blue cakes are awfully attractive to a little one…

      • I worried sick he’d do something crazy like wash his hands in the urinals.

        Oh, totally. We weren’t worried about the other folk using the restroom. Maybe we should have been, but we weren’t. It was things like our child spotting something weird behind the toilet and crawling over to investigate, or just crawling around in general, or not washing hands properly (or at all), and even just the basics of managing the job. My kids weren’t all that skilled at bathroom stuff at that age.

        • Yep. Unfortunately Robert at 3 was four feet tall and looked much older. So idiot women decided he was “looking” at them (I swear. Bored little kid stuff, like jiggling doors.)

      • I remember that age. My younger brothers were rather scandalized by the urinals and preferred the privacy of the toilet stalls.

      • Little late to add a reply, but I’m going to anyway. Family restrooms are a great idea, that didn’t exist when my kids were young. Nor did the lowered urinals in the men’s room- which are also a good idea. But as for the family restrooms, which lock from the inside for privacy, it really is amazing how often a male and female employee who aren’t married will exit from one at the same time, especially on late shifts with few customers in the store.

        • And if I’m not their mother, their father or their spouse? I don’t care.

          • How about if you’re the person waiting outside with your kids? Or another worker who needs a hand wondering “Where the hell are Dick and Jane?” Or the corporate lawyer who doesn’t want the store hit with a “I regretted it after the fact so it was rape” case along with “everyone knows it happens but no one stops it”? Or if it’s management/labor leading to charges from others of favoritism? Or worse- sexual favors or harassment . (and in my limited experience- it’s almost always management/labor….) For corporations, there are lots of reason for caring. Whether you care or not is immaterial. Whether I care or not is immaterial. But I do have personal knowledge it occurs.

            This is not intended as an argument against family bathrooms- they are a good idea. But like a lot of good ideas, it can and will be abused by some people.

            Just for the record, in a public restroom is, IMHO, always the wrong time and wrong place for a liaison. And yes, that’s judgmental. But I imagine that for most of us, it’s just a yucky place for doing anything other then what it was intended for.

            • I could see a deterrent against most of the bad scenarios you mentioned: a prominent camera mounted in plain sight above the “family restroom” door, pointing outward so that it sees everyone who enters and whom they enter with. Parents accompanying their three-year-old to the toilet won’t mind, but it would certainly deter anyone bent on secret hanky-panky. (Those who don’t care who knows about them won’t be deterred, but there’s no perfect solution).

            • I’m not saying it’s a good thing they do that, and definitely if they take up the place while people need it, this is bad and if they’re workers there, they should be disciplined for taking up the restroom.
              BUT the problem is ONLY ONE OF THOSE. If there were more, surely they won’t all be taken up by horny employees? Or you could provide a sex room. No one pounding at the door, and a hose on the ceiling which squirts down disinfectant after every use. Make it coin-entrance. Actually that’s what most european countries do. Bathrooms are coin entrance only or attendant sells you TP and monitors only. I hate it, but if the nonsense continues might be the way we go.

    • Hah, I remember being out with my Dad when I was little, and needing to use the restroom. I was small enough that when he tried to let me go into the stall on my own, I said I was scared that I’d fall in if he didn’t hold my hand while I went – and that was the men’s room. I was a tiny thing, so that big ol’ toilet bowl was SCARY! Once when he was lined up to go to a ladies’ room with me (it was closer), another mum taking her kids offered to take me in with them, and all Dad had to do was explain that grownup men weren’t allowed in there when other women were around.

      Simpler times.

      • I was a tiny thing, so that big ol’ toilet bowl was SCARY!

        LOL! I remember feeling the same when I was little. We had flip-down inserts (super handy!) at home for our twins when they were little, so the largeness of public facilities without inserts was definitely an issue.

  29. My husband describes the worst job in the world: the little old lady in a men’s room in Mexico who shined your shoes while you were standing using the urinal. (This from a man born and raised in a third world country which shall remain nameless.)

  30. I don’t”t need the government to protect me from those people over there bothering me. I need protection FROM the government that SENDS those people over there over here to bother me…

  31. Women do get assaulted in women’s bathrooms for looking too masculine, including ciswomen, as in this recent instance: http://www.freep.com/story/news/2015/06/22/fishbones-woman-speaks/71243408/

    I have no idea about the rates, though. You’re right that media depictions seriously skew our perceptions of how often all sorts of events happen.

  32. “Now it’s always been normal, and it’s part of that human tribal thing, to believe that those guys over there, across the bridge and over the mountain are REALLY weird.”

    No, no. There’s nothing tribal about it. Having grown up on the Dallas side of DFW, I can attest to the fact that quite often, those guys over there, on the other side of Arlington, in Fort Worth, really are weird.

    • Texans? ($HOUSEMATE grew up in TX, describes Dallas as “Trying hard to pretend it’s not in Texas.”)

      • Dallas do get that way, sometimes, yeah. Other times, Dallas likes to pt on that it’s the rootin’est tootin’est shootin’est most Texicanest city evah!

        I chalk it up to metropolitan schizophrenia, myself. Dallas wants to be cosmopolitan, and for the most part it is, but it’s not quite sure how to go about being that exactly, so it overcompensates in both directions.

        • “There’s a little town in Texas that everyone likes to hate…”

          • ““There’s a little town in Texas that everyone likes to hate…””

            Yeah. It’s called “Austin.”

            • Austin’s music is great, but I’ve gone from “Keep Austin Weird” to “Pave Austin Over” since I left.

              • Hey there now. Why would you even want to contemplate paving over the Kremlin on the Brazos— oh. Wait.

                Never mind. Just move the State Capitol building to Laredo first, and have at.

        • Anonymous Coward

          Yup, ironbear pretty much nailed it. One of my favorite Dallas stories is when the city created a park downtown (Pioneer Plaza) filled with bronze sculptures of a cattle drive. Dallas never had cattle drives; that is Ft. Worth. The park & sculptures were a pet project of a local real estate developer and hotelier (Trammell Crow). It was a complete coincidence that the site, next to the convention center, had recently been approved for a hotel that would have competed against Crow’s hotels. Just another day in Dallas …

          • *grin* I remember that, and all the controversy over the statues and the Trammel Crow building.

            If you think back, that was also around the time of the run of the “Dallas” TV show, which added to the whole “metropolitan schizophrenia” thing. Dallas was never a huge cow town, as you noted that was Ft. Worth during the 1800s, but you’d never know it from watching the Ewings at South Fork during the TV series. So everyone, including a lot of Dallasites, got the impression of Big-D as a place of ten gallon hats and boots and horses during that era. Oy.

            And then there was the Las Colinas Mustangs…

  33. I was in Korea was at a bar which, as many establishments do overseas in port area, doubles with another common business. While taking a whiz at the urinal- which was one of the walls with a trough at the bottom with water slowly dripping down the wall, two of the businesswomen present came in and sat down on the toilets in the doorless stalls to do their thing. Now, in a place like that, with the clientele, not any real problem with unisex bathrooms with simultaneous use.

    OTOH, in a normal business in everytown USA, without bouncers, and with customers and staff not in that particular business, mixing sexes is really not appropriate.

    And, the elephant in the room. Mentioned briefly and skirted around. Men who want to present as women and women who want to present as men are mentally ill. Johns Hopkins, the institution that pioneered sexual reassignment surgery, no ;longer does it. Recognized it doesn’t cure a person’s problems. But shrinks and doctors accepting SRS as legitimate have led to doctors participating in other types of body modification surgery. With some doctors even cutting healthy limbs off people to fulfill their particular fetish. Google body modification surgery and look at the photos. Have eye bleach available. Once you erase one boundary of behavior, boundaries disappear. Some shrinks are now calling for normalization of pedophilia as they did for homosexuality all those years ago. Once boundaries are gone….

  34. When I first read the headline of the post, it came across as ‘Paranoiacs Aboard’, which made me flash on the ‘Children on Board’ sign my sister has in the back window of her minivan.