There are two types of people in the world. Those who want to tell everyone what to do and how to do it, and those who have fond fantasies of holding them under water until bubbles stop coming up.
Okay, I’m probably wrong on this. That last is just me. In my camp I count people like Charlie Martin who, despite not being a Christian, has a bit St. Francis serenity to him. They just want to be left alone, and they will evade anyone trying to force them to do things and do them exactly THEIR way.
The types who want to tell people exactly what to do and how to do it are everywhere. I grew up in a culture where total strangers would approach you in public, on the street, to tell you that you were wearing your shirt wrong – because it was not the way everyone else would do it.
Being me, I rebelled against everything that people told me I should do, including basic manners which was stupid, because basic manners are simply the way we avoid making everyday situations into horrible confrontation. Manners are how we avoid beating each other over the last roll at dinner and running into the door all in a bunch and getting all stuck.
Manners unfortunately also stop me waving the middle finger of doom at most idiot pontificators telling you “This is exactly what you should do and how you should do it.” However the issue needs to be addressed, because if we don’t then these kind of idiots end up getting political power and making it a law that you have to do things their way.
There are things of course that you can only do one way. Say you suffer from craneo-rectal inversion and want to see the world. The only way to do it is to pull your head out of its dark, smelly place.
There are other things like that too. I mean you shouldn’t eat sand or metal. And at a formal dinner, you shouldn’t eat with your hands. In general it’s more efficient to eat with your fingers than with your toes. Though I’ll point out our class president wrote with his toes, because he was a Thalidomide baby. So even in these basics, there are no hard and fast “How to do it.”
However for most basics, and lacking other impairments, the “how to do it” is agreed on at least by the time you leave high school.
For everything else, can we have people leave us alone already. Note that the first lady has now found it necessary to tell us to drink more water. This is relatively innocuous, until some idiot decides to make it into a law, but still – drink more water, really? You need to put this message out there? Listen, lady, most of us figured out that drinking gasoline killed you by the time we were two, or at least we took it on faith, plus the smell nauseated us. As for “but… water… drink more.” Yeah. Well, most of us have been hearing that since we were out of knee breeches. And since I never wore knee breeches and I’m almost the First Nagger’s age, that’s a veeeeeeery long time.
Does she think because it’s her wagging her finger we’ll pay more attention? Listen, Lady, I’m more likely to listen to my doctor, and I still don’t. Why not? Because I hate drinking plain water. I do it only if I’m really thirsty and there’s nothing else. (I will drink carbonated water above that, but above those I will drink tea or coffee. And no, those aren’t the opposite of hydrating. That’s been disposed of.) In fact, I only stopped being severely dehydrated when I gave in and started guzzling iced tea. And yes I knew that I should drink mo’ water, but I couldn’t force myself to. Because I don’t care who tells me, my back brain doesn’t like it. (And btw, through most of humans’ history – not pre-history because I can’t be sure – people didn’t drink water, they drank beer or other alcoholic beverages.)
But nowhere is this more annoying than in the arts. No, seriously.
I’m sick and tired of being told there is only one way to write. This is only because I’m not a painter or a musician anyway, but yes, I’m tired of it.
You’re going to quote the tribal lays thing, and of course, there’s many ways to construct them, but truly, this doesn’t seem to percolate to people’s heads.
It’s fine by me if you say “Hey, Sarah, you teach writing. So, clearly you think there is a way.”
I think there is a way to make a story more attractive and popular, yes, and that’s what I teach, though those who’ve taken workshops with me know that I “beg” a lot. I’ll say things like “don’t start with your character crying, unless you can make it fly.” Etc. Because though there are certain guidelines to make your way easy everyone can quote three or four major instances of rule breaking that went big.
That one is already bad enough when people come in all big and bad and say “you can’t have first person narration that doesn’t sound amateurish,” which causes me to clear my throat and go “ahem, Heinlein, and smile when you say that.”
But what really gets my goat, gores it and then barbecues it over a pit with hot sauce is the people who tell you HOW to write. And by that I mean the process of writing. No, really “You must write on paper, or you’re writing trash” or “you must type everything on an old Remington Selectric” or and this will make some of you grimace “you must revise everything five times – preferably to the tastes of the editor who is the voice from on high and who is NOT paying you until/unless you hit his/her hot spot, before your story is “good”.”
This gets on my nerves for various reasons. The first is that the little clueless writer I used to be took all this to be gospel truth. This included using 30 to end my short stories for years because some book told me to. It included writing short stories, in the first place, because three or four books assured me this is how you broke in. It included sending to pays in copies first, because I heard you needed those in your resume before the bigs looked at you (not true, and if you had too many of them, no bigger mag would trust you.)
It included my trying to follow all the “rules” of writing, including “don’t use the verb to be” which for a while made my writing very stilted and odd. Also, I bought all the “you must revise five, seven, ten times” for each story. What happens when I do that – I once took a year to write a SHORT story – is that my stories become absolutely blah.
Until I went to Oregon and people took a look at my unedited stories and didn’t run screaming, I thought I needed this.
Now, am I going to tell you no one needs this? No, I’m not. I have friends who revise and polish multiple times and you don’t want to see their first drafts.
Is my process better than theirs? Oh, hell no. It’s faster. That’s a good thing in the current model. But what it REALLY means is that I’m a LOUSY reviser. I either hit it off the bat, or not. But it also means I need to improve by what I call “months of silence” where I study and experiment on pieces no one will ever see, before I am able to start a story “hot” and carry it through to the end readable, without having to revise.
However, for me the “one true way of writing” was a sand trap, which cost me years of livelihood, and years of work.
In the same way everyone saying that to be “really” published you must go through a traditional publisher is going to cost writers years of life, and is also implicitly endorsing a system that had become so dysfunctional it was selecting for “tone” and look of the writer, rather than any quality of the writing.
I love my traditional publisher, but truth be told, they’re not very traditional, and in fact all the other houses rage against how they do business and whom they buy. And yet, they’re the ones with the most fans on the ground.
I’ve been known to get a discount at my local Home Despot, in CO, because I wrote for Baen, and everyone in the store READ Baen. This doesn’t happen with any other brand. But if you hear the other editors, Baen is doing it ALL wrong, because they’re doing it differently.
And ultimately, that’s what matters – nothing succeeds like success.
Should you rewrite multiple times or publish your first drafts? I don’t know. I’m not you. Chances are your head doesn’t work like mine. I can tell you how I do it, but not how you need to do it.
Should you go indie or try traditional? You do it how it works for you, and if it doesn’t work you try another one.
But most importantly, you stop trying to impress the newbs with your wisdom and power. No one gave you the right to tell people how they should do their thing. If they fail, they’ll soon figure out the other methods. You can tell them “this is how I do it” because guidance is helpful.
But you don’t get to tell them how to do things and what things they should do, because you don’t know how other people’s mind works, you don’t know your taste is universal, and besides, you’re not the boss of anyone.
You didn’t just come down from the mountain, and I don’t see no stone tablets in your hands.
Let people find their own path. Advise them if they ask. Tell them “to publish here and there, I’ve found you have to do this” but stop already with “the only true way.”
Because this is my middle finger.
Oh, yeah, and drink more vodka!
According To Hoyt 
On the plane home last night, into early this morning… I sat next to a man who asked me about my book, and when I mentioned I was a writer on my way home from a workshop, started to tell me that he had been writing, but was sure there was no market for his memoir. I pointed out that you never know, and gave him the two pieces of advice I tell anyone who admits they want to write. One, just write. Don’t try to edit, or judge, or whatever, just finish it. Second, don’t destroy your work, no matter how terrible you think it is. It’s pretty simple…
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Thanks for that, it helps to read it.
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The last thing, after you finish it, is to let trusted people read it who will be honest with you (i.e., not your mom or girlfried, usually). You will likely be surprised at how well it’s received.
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Whiskey. Should be whiskey. >:(
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A good whiskey never goes out of style, and goes with every occasion.
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Vodka is nothing more than unflavored gin or unfinished whiskey.
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Vodka is poteen as made by all those nice Irish Viking boys who got stuck in Russia, the poor things.
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Vodka is fine.
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I hate the “drink water” nags, because they are stupid and wrong. Yes, your body needs x ounces of water to function a day. However, everything you consume contains water, all of which serves to hydrate it.
Iced tea, soda, even meat, all will hydrate you. Yes, you’ll need to consume more tea and soda to counteract the diuretic effect, but that’s really not a problem.
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I am also a lousy reviser (we could start an EA-editing anonymous–group). I write first draft and then second draft I check for spelling errors, bad sentences, and incoherencies. Then that is it… I must have read the same book on short stories ;-). I write better shorts than novels imho. BTW I am better at seeing other people’s mistakes… isn’t that always true though?
So yea, clueless writer– around 2007, I went through each element of fiction and wrote a non-fiction piece on it. It was the first time I was able to get the fiction form in my head. Yes, writing is my way of learning. I have written several shorts, micro-shorts, and four novels since then. Still not doing well, but I am not a good marketer either. ;-)
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Oh and about the water nags– I have to drink a certain amount of liquid a day (includes soup) and I can’t have more than 2 liters — compromised kidneys– so water and liquid amounts are different for every person. ONE size does NOT fit all.
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Which is precisely what will make Obamacare a total disaster.
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Yep–
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some people’s metier is short, some people’s is long. I find shorts much easier than novels. alas for the markets.
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oh yes– my poetry is short as well. I like to get to the point. ;-)
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I swear I got an evils of carbonation lecture from a doctor I had in AL. If you weren’t drinking plain water you weren’t hydrating. You had to drink 64 oz. of plain water every day, along with 30 minutes of aerobic exercise a day. Flavored still water didn’t count, and heaven forbid you drank anything carbonated. Water was to be preferred even over drinking milk.
I postively loathe and despise one size fits all medical advice. My doctor doesn’t believe me when I tell him my symptoms. If the PDR doesn’t mention it I’m not having it. For months I was telling him that I was having unusual sweats and chills, which I have found is related to my blood sugar levels and food consumption. I hate being treated like an idiot! He just has a set speech he gives us about eating better and exercising more. He keeps giving us the same speech. As far as blood sugars go, I need to have the same numbers as everyone else. He doesn’t believe me when I tell him that blood sugars of 109 make me dizzy. He doesn’t even believe that my meds dry me out. All he sees is that I’m in a bad way and that I must follow the prescribed path for all diabetics.
I know that diabetes is a serious disease but getting a standard lecture is frustrating. He also said that I shouldn’t go to an endocrinologist since he treats many diabetic patients.
Since I’ve been on insulin I’ve seen some great results in my blood sugars. I don’t know why he kept it as a last resort.
18 months ago he was all for changing my behaviors and that was going to make everything better. Eat right and exercise.
Sorry for ranting.
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Doctors should listen to their patients, because they are not feeling what the patient is feeling. Does he seriously believe that repeatedly telling you to do something that *hasn’t worked* is going to improve things? Sheesh.
I know one person, ONE person, who got off his meds for heart disease and diabetes through lifestyle changes. However, the factors that should be mentioned are that a) he was already biking double-digits several times a week, b) he was taught as a journalist back when that actually meant something, so he knows how to research and research WELL, and c) his area of expertise is gardening, so his dietary changes were very easy for him to implement, as he could grow the things he needed most.
The critical thing to note in the above paragraph is that HE was in charge of the changes—his doctors said he’d be on meds for the rest of his life after bypass surgery, and he didn’t like that, so he figured out how to circumvent it with *his* specific issues, not some grab-bag of what works in most cases (but not all.) I know too many people with bizarre quirks of their immune systems, and “one-size-fits-most” would probably kill them.
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What’s worse is what he’s doing to my husband. My husband is in a high-stress job in which lately he’s been working very long days, where getting 6 hours of sleep is a success.
He isn’t helping my husband at all! There has to be something to help people who don’t have the time to exercise or eat right. My husband currently has no gallbladder or pancreas. Lecturing someone isn’t motivational. The doctor seems to be very negative with my husband. He has goals for us that he makes and lectures us and tries to scare us into meeting his goals for us.
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Time to get a new doc– if you can.
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This is what’s going to kill people. When doctors aren’t concerned for their patients, and there’s no recourse, they’re going to go to textbook medicine, and a few people on the margins will die. We have the sterling example of the British National Health Service as a prime example. It’s almost enough to drive THIS diabetic to open armed rebellion. I’d much rather see a new national TEA Party to replace the rethuglycons and dummycritters that currently serve, with the provision in the Party bylaws that those from the two mentioned parties not be allowed to join the TEA Party without thoroughly PUBLICLY repudiating their previous idiotic ideas.
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This is the problem that inevitably occurs when physicians practice according to “standards of care” rather than “patient’s health.” It has been driven by insurance and malpractice requirements: the first because medical insurance companies have standard procedure manuals and the latter because tort lawyers have “failure to follow standard procedures” manuals. Under Obamacare this is about to metastasize into truly malignant proportions.
ALL physician practices, in order to get paid, will have to comply with the standard diagnostic and treatment plans established by the HHS and Death Panel — IPAB (Independent Payment Advisory Board) — bureaucrats. These august bodies will employ sampling and statistical measurements to ensure that monies are not wasted on non-standard care practices, even when applied to non-standard individuals.
Example (AKA: anecdote) — An acquaintance required a particular medicine that was normally grown in an egg medium, but because of allergies required a non-standard form grown in a non-egg medium. Her insurance company carried the standard version in its pharmacopoeia but would not approve the alternate version. After spending considerable time going around and around with the insurance and her doctors, she finally got her alternate approved (apparently the insurance company finally decided that a version of the drug with deadly side effects was contra-indicated.) Of course, when her pharmacy received the prescription they refused to fill it as it was not in the pharmacopoeia, requiring a new series of exchanges to get the druggist and insurance company to share a hymnal.
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My husband got off diabetes meds through lifestyle changes — but not the ones the doctor recommended. He went low carb and started exercising hours a day.
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As did I, after being diagnosed three years ago. My physician is delighted, and is no longer advocating that particular set of requirements for everyone. Or at least not for me.
Well, the daily exercising is still largely theoretical, but overall it’s working.
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Does he seriously believe that repeatedly telling you to do something that *hasn’t worked* is going to improve things? Sheesh.
Ever talk to a militant promoter of any big new diet?
It’s never a failure in the diet– it’s always that you’re not doing it right. Low carb doesn’t work for me, I feel ill and don’t lose weight; but that can’t be right, so it’s denied. Paleo makes me gain weight, so that’s not right.
*eyeroll*
I’ve even been called a liar for pointing out that repeated starvation dieting can make it so that you gain weight on next to nothing, so eating just enough to not be painfully hungry can still make you gain.
That people aren’t machines, and what works for one won’t work for another, is not an allowable option.
(I’m going to do periodic one-day mild fasting, as possible while nursing; I’ve had success before, and I simply don’t have TIME to exercise the way I want to.)
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Sib found that ten sets of five reps of baby lifts, either from floor or crib, were pretty good for building upper arm and shoulder muscles, while also improving balance (since Red 2.0 has entered the wiggly stage). I’m also told that the ten meter fleeing-toddler-chase is good for short bursts of cardio. :)
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Unfortunately– or maybe fortunately– my ONE outstanding hand/eye coordination point is in the “they’re about to do a runner into traffic” moments, and I select clothing that gives me a grabbing point.
We’ll see if the little Baron manages where Princess and Duchess have failed. Hope not, it would mean I’d have to keep him away from the ranch for longer…..
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This is where Oshkosh jeans overalls come in handy – first because they are of good quality (or they USED to be good quality! that may have changed since my mom and toddler days) that it would take at least two or three sequential kids to wear them entirely out, they are adjustable, in that straps can be shortened and cuffs rolled up a couple of turns so that you can dress them in something two or three sizes too large (heck, they grow so fast anyway!) and finally – the straps on the overall back make the most convenient handle in the world. With a bit of strength and skill, you can even lift up a small toddler by the back straps and hold them out so they cannot kick or bite you in that position!.
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Foxfier | September 30, 2013 at 3:45 pm
> Ever talk to a militant promoter of any big new diet?
> It’s never a failure in the diet– it’s always that you’re not doing it right.
Gee — where *have* we heard *that* line of “thinking” before?
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Sympathies to you and your dh … That 64-oz of water thing is a scripture for certain people, no matter that it’s been debunked. I had a minor surgery recently and was astonished at the followup visit when the surgeon’s obese office nurse handed me a nutrition guide that chanted all the debunked low-fat, high-carb diet advice. I wonder if that nurse follows that advice. I wonder whether people just get themselves into a routine and never question it, then or later.
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I’m a big water drinker, but that has to do with environment (dry) and medical conditions (need to be wet). I average 100 ounces a day, including diet soda, hot tea, and water.
Milk doesn’t count, because milk is food that G-d gave us to show how much He loves us. That’s why He also gave us brains enough to discover ways to turn milk into ice cream. :D
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I thought Ben Franklin said it was beer that shows us that he loves us and wants us to be happy?
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Personally, I attribute that to the fact that Mr. Franklin never had a chance to try either Mountain Dew or Cherry Coke. But that’s just me.
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Wayne, any alcohol at all and I’m out of the game, sicker than the proverbial dog. Even cakes with alcohol on them (ye classic fruitcake, tiramisu) get to me. Beer may be up there with ice cream, but not in Red’s world.
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Or Mike’s world, either. Alcohol hasn’t been a part of my “diet” since 1970. Does something to my lymph system and I swell up like a toad. Even too much bread or other yeasty products will do it.
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Hah! I have no adverse reactions to alcohol but still eschew it because I worked third shift for a decade plus and fell so out of practice consuming it that small amounts result in my falling asleep almost immediately. (Yeah, sleep apnea and being chronically underslept contribute as well.) As people do not seem to find this a habit which enhances my social interactions I just don’t bother.
Annoying, somewhat, as I was into craft beer back in the 70s, before it became trendy, and now that there are brew pubs catering to my preferences it is too
depressing…humiliating… embarrassing to be served the tasting sampler and find I have reached my consumption limit.This would make me a cheap date were there anyone trying to take advantage of me. As is, my standards are not sufficiently lax to make me accept any person who demonstrated such deplorable standards as to be interested in me (with the understood exception of Beloved Spouse who has clearly suffered some form of brain trauma and gets excused all sorts of peculiarities.)
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Not in my world either, not because I have a low tolerance (actually I have an extremely high one) or because I don’t like it. But rather because I like it all to much. I limit myself to a drink or so a year, and find I don’t miss it, while I know there is a noticeable difference in the pocketbook.
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Haha, dh and I worship at the altar of ice cream … every Sunday we have a sundae … love it!
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Emily, sounds like you need to change doctors. I tell a new doctor Iwillbe a part ofthehealth care team,or we are done. Sometimes it takes a couple of tries,butitis worth it.
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Emiy, you may have a _very_ good case for filing a medical malpractice complaint with the State Medical Board. I have a Pain clinic “dr.” who is convinced that I am diabetic. Every test for the last three years, says “No,” but he won’t believe it. If he continues, I will file a complaint. I haven’t done it yet, because my back pain makes me dependent on medication. (I have Degenerative Disk Disease from T-11 to L-5, leaving me with 40% function, from the waist down.) Unlike the quack who misdiagnosed me in 2002-2004, _he_ doesn’t work for the city/county/state, so he can be sued.
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I really am diabetic and have the A1C to prove it, However I think I need to switch doctors because his approach caused me to eat worse because of his nagging. Also hubby and I need a doctor that can help hubby and not just lecture him.
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Part of my intro to Diabetes, Type II included two sessions with a diabetic nutritionist who gave me the best advice of anybody with whom I dealt. Her recommendation was to monitor my blood glucose and track what spikes/drops it. Along with morning test strips I took a finger prick before a given meal and then repeated it an hour after completing the meal.
This, done with careful monitoring and analysis of my consumption helped me discern what foods/methods of preparation were particularly likely to give my system trouble. By maintaining a low-carb, high-protein diet during this testing period I quickly determined what was likely to spike and what could safely be accommodated. Some simple substitutions of favorable glycemic index foods (brown rice instead of white, whole grain breads for refined) I found myself managing a diet that is relatively lenient while keeping an A1C in the 5.0 area.
It burns test strips a bit profligately for a while, but it allows you to determine what works for you instead of some statistically average person.
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One other comment on this topic: I recommend a “purge” period, completely cutting out all sugars and high carb foods — sodas, sweet tea, cake, etc. This is to “re-set” your taste buds, conditioning them from current levels of sugars to lower dosages. It is easier to go from high sugar to no sugar to low sugar than it is to go from high sugar to low.
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Emily — I’m also a diabetic. My wife was just diagnosed last week as a “pre-diabetic”. She’s got an appointment with a dietitian next week. We’ll see how that goes. There ARE foods to stay away from, but most can be eaten in moderation without too much problem. I quit eating sugar back in 1984, when I was diagnosed as hypoglycemic. It kept me from becoming a diabetic for 25 years, so that was good. I eat low-carb most of the time, but need the fiber for other reasons. My body also flushes salt at a phenomenal rate. Potato or corn chips would provide both, but don’t do the trick for me, but saltine crackers do. I think we all have to find what works best for each of us. A GOOD doctor/dietitian can help: a bad one only complicates the problem
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At this point I hate dietitians and diabetes educators. They have a program and a plan for everyone and that’s it. They listen to your situation but their reply is show you how to fit into the plan.
I know that I eat poorly but I find it very difficult to eat as I should. My doctor recommended that I see a therapist with experience with diabetics. I turned that offer down. I don’t want to see a psychotherapist whose goal would be to make a more compliant patient. I’m projecting a little but..gee whilikers I hate being seen as a subject who needs to fitted in to a one size fits all program. They have these handouts they give everyone. Sorry for being grouchy.
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Walter — I hear you. I have degenerative disk disease from C-1 to L-5, spinal stenosis from C-1 to L-5, and osteoarthritis throughout the same area (and elsewhere). I had a GREAT doctor — until he ran into a tree up in Calgary a couple of years ago. With obamacare, it’s getting harder and harder to find a replacement. Doctors just don’t want to put up with the hassle of dealing with Medicare/Tricare.
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As far as the pronouncements from on high (or from the Capital Clown College) goes, as long as it’s not illegal to do so I’m going to be ignoring their ‘advice’. I’ve seen plenty of ‘healthy eating’ changes in the last 40 years, and not a whole lot of poundage dropped because of it… which makes me think that they’ve got something wrong and the advice coming is dubious at best.
As far as ‘writing’ goes – I’ve found that I didn’t write my first book in a sequential fashion, as in ‘Chapter 1, Chapter 2…’ and the like. Instead, I had 3-6 chapters up at a time that I basically hopped between. It was much easier to compare things that way, but my home setup’s a bit unusual with 4 screens. (Well, I couldn’t see not buying those 15″ flatscreens for $10 when the company I was working for was getting ready to scrap ’em…) 2 21″, 2 15″, and it works nicely. (USB to video adapters aren’t expensive at all…)
With book 2, I’m basically writing all 8 chapters essentially simultaneously. I rough out some dialog, some framing shots (so to speak) and then when I get all 8 roughed out a bit I get six chapters up on my screens (3 writing screens at a time, with the 4th used for detail research via Chrome) and I just hop between chapters, expanding and expounding as need be.
Within another week or so, I should have the second book up on KDP. I probably should try to figure out some way to market my work, but I’m having too much fun writing.
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I prefer Beer over Vodka. [Wink]
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To quote from one of the Greats (points if you know the author & book).
“Tia, my dear,” she said, “there are many drinks in this world. There are wines for the gourmet, there are whiskies and brandies for the men, there are sweet cordials for the women, and there are milk and lemonade for children—but for good friendly drinking, there is nothing that can compare with the honest beer of England.”
End Quote
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“Lord Darcy” by Randal Garrett. The story is “Too Many Magicians” chapter 13, the Dowager Duchess of Cumberland addressing Tia Einzig. One of my favorite books.
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I don’t know, “put it in the drawer for a while” sounds like a good hard and fast rule to insist upon
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Seriously, that’s one of the best bits of advice out there. Putting it away for a good long while lets you be more detached in judging. Put it away long enough, it’s almost like reading something by someone else.
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Yes, but it’s STILL not always right.
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“How long is helpful” varies from person to person. And book to book.
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Ah, yes. “Don’t start your story with your character waking up.” I’ve not only read a number, but wrote “Where There Is Smoke” and sold it to Sword and Sorceress XV.
Some are stronger than others. “Don’t have your character wake up and find the whole story was but a dream.” When the Alice books are classics. To be sure, in that case, the wake-up was not a deus ex machina but explained all the odd logic. Of course “No deus ex machina” is another rule — and yet Jane Austen managed to pull a nobleman out of her pocket in the last pages of Northanger Abbey to marry the hero’s sister and put the hero’s father in such a good mood that he consented to his marrying the heroine. Then, given the father had made up his mind, twice, on insufficient grounds, we knew that something would change that weathervane’s mind, we just didn’t know what. . . .
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“Don’t start your story with your character waking up” That’s amazingly bizarre advice. In response I can only quote:
“It was starting to end, after what seemed most of eternity to me.
I attempted to wriggle my toes, succeeded. I was sprawled there in a hospital bed and my legs were done up in plaster casts, but they were still mine.
I squeezed my eyes shut, and opened them three times.
The room grew steady.
Where the hell was I?”
Roger Zelazny, opening lines of “Nine Princes in Amber”
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The story begins:
So, no, never ever start your “start your story with your character waking up.” It has never worked and it never will work.
Except when it does.
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I thought that was an autobiography?
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Why do I have a sudden urge to write a Metamorphosis/Amber crossover fanfic?
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To be sure, I’ve gotten this advice from people who read the slush pile. Let us say that they are probably better informed than us about how often it fails.
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The people who read the slush pile probably aren’t the best source as to what works (at least as a literary matter. I’m sure they’re pretty reliable about what’s necessary to get published, or at least seen above their level). Their job is to find good stories to move up the chain, so any time spent reading bad stories is time not doing their job. That means they’re going to look for reasons to throw away a story as quickly as possible. If they decide that something in the beginning correlated with a bad story -even if that belief is false- they’re going to use that to quickly reject a submission.
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But there’s a difference between “sorting mechanism” and “rule of writing.”
I didn’t squeek up before, but a lot of these “you should NEVER” things are based on 1) stories that everyone knows and thus folks who probably can’t write yet use as a starter, or 2) things associated with the “wrong type” of story.
Has nothing to do with the quality of an individual story, but it will show up more in bad writing.
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No. Not even that. Not after a certain point, and not for everyone. Some people put it in a drawer and then give it time to start doubting themselves. I know. I was one of them.
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Didst notice how many of those things you cited were tautological?
“you can’t have first person narration that doesn’t sound amateurish,” — because first person narration, no matter how many times employed by Heinlein, L’Amour, Stout, Conan Doyle and countless other writers whose cumulative book sales would require too many zeros to count is automatically defined as amateurish. Never mind that the book which most pretentious lit critics hail as masterpiece — The Catcher In the Rye — is written in first person, as are two of the foundation texts of American literature — Huck Finn & Moby Dick.
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I’ve known for years that a lot of advice is bunk. I mean, eggs have gone from being healthy to unhealthy and back; the same has happened with butter. Low-fat diets may be killing us*, but that’s still the accepted standard for health. Why should it be any different for writing—or anything else?
*Fat brings flavor and satiation. If you take the fat out, what gets put in to substitute? (Personally, I believe that the best thing you can do for your health is learn to cook, because then you know what’s in your food.)
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They put in HFCS or sugar in place of the fat– which may be why we are seeing an uptick in Type 2 Diabetes.
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There was a great ‘That’s Jake” cartoon about the dangers of low-fat Mexican food. You have either fat or fire.
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I’ve got a theory that every “it’s healthy!” fad diet that’s gone on has ACTUALLY BEEN HEALTHY– that includes the “eat tons of carbs” ones, the “no fat” ones, the “no carbs” ones, and even the “no salt” type diets.
The problem is that they’re healthy for different folks. Low salt almost killed my dad, but it’s needed for some folks to deal with high blood pressure; an Akin’s/Paleo diet did nothing for my sister, but my brother looks great. My mom quite literally gains weight on about a thousand calories a day, while working like a dog, while my husband loses weight on over three thousand calories a day while sitting around. (I’m praying the kids get his metabolism, because mine is very efficient.)
So you get, oh, 10% of the population doing great on this or that diet because it works with their body and lifestyle– ignoring the “trick yourself into paying closer attention to what you eat” effect– with another 10-50% getting some sort of good effect, and the rest having bad to horrible effect and thus quitting the dang diet before it’s tested. I don’t know about you, but when I get sick as a dog after starting a diet I change what I eat.
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Yeah. In the study of people who kept 30 or more pounds off they found that they use all sorts of diets to do it.
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Yes. The problem with this reality is that it doesn’t lend itself to governmental or quasi-governmental dictat. So we remain subversive …
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My husband and I did Atkins. He lost weight. I didn’t.
Now we’re doing a paleo-thing-sorta… it’s working for both of us. It works best for me when I eat lots of the vegetables that Atkins forbade. Sweet potatoes and carrots and tomatoes, even corn… just *veggies*. And then the meat and bacon and more bacon, of course.
My theory is… the high fiber wheat items common to Atkins are like eating wheat on steroids.
I even do pretty good “cheating” with potatoes, rice and oatmeal, so long as I don’t eat wheat. I don’t *lose* weight when I do that, but I don’t really gain it back either. No, I don’t have celiac, but I’ve come to the conclusion that whole wheat and wheat-bran is *not* more healthy than Wonder Bread.
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On dieting, I’m more like the sit around eating 3k calories type- but if I *forget* to eat (shut up, this totally happens), I get sick. And by forget, I mean not eat at the very very least once every 2-3 hrs awake and even remotely active.
For getting sick as a dog when changing diets, my doc (old guy, knows his stuff) told me when you do this your stomach has to acclimate. You’ll get an upset stomach for a while until the flora or whatever acclimate to new input.
These days I follow the gut diet. Some days I want salad, veggies, gimme more green growing things! Others, I nosh on steak and potatoes, chicken and rice. I figure my gut tells me it wants, say, Korean, I make Korean and happy gut is happy me. *grin*
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Upset stomach is one thing; seeming to have the flu (usually without nausea) is another.
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I can’t go with a “follow my gut” diet. I never eat anything but ice cream, cookies, and pizza.
Fortunately an Atkinsish series of menus (designed by a fitness trainer friend of mine) has worked well enough for me. I’ve backslid this year, but I’m still a good 35lbs below my max weight.
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I’d live on milk and carrots and the occasional almond m&m. I hate stopping to eat
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Milk n’ M&M’s…sounds grand. Carrots kinda skew it, though.
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I think it was a TED talk that mentioned there is as much nerve tissue in your gut as in your brain, and considering that our ancestors have been eating quite a bit longer than they’ve been thinking it makes sense that your gut has a pretty good mechanism for getting what it needs.
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I think this is one of the big things that kept me from attempting writing for so long. My brain just doesn’t want to follow somebody else’s path. Combine that with trad horror stories and not seeing anybody writing the kind of stuff I liked for so long and I quit writing fiction in HS. But I kept telling myself stories.
Then I got a wild hair and started working out some of my stories through the keyboard, focusing on craft and presentation. And I started hanging out at writerly type places and seeing what other folk were going through. And I started to think, maybe.
But those one true path nags still get to me, now and again. There are specific reasons I’m susceptible to the idea, so I have to be alert for the doubt it introduces. And I have to go read over my stuff again and compare, just to make sure I’m not crazy. Here’s hoping not. I kinda like the way I go about storytelling.
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It’s strange. I’ve never given the “One true path” people much credence, for anything. I almost always wind up doing things at least a little different from what they say, and often quite a bit different.
As for writing, I never heard all that stuff, because I never studied writing as a craft, only the basic things like sentence construction, basic grammar, spelling, dividing work into paragraphs, etc. And then I read all kinds of stuff where a fictional character is complaining about the difficulties of getting a publisher to look at their stuff, and the downs of rejections, when I finally decided to start writing last year, I figured Indie would be the way for me, and I’ll write the way I dang well think is right for the story.
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In most things I pay no attention to one true path proponents. But when it comes to interacting (and writing/selling is interacting) with the public I have to slap on my ‘dealing with aliens’ interface (hand-made, painstakingly, over many years) to be sure it all makes sense.
From that perspective I’m inclined to doubt that what I think I’m saying is what other people are getting, and so I’m susceptible to “this is the way writing is done.” And when I look at their result and think “Wuh?” Well, that’s the way I see a lot of social interaction, so what’s new?
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Oh, come now. How many people reading this page don’t have one of those interfaces? ;-)
I do have one advantage. I spent 7 years explaining things to people and/or trying to fix their problems, over the phone, while at the same time trying not to talk down to them (even if they were blithering idiots). Made a huge difference in how I look at talking to people I don’t know.
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I picked up a public persona through this and that experience along the way. Oftentimes learning that the one which worked over there was really kind of awkward over here. Nowadays, I can (hopefully) usually sort through the interface settings and find the one that fits the moment.
But interacting with other people has an immediate feedback mechanism that allows for some course correction. In writing, that is delayed, and therein lies the challenge.
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As I was learning to cook my breakthrough came with a recipe for fried rice that essentially said:
With that instruction I went from following recipes to actual cooking.
I expect the same thing applies to writing. Until you understand your craft you follow recipes (incantations, rituals, whatever) because you benefit from that structure’s freeing you to write. When the structure becomes your focus you need to abandon the recipe and cook according to the ingredients with which you are working.
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It is past time to demand the experimental research supporting the “drink water” advice. I recently saw an article (IIRC it was an Instapundit link) exploring the absolute lack of evidence for this “requirement.”
It is also appropriate to ask for more detail (as if any professional journalist would dare such an act of lèse majesté.) When I was a youth I received the “drink eight glasses of water daily” advice but failed to realize the doctor had failed to specify what size glasses. 8 oz.? 10 oz.? 16 oz.? Tap, mineral spring or distilled? At the time I received that advice I weighed perhaps 100 lbs — should I be altering dosage now that I tip in at 210? Why not — every other dosage seems to be calibrated for mass?
Is this dosage the same for men and women, even though women have higher base body fat percentages and therefore retain water differently? Should the dosages be adjusted for environment — increased in low humidity, decreased in high? Adjusted for activities? Do I need less water when sitting by the pool reading than when digging a new garden bed, for example?
At what frequency ought I consume this water? Do I change the intervals between dosages commensurate with dosage amounts? Do I drink the glass all at once or do I sip at it over an hour or two?
Really, if people are going to give medical advise they need to be specific or face malpractice charges.
Oh, and vodka is merely water, distilled to remove impurities with an antibacterial agent added to preserve freshness.
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I’m too lazy today to look it up, but if you search for the 8 glasses of water story on Wikipedia, then go down to the reference links at the bottom, you will find that 1) the original person who made the statement said something like, “8 glasses worth of water per day”, and that includes the water in your food. Other links will indicate that Coffee and Tea have been shown to not be diuretic after you get used to them, so they are fine for hydration, too.
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8oz of anything you’d just call water, and it’s supposed to be a sort of general rule, assuming you don’t drink anything else. Sometimes clear liquids, too. (That means yes to coffee and cranberry juice, no to milk and orange juice.)
One version in an old medical book at grandma’s was 5 oz– those cute little glasses that were on everybody’s night stand, still used to take pills with or at some restaurants?
I don’t know about anyone else, but when I go for a drink of water I drink at LEAST 16 oz. (A big tumbler.) If I’m thirsty, 24, generally without stopping to breath more than once. (Because I don’t like water all that much, and 24 oz is the size of the old juice bottle I have.)
Anyways…the idea is to, um, keep your system going. On the solid disposal area.
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Almost a decade ago a buddy posted “Semi Quantitative Determination of Britta Water Filter Efficiency in Vodka Impurity Removal”. Google can’t find it. I’ll see if he knows the URL later.
Let’s just say that “remove impurities” is a bit of an overstatement.
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Spices, and alcohol — for when your culture is too backwards to produce Fresh Meat and Clean Water…. >:)
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it just doesn’t remove them ALL. . . .
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I dunno about that one, but the Mythbusters got hold of the notion and tested it:
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“Really, if people are going to give medical advise they need to be specific or face malpractice charges.”
(Well, I just wrote up a nice long thing and the power went out so… short version.)
People can die of drinking too much water too quickly.
So don’t do that.
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Question: is it possible for someone with healthy, functioning kidneys to overdose on water without forcing themselves to do so? I mean, every time I’ve been drinking large quantities of water (e.g., when I’ve been in an un-air-conditioned building in a hot climate and knew I was going to need it) there would come a point where the water stopped tasting good and started tasting bland, and I would have to force myself to continue. I generally would stop at that point, because I figured that was my body’s feedback mechanisms saying “Okay, I have enough water now, time to stop.” (And generally, my urine would be clear enough afterwards to confirm that my kidneys were now pulling water out of my bloodstream.)
Now, if I had forced myself to continue, I could probably have drunk too much water. But is it possible for someone with functioning kidneys to not have the feedback mechanism that says “stop now”? Or is the “you can kill yourself drinking too much water” warning only necessary for the people who don’t know to listen to their body’s signals?
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Hard to tell; it would depend on what else they’d been doing diet wise, I suspect. Lots of folks get heat stroke, and even die of it, and that can be triggered by “too much water” relative to the other elements (usually salt) they’re eating.
I suspect that a diet that only removes one would raise the risk, since they’d just start craving potato chips instead of wanting less water.
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Without forcing themselves? I don’t know. Being forced by medical responders? Yes. Petite women doing endurance sports can have a problem with this, being given too much in fluids by medical people. A good friend of ours had to be hospitalized for hyponutremia, not due to the effects of the race, but because she asked for fluids after and they filled her up like a water balloon and wouldn’t release her until she was swollen and bloated. She would have been better off suffering with the dehydration effects and rehydrating the natural way. Unusual, to be sure. And of course no one believes her description of the situation; after all, our heroic first responders couldn’t have been wrong.
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See comment elsewhere about adjusting dosage for body mass amount and composition.
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I had to look it up, I couldn’t remember the exact quote by Paracelsus:
All things are poisons, for there is nothing without poisonous qualities. It is only the dose which makes a thing poison
Paracelsus did not know about Plutonium, of course.
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‘kus I gotta kill the joke….
lutonium has often been called the most toxic element known to man. However, in the normal meaning of
“toxic” — that is, a poison with a fairly fast, often fatal, effect — scientists do not consider plutonium as
very toxic at all. It is not comparable, for instance, to botulism, poison mushrooms, or certain chemicals,
Click to access plutonium.pdf
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Is it possible to have Vitamin C poisoning?
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Yes, and especially men can be affected by mega doses of Vit. C. I’d have to look for the study I read a while back on this.
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yes
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Easier than vitamin D poisoning– I’ve heard of folks getting seriously sick from C.
D, on the other hand, some crazy guy was doing uber mega doses, AND ordering his own meal program with what was supposed to be ten times the dose, but was actually 100 times, and taking supplements… and all that happened was he felt cruddy and his feet bled. (sunlight destroys D after a set point)
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It has to be an extremely high amount, but the answer is yes. Many people take many times the recommended daily dose when sick to help them fight it off, and children (and occasionally myself) eat those tasty chewable vitamin C’s like candy.
Of topic, but for some reason this brought to mind the fact that I was once informed to never eat Polar Bear liver (why I needed informed I have no idea, since I refuse to allow any type of liver in the house, and have no idea where I would have access to Polar Bear liver anyways) because it is so high in some vitamin (E?) that it is poisonous.
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Vitamin A. One of the polar expeditions got seriously ill and failed, partially to not having enough rations and partially due to eating polar bear liver.
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I have no idea. And I’m not a doctor or anything resembling one.
When I looked it up, some of the stuff was just horrific (and people in prison for murder over it) but others was just someone drinking too much water, feeling sick, getting given more water for “heat stroke” or something, getting sicker… I was looking for actual quantities and didn’t find anything. (caveat… my google-foo is non-existent)
One case mentioned in wiki was a female in AF training. When I was at basic they made us down two full glasses of water before we started eating each meal… in February in Texas. During the summer I’d heard they made it three. Well, a 180 pound guy drinking three full glasses of water before beginning a meal isn’t going to be the same thing as a 100 pound girl drinking three full glasses of water before a meal.
The description of the problem, though, seemed to be that the quantity of water unbalanced the electrolytes in a person’s system so… eat salty snacks or drink Gatorade (always gives me headaches) or Brawndo? Certainly there’s a lot out there about getting enough salt in hot weather.
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I remember reading someone’s story of when he decided to stop listening to the nutrition advice he was getting and do what seemed to work for his body. He was always being told that too much salt was bad for you, eat a low-sodium diet, etc…. but he always felt weak and shaky after a workout. Then he started ignoring that advice and taking salt tablets immediately after working out, and he finally got rid of the post-workout weakness.
If there’s one thing I’m going to take away from this, as a non-medical expert myself, it’s “dosage, dosage, dosage.” See Charlie Martin’s article about the “10 becquerels per square centimeter” level of exposure that one journalist* was hyperventilating about.
* Pardon my insulting language, but I think the guy deserves being called a “journalist”. Not Charlie, of course — I mean the author of the “oh noes, we’re going to die!” article that Charlie was dissecting.
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Salt is an essential nutrient.
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After reading a first responder’s article on dehydration and over-hydration, I started taking a pinch of salt to the back of my throat before drinking water after working outside in the heat. All of my heat headaches and logy-ness disappeared. It’s a bit hard to do but I don’t like to drink salty water.
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Bourbon!
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Yes. I like my water, distilled to remove impurities with an antibacterial agent added to preserve freshness* to have a smoky flavor.
*All credit to RES.
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Hehe, amusingly the “what to do and how to do it” made me bristle because I am incredibly sick of folks who complain that you won’t ask them to to stuff, then either do it so wrong it takes twice as long to fix and redo as nothing at all or whine about being told how to do something. For bonus, the “screwed it up” folks WILL whine about you not telling them how you wanted it done, and if you remember this and tell them how you want it done next time they’ll throw a fit and say:
“Tell me what you want done and let me do it– if you want to tell me how to do it, do it yourself!”
And then they act like victims if you call them on any of this.
I spend a lot of time fixing the simple jobs folks begged to have and then managed to screw up, while they complain about my not being grateful enough for their help……
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Shorter form:
PEOPLE!!!
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I know, right? And I don’t even ask to shoot any of them. All I want is a work-issued taser, but you would not BELIEVE the whining and complaining and “not-a-team-player-ing” I get in response. Fie on the lot of them!
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Umm… an over the internet Taser that can shock the whiners w/o being next to them. I’d buy that… I’d even read it. ;-) *wink
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If work refuses to supply you with one, and you have to buy your own, at least you should be able to write it off on your taxes as a work expense. :)
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Sarah, I think we should all know “the rules” and know them well enough to understand why they make a story work, and why they may handicap a story, too. And since there are multiple one rules, there are times when the rules contradict one another. For instance, a rule of gravity says that heavier-than-air things fall. But another rule of aerodynamics says that some airfoils generate lift. Thus, you can fly home from a writing seminar by “breaking the rules.”
You aren’t really breaking the rules. If your story doesn’t crash and burn, it’s found a balance between the forces in play that govern writing and reading. If you don’t understand the rules very well, you’ll make simplistic assertions like, “never use adverbs,” he said pontificatingly. But when you understand the rules better you’ll gracefully make your way.
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I only use one rule– if you have to use Deus ex machina, then make it interesting or unusual. The rest– character, description, dialog is in service of the story and change as the story changes.
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if you HAVE to use a deus ex machina, then you need to provide a little (as little as a sentence or two) of foreshadowing. That’s why God gave us word processors.
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yep
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yep :-)
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Real-Life Example of DEM: Gen. Gordon Granger, Battle of Chickamauga, 1863.
Granger’s job was to protect a bridge north of the battlefield, and to only come south to the battle when ordered. The battle went on, and on, and on; Granger became ever-more agitated, believing he and his needed to be south, where the battle was. Finally, he snapped “I am going to Thomas, orders or no!”, and took all but a brigade south.
He got there just in time to reinforce the remnants of the Army of the Cumberland under George Thomas; due to a screwup in orders, the Confederates had managed to split the Union army. Half the Union troops (including Gen.s Rosecrans, McCook, and Crittenden) had fled the field; the other half had found their ways to Thomas, and were holding up the enemy so the retreat didn’t turn into a rout. Granger showed up with fresh troops and additional ammo, allowing the rump of the Army to hold until nightfall, and extract from under the Confederates’ noses.
No one ordered Granger to go south; no messages reached him. He had no way of knowing what was going on. He had only instinct to guide him — and his instinct said “SOMETHING IS DESPERATELY *WRONG*”.
Try putting that in a novel, and the jaded Mob won’t buy it.
But it happened.
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It has often happened in history – such people and events as to seem the contrivances of a dramatic novelist. But they really were, and things did happen. The writers of novels have to make sense, but real life often turns on amazing chances and coincidences. There was an author who made a pithy comment to this effect, but it is past 6 PM and I have gone to my second glass of chardonnay, so I cannot recall whom. Perhaps one of the chardonnay or vodka-eschewing Huns can call that quote to mind.
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I see it attributed to Mark Twain, but Leo Rosten and Oscar Wilde also get credit (or mis-attribution?) Sorry for not digging deeper: I’ve got a serious case of Bach-brain (The Magnificat).
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Charlotte Brontë had that telepathy scene in Jane Eyre and made it work. No excuses, no explanations.
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I love what Jasper Fforde did with it in The Eyre Affair, too. (If you haven’t read Fforde yet, then this is me shoving you in the direction of your local library and/or bookstore, depending on the current state of your book-buying budget).
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hmm. . . no one’s recommended that on goodreads yet. . . hmmm. . .
What shelf does it belong it? Does anyone have any ideas?
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Lit’wa’wy. YMMV
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Don’t have a literary shelf yet. And if we made one, wouldn’t it be lonely there?
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“Truth is stranger than fiction because fiction has to be plausible.”
I don’t know who said that. Heck, I’ve been saying that for so long it might have been me, but I don’t think so… ;)
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An excellent example I read just t’other day: A nine-year-old boy who is so smitten by a movie — Code of the Secret Service — that when he grows up he joins the USSS, and saves the life of the man who played the lead in that film: Saving Reagan.
No writer of fiction would dare such hackneyed coincidence.
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Tom Clancy wrote that phrase into a novel, but I have no idea if he was the first to say/write it. A quick search-engine finds it attributed to three other people, so *shrug*.
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I think this may be the earliest version, and the one I like best. “Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn’t.”
Mark Twain
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I think you could put that in a novel and have it work. Making it work is the trick. If you spend some “time” with the Granger character and show him becoming more agitated even if he doesn’t know why he thinks something is wrong, maybe he didn’t have any real expectation of getting word but in the back of his head wondered why there had been no traffic from that direction… or something. Even if he still goes out on what is only, by any measure, a *hunch*, you’ve built his actions into the story in a rational way. He get’s there in time but… the reader will have the possibility that he’d arrive too late, so it won’t be too conveniently pat and set off the “Oh! That’s cheating!” reaction.
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It also helps if it’s not the climax of the story.
A writer was once posting online about a murder and conspiracy to commit murder case where a defendant’s wife was insisting on his alibi, that she knew what the time was because Bonanza came on just as he came home, and the prosecution could not shake her. Then the prosecution put the TV station manager on the stand, and he testified that Bonanza had been pre-empted that night.
She said that it would not work in a story. I said at the time, you were just the wrong POV. But even in the right POV, it probably wouldn’t work as a climax. A lawyer in the prosecution office might have it work as an incident that impresses on him the need for attention to detail, or he might alienate his co-workers by thinking of checking and being right when they never thought of it. Or it could be an inciting incident. I can just imagine the baleful look the more hardened conspirator could give his cohort, and the resultant revenge plot. To be sure, for a Human Wave story, the crooks could not be the main characters for murder — but if they were, say, running a con to take money from the hideously corrupt official or something — and also you could tell it from the point of view of the cop charged with keeping the less competent crooks alive while they spilled their evidence for protection, or from a bystander of the revenge plot who got sideswiped and had to act.
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Like an angel with a face that looks like the result of an industrial accident? :)
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lol– oh that would work ;-) a Mafia angel
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Lol.
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There are two kinds of rules.
1. This is how you go about writing a story. These are all guidelines. (Put your story away for a time so you can revise it cold. When you have two descriptive details and know you need only one but can’t pick, put them both down and revise out the one you don’t want; much easier than remembering the perfect detail you didn’t put down.)
2. This is what a story must have. There are some real rules here, and if you break them, they break you. Unfortunately, no one has ever succeeding in formulating them. There are approximations. Some are better than others.
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Not only do airfoils “fight gravity,” but _inverted airfoils, of the right design, are better. NASA has several designs that prove it.
I have followed only one rule. “Catch their interest in the first 2-3 paragraphs.” NOTE: this doesn’t apply to textbooks. :-)
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Everybody who’s successful at it figures out what works best for them. The only advice I’ve found to work for everybody is Sturgeon’s Guarantee. No not Sturgeon’s Law. That’s something else. It’s not that people can’t give you good advice or help on your writing, just that you have to learn to ignore the advice that doesn’t sound right to you. A writer can help himself by learning to ask the right questions of readers. Most attentive readers can spot something wrong even if they can’t define it, but advice on how to fix it is almost always wrong. The great editors learn this, and this is why writers’ groups have a tendency to fail. Of course they want to help you fix it, they’re writers too. Wrong, wrong, wrong.
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Exactly, but as you started out saying, not all advice is going to be wrong, wrong, wrong. You have to identify the advice that speaks to you. I was just listening to an author talk about his craft (Alan Dean Foster – got to interview him a couple years ago), and with his first book, he sent it to John W. Campbell Jr., who sent him back six pages of notes. Some of the notes he included, others he didn’t, and he sent the book back… And got another six pages of notes. Some of which he included, others he didn’t. And with the third draft, Mr. Campbell said “I think you’ve got a salable yarn here…” which he couldn’t buy but which did sell to another publisher and kicked off his writing career – that book was The Tar-Ayim Krang.
The trick is identifying what writing advice sounds right to you and which you think will help, and what writing advice doesn’t fit you. Taking no advice from anyone seems about as effective as taking all advice from everyone.
I also just read Stephen Pressfield’s new book – The Authentic Swing last week. The tl:dr version of that boils down to: There’s a way that works for you. Find it and do it. Some advice will get you closer to that, some doesn’t, and I think you get better at recognizing it as you do more work.
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Given the season of the year, I am minded of what many a baseball hitting coach has reportedly advised: what matters is that you “get the bat head through the hitting zone” effectively.
Because every hitter is going to be (at least) slightly different from every other hitter, no two hitters will have the same stance, take the same swing nor have the same follow-through. Nor should a coach try to force a batting style onto a hitter, just refine the hitter’s approach so as to reduce waste motion and anything that interferes with getting that bat head smoothly through the hitting zone.
Because no two writers bring the same tools to a book (indeed, no writer brings the same tool kit twice — if only because the prior writing experience informs the latter) the “rules” and advice given cannot be the same. Sometimes there will be a story which needs to be first person, sometimes it only comes alive in the third. Sometimes a story will require a deus ex machina, sometimes a string of improbable coincidences, sometimes an inexorable layering of fates. The key is getting that bat head through the hitting zone so that it meets the story squarely and knocks it out of the park. Whether the story you are hitting is a high hard one, a slider low and away, a backdoor curve or a screwball is what determines how your swing is effective.
If you don’t understand advice it seems unlikely it will profit you to follow it, no matter how good that advice may be, if only because your lack of understanding indicates you are not able to put that particular word of advice to effective use.
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Especially if all your readers agree that there is a problem somewhere — there’s probably a problem
My favorite time was the readers who heavily agreed that my story was warped, I was fair to one side but the other side was a straw man. The problem was, they didn’t agree which side it was. (I suspect I hit a nerve, actually.)
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We’re not related are we? I don’t now, never have, and likely never will write professionally, but there are other areas of work and life where there’s someone who believes that they are the be all and know all on some subject which they may have some knowledge of, but not much. Doesn’t stop ’em they’re gonna tell ya how to do it, and if you don’t they have a fit. Although I’ve managed to restrain myself for the best part of 72 years, one of these days my restraint may well fail me and someone will end up less healthy than they started out the day. I certainly hope not, but never can tell.
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Oh, my…first you mention one of my favorite people who I neglect horribly (Hi Charlie…) and then you present the middle finger (is it Flying, Fickle or conjuring up Fate) to One True Wayists…Brava!!!!
And, yes, it is okay to write in the first person.
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Sarah, Sarah, Sarah, one must never hold others under water until the bubbles stop. The officious bungholes may just be holding their breath. Always better to make sure, so an application of several very heavy rocks is recommended, though anchor chain will do quite nicely as well.
I guarantee that if you let them loose too soon they will rise up and proceed to tell you in loud and obnoxious terms how you’re doing it all wrong.
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Drinking more water is a scam by the government to steal our purity of essence.
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Or dilute it.
Or maybe they want us to be so busy running off to the bathroom that we don’t have time to stir up trouble.
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“the First Nagger” this is a beautiful phrase, describes the woman perfectly.
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Either that, or, “Nag Lady”.
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Just don’t use it on FB or you’ll be banned … sigh …
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Elsewhere, as well. The kind of twits who tie themselves into knots to find a reason to dismiss your arguments without rebuttal (because they’re incapable of rebutting) will eagerly claim you’re just employing a substitution trick with the initial vowel to disguise your raaaaacist dog-whistle.
Remember, their goal is not to answer your argument, their goal is to cast you into the outer darkness, not least for the purpose pour encourager les autres.
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I didn’t even think of that. Yeah, they would throw an absolute fit over it.
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I didn’t think of it either
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Listening to talk radio this morning where one caller mentioned hanging a famous (famously black) person’s bad decision around his neck and the following caller started howling about shutting down discussion by code-talking about lynching. It is becoming a situation where no discussion is allowed for any reason because of…what? Is the only non-racist behavior now slavish obedience and submission to random whims of self-appointed betters?
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Of course it is. What were you thinking?
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Exactly!!
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And they don’t understand, cannot understand, that conservatives don’t use dog whistles and code because, unlike Progs, they are actually proud of their beliefs and moral stances.
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If they stopped believing in dog whistles and codes, they might have to actually face what the conservatives says which would shake them to the core.
It’s been tested. Jonathan Haidt did many studies of moral judgment by political alignment. Then he did one where he had liberals, conservatives, and libertarians try to take the test as if they were some other alignment. The ones that did worst were liberals, and it didn’t matter which they were asked to role-play.
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That Jonathan Haidt book, The Righteous Mind, was fascinating. That’s also the one the postulates that “conservatives” have a broader ethical base than their liberal friends and neighbors, and that they perceive potential harms and hazards that the libs do not. It was very interesting. >
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The odd thing is that Haidt doesn’t realize why liberals tend to react with anger to his theory. I would think it simple to understand why if you tell people that there are five or six moral foundations, that all of them are legitimate, and that they are so morally stunted they can’t perceive half of them — like being deaf AND having no sense of taste or touch — they might find it a bit annoying.
Especially when they pride themselves on their moral superiority.
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And not emotionally trying to manipulate people.
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Same thing with AGW. It’s not about the data, it’s about where you find it and who’s saying it. If it’s not from an authorized ‘Climate Scientist'(tm) it is immediately branded heresy and every attempt is made to shout down the offensive information.
And yes, I’m using heresy deliberately. AGW, for the most vocal proponents, is an apocalyptic religion at this point – complete with a need for sacrifices to stave off terrible disasters, and any mention of a possibility that the disaster WON’T erupt if you don’t give that virgin and most of your worldly goods to the High Priests is met with screaming denial…
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Oh noes! The last story I went through and edited starts with the person crying! Actually, I think she spends most of the story trying to fight down panic and crying.
(Well, okay, she doesn’t actually *cry* until the end of the second paragraph.)
:)
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Sarah, I`m not a writer but enjoy your insights on everything. It looked like you were wishing for a complement with “I am a lousey writer”. I`ve never read one of your works that I didn’t enjoy, across different genres and both short and long works.
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You might want to read that sentence again.
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No. I’m a lousy reviser. So I have to try for as good 1st time copy as I can. :) wasn’t’ t fishing for compliment but thank you
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It’s not actually possible for me to drink less vodka, but I like the current amount; you can have mine. I don’t drink things that contain alcohol. That’s why I prefer ginger beer to beer beer.
I send my books in to Steve Jackson Games, and if they tell me to change things, I change them. Then they go through peer review and I fix anything the reader pool had trouble with. But I don’t have much urge to revise, usually. Either the document goes right from the time I get the first line, or I start over and do a new document—but that’s a sign I hadn’t figured out where I was going.
On the other hand, I make my living editing other people’s documents, so I can always see things to fix in somebody else’s prose!
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Calling Stephen Green, Vodka emergency!
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Sarah I still remember the advice you gave me mumble mumble years ago when we were still in the group. I was over editing my stories and you told me to stop, that I was editing the life out of my stories. I did what you said, and sales improved. Thank you.
When I write now I am lucky to have a built in first reader. Becky is a much better writer than I am, IMHO, so when I think my story is ready I get her take and make final edits. But my stories still have life.
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I drink alcohol, I die.
(So stop sending it to me, damn it! >;) )
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One thing for which I shall be forever grateful to the Navy is teaching me how to say “noted” in a way that conveys “I heard you. I understand you. I just don’t ^%(*ing care.”
And I don’t want to hold them underwater until the bubbles stop. Lighting them on fire is much less work and far more entertaining. Just don’t do it near your drapes.
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“Lighting them on fire is much less work and far more entertaining. ”
Plus you keep them warm for the rest of their lives!
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It’s win-win-win!
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I just finished grading my students first written memorandum in an online class I teach.
I need a lot of vodka.
Oh, and as for the state of our education system? We are doomed.
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From time to time I wonder if the private school where I teach should add, “Your children will rule the world because only they will be able to read and write” to its advertising.
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It would be only the truth.
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AND my kids, because I made them learn, dang it.
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So you are saying that if one of your sons was in my class, and I gave a complicated legal research problem, and expecting a three or four page memo of legal research with case citations, state and Federal statutes, I would not get the following legal memo in response:
“The article at XX A.L.R.2nd YY answers the question.”
That was the entire memo submitted. And it was probably the third best ….
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Well, my kids would turn in a 40 page monograph complete with exceptions and weird case history, but yeah… (You’ve met my kids, right?)
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Haven’t met ’em but saw their pictures in the “White Slavery” section of Craigs’ List.
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The student knew what the format was supposed to be, and wrote that anyway?
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Yep. And had been told a week before that his single citation wasn’t acceptable.
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Your tale isn’t as dismaying as the thought of all those students unable to get into such a class — presumably somebody assigned such a paper is among the academic crème de la crème.
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Creme de la creme? No, we are talking my paralegal course.
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He deserves to flunk.
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Maybe the student will listen to you, where they are not listening to me …
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It would be nice to think so, but then there’s this cautionary tale from H. G. Wells http://www.online-literature.com/wellshg/3/.
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The state of writing among the 20-35’s is awful. I reviewed technical reports and was appalled at what I read. This was going into the archives somewhere?
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I was very young when I started writing, but I got sidetracked with a career that I loved more than anything. Still, time passes, and after twenty years in business I retired and looked around for something different — and new. My first thought was teaching. I had a high SAT, but not even a high school diploma and I knew I’d have to go to college if I wanted to teach. I started researching requirements and one of the first classes prospective teachers had to take was something called “ESL” Hah! I came out of IT, with more acronyms than the US Government, but that one stumped me. “English as a Second Language.” Double Hah! English was my first language! I studied a bit more, learned my error — about then I found the teaching payscale and was appalled. I paid my janitor more! I paid the mail room clerk more!
So, I started looking and settled on film school. I’d always wanted to write and Hollywood! Gosh! Hollywood! Academy awards and all of that. The sad thing is, that the first thing you learn in film school is the purpose of film school is separating money from the marks. Actually, unless you have a job in the industry, everyone wants you to pay your way. Cash on the barrelhead, no credit allowed!
One night I was entertaining myself alone on my hotel room in Hollywood, reading porn. I got disgusted with it, because the characters, such as they were, well “wooden” wouldn’t be far off. Plot? Whazzat? And, like some other writers I could mention, I uttered those fatal words: “I can do better than that!”
So I wrote stuff. posted it on porno sites and the readers swooned! Real characters, real plots! I was there when Jackie Lichtenberg said the worst mistake she ever made in her writing career was doing fanfic! Halfway competent story telling gets you all sorts of kudos from the fans. With heaps and loads of praise, you are off to the races! Another Hemingway or Tolstoy!
Except, of course, you’re not. I kept getting really short rejection letters. (With movie scripts it’s different — we put them in the trash can and you never hear back — every industry needs a Simon Cowell) On one of the sites I posted on, someone asked me what was with my grammar and punctuation? I laughed and said, “Nothing I know of,” and he sent me back one of my over-long chapters — about 6000 words — and Word wouldn’t flag more than 500 errors — and there were more. I didn’t know how to punctuate dialog; worse, I was inconsistent. I had no idea where to put commas, semicolons and ellipses — I sprinkled them liberally throughout my work.
I learned better. I studied grammar and punctuation like I never had in school (amusing anecdote (I sidetrack easily): in the opening episode of Castle this season has his daughter’s boyfriend saying, “That spelling shit? It stifles creativity.” The look on Nathan Fillon’s face was priceless)
A long story, but hard to shorten. Now I’m an indie writer on Amazon. One of the things I learned publishing porn was to loath different formats, so I’m just on Amazon. One of my novels (briefly) outsold David Weber’s latest. I’m still learning the adjuncts of my craft, and my craft itself. I feel like I’m not competent to teach it, because I’m just beginning to understand it myself.
IMHO, the secret to writing is like the secret of shooting well: get comfortable, take your time and aim as carefully as you can. Learn from your mistakes and be honest about them…
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