No Space for Sewing Circles

Posted on by Sarah A. Hoyt
A shirt with women involved in epic space fights is no reason to shame a man who landed on a comet. To think it is, is a form of insanity.

I’ve been meaning to write a long post about the Tennessee Valley Interstellar Workshop, but life has been fraught since we came back, so it waited till today. And now it’s going to get somewhat highjacked (sorry) by … idiocy surrounding the shirt of a man who landed on a comet. Which means the real post about the workshop will come later, again.

First of all I want to thank my friend and Baen books colleague Les Johnson who is a real scientist and who invited me to this, for reasons I don’t fully grasp but I’m very grateful for. I suspect it was a conjunction of “has an interest” and “can take time and pinch pennies to come.”

Dan went too, because I couldn’t go to a space thing without him. I think it is in fact in our marriage vows “shall not go listen to space stuff without me.” I don’t know. The vows were in Portuguese and I might be missing a bit of the translation at this point. But he says it was in it.

We went early on Saturday, so we could take the Seminars on Sunday on terraforming and interstellar flight. The interesting part of the later is that Les had managed to convey most of it to me already, in helping me with my story for Going Interstellar. These were 101 seminars, but I needed to do them because – for those of you who’ve heard – another Heinlein child in the aerospace industry has convinced me we must write juveniles like Heinlein’s on things that children could hope to live when they’re grownup. I think it’s doable, but I needed my level-set on state of the art.

The rest of the next three days was spent listening to some of the most devoted proponents of space flight and interstellar colonization.

I’ll note right here that women were about one in five people – none of which mattered, I was just jazzed to be in the show. – more on that later.

I have voluminous notes elsewhere. The stuff on worldships is fascinating, as is just the… psychological intersection of a (relatively) short lived species and the dream of the stars.

Which is where everything comes to a point. Part of my prevailing issue was people talking about “we can get there in a thousand years.” “If we set it in motion now…”

I fully agree we should go, don’t get me wrong. We are a colonizing species by design and makeup. The “long lived” civilizations on Earth that eschewed colonization (okay, China) seem to be caught in a recursive loop and ever-increasing conformity.

We must look outward to save the Earth civilization.

On the other hand, HOW CAN one make a plan that will take a thousand years? Be it in a worldship or here on Earth?

We can’t. A quarter that is the distance to our founding. A thousand years ago we were busy with the crusades. Our aims, aspirations, our very civilization changes in much shorter periods than that. Some of the motives in Shakespeare and Jane Austen are already unintelligible without concentrated study.

Which brings us to why I was there and why I think the seminar is amazing and necessary, and why I’ll go back in a year and a half, if they let me.

There is a bit in The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress where Mycroft says, about an “impossible” invention (I think it was transmuting matter) something like “It is a mathematical certainty we’ll develop this, the question is when.” And then explains that kind of conceptual breakthrough requires a “genius event” and those can’t be predicted. They’re the result of genetic drift and recombination.

I feel the same way about interstellar flight. It HAS to be possible and we – curious monkeys – will find a way to do it. The question is when. And also, remember what I said about civilizations turning inward and becoming recursive? We must not let that happen. Going out there, past our solar system, might not be possible right now, given who we are and the distances involved.

But it will be possible someday, at which point having people who kept their eyes on the stars and have studied some of the issues is important too. Which is also why it’s important to write and explore REAL science fiction. By that I don’t mean hard science fiction. Yes, I came back from Knoxville with a fistful of story ideas that will be sent to Analog by the by, and a few more that will be integrated in my future history, BUT – this is important – science fiction is not just what we know now. Science fiction about space marines, folded space, colonization of interstellar vasty deeps, all of that is “REAL” science fiction, if the author approaching it approaches it with the mind set of “how will it be?” and not “I’m going to write a story about how my minority/gender class is exploited now and set it in the future to evangelize the geeks.

I fell in love with science fiction at 11 because of that “speculate about the future so you’re prepared when it gets here” aspect.

And it’s an important aspect, and it must be worked on. Because, yeah, that genius breakthrough MIGHT come through in a thousand or two thousand years. Or it could come through tomorrow. And we have to be ready/have people who are used to thinking in that scale.

When I was at the workshop I kept thinking (and one of the speakers (I’d have to find my notes to know who and since I’m not allowed to bend down because of the eye issue, the briefcase sits unpacked) said this explicitly) this must have been what Science fiction was like in the thirties and forties. Most of the people in the room had scientific training (and none made me feel bad) and were passionate about the future and about space.

Which brings us back to the ratio of men and women. And to the shameful incident this week, in which the despicable Rose Eveleth at the Atlantic bullied Dr. Matt Taylor into apologizing, in tears, for wearing a shirt with women with rayguns on it.

Rose Eveleth is the fluffer who wrote the piece about Lekie and science fiction starting to give awards to women in SF again, in response to which I wrote this. (And yes, I know a few male names escaped the slash and burn I did on the rawish data uncle Lar sent me. Because he didn’t know many of the names, some ambiguous names got in, and I cut (most) of them out, but it’s hard to highlight and cut with my mouse at present, so a few escaped. In the same way, I almost guarantee if I had time to filter the raw data, that Uncle Lar missed some females with unusual names, that I’d know because I know their work, or at least heard of it.)

Why a woman who can’t even do her own research for her own articles should be allowed to bully a man who as part of a team (incidentally led by a woman) landed on a comet is beyond me. Or rather it isn’t. It’s a symptom of the sickness in our society.

The sickness can be defined as this: we are trying to remake women into men, and in the process we castrate men and we release profoundly wounded women out into society, who think they should be what they cannot be and therefore lash out at all and sundry from a core of hatred inside them. And society aids and abets them, due to the bizarre idea that men and women should be exactly alike and equally represented in all endeavors or society is “sexist.”

I’m going to say it once and for all – men and women are different. They were subjected to different evolutionary pressures.

Note I didn’t say one is better and the other worse. That is where we’ve gone all batty, because the feminists say women are better and prove this by trying to make women like men.

Men and women are different. And according to my son’s class on evolutionary psychology, they’re not even different in a way you’d expect. For instance men are better at highly focused work and women at multitasking. Women are usually better at reading non verbal signals, etc.

Beyond that there are instinctive drives. MOST women want to have children, even when you berate them about this constituting a sell out.

Here’s the thing – men and women are different as categories. Not as individuals. What I mean is, I was an odd boyish girl, not in presentation but in interests. The ratio of females at the TVIW was high compared to the groups I preferred as a child/young person (note preferred isn’t often got.)

There are women who are passionately interested in science and engineering. I was one of those, and if I had realized that my penchant for scrambling numbers was beatable and workaroundable (totally words) and not a sign I was “stupid” I’d have ignored mom and gone into mechanical engineering, anyway. (She was afraid I’d get knocked up in a class of all guys. Fundamental misunderstanding of WHY I wanted to go into engineering and also the social couth of most engineers.)

But most women, that vast middle mush (women are mostly just average for IQ, or a little above. Men statistically speaking cluster at the ends of the bell curve: morons and geniuses, one of the ways in which “are men smarter than women?” is only answerable with “no” and “It’s complicated.”) don’t want to learn that stuff. Most of them have very little room for abstraction in their lives.

Heck, even I, with my untrained mind, jotted down mostly “social developments related to this innovation” ideas. Most women don’t become fanatics about some scientific project to the exclusion of all else.

Which is why in the hobbies (and most people at the interstellar workshop most participants are hobbyists in the sense of not paid for) that rely on high abstraction, extrapolation, mathematical know how, etc, you find mostly men. This is everything from space societies to mathematical societies, to even war gaming.

There no one is trying to force women in, because there’s no money at stake (though that might change with the new incursion into gaming by the sisterhood brigades) and there you can see the ratios of who really wants to do this.

Note that in these circles of men, any woman who is GENUINELY INTERESTED, even if not trained in the field is not only welcome but treated as a star. Because, you know, most men like women, and love having women around in their circles, women who validate their interests. (I think it goes something like “I’m not uncool. Look, this hot chick likes the stuff I do.” (and note for these purposes, I count as a hot chic at 52 and battling weight issues.))

What they don’t like is women who come in and try to change the game so they can “win.” I don’t think it’s news to anyone that men obsessed by an important topic are often not great on the social graces. Because the topic is what’s important. The women equally interested in the topic account for this, and might now and then gently redirect intercourse into a more normal pattern, but they DON’T shame geeks for being geeks or for their idiosyncrasies, as the despicable Ms. Eveleth sought to do.

Of course, she needed to do that, because compared to the deeds of men and women who can land on comets, her mind appears petty, vulgar and effete. Which, of course, it is. The proper response to that is to either stop faking interest in topics that visibly don’t interest her or to inform herself or if – like me – her education was cut short for whatever reason, she should listen from a position of humility to those who know more than she does.

But humility is unknown to the contemporary “feminist” who has retained nothing save the idea that women should be superior to men in all things, and if they aren’t this is proof of sexism.

And thus the “Social Justice” Whiners trundle on, changing the rules of every field they take over to fit their small minds and miniscule concerns, so they can claim to be “as good as men” without any of the effort. In this process they turn everything they touch into a cross between the mean girls club in high school and a neighborhood sewing circle. I have nothing against a neighborhood sewing circle. I’ve belonged to some. But there are places and times for it. And places and times for big, world shattering, species-changing concerns.

My friend Cedar has written about it here.

What I want to say is this: we can’t let them. What they’ve done to science fiction is a poisonous disgrace, that has turned a speculative and highly innovative field into a pimple on the rump of paranormal romance and romantic fantasy. (Not that there is anything wrong with those genres, but they shouldn’t be cannibalizing science fiction, nor would they be if science fiction had retained its original thrust.)

Understand, I’m not saying we shouldn’t write about possible social developments in the future. As an historian, I’m almost unable to look at something like a worldship and not see the social (and biological) issues that arise, and how they can be countered.) Will we have social problems in the future? Undoubtedly. And writing about them is fascinating.

But the people who write about it from today’s perspective, really, are shorting the future in favor of the social (and mostly herd-learned, not original) concerns of the present.

Yeah, yeah, racism in the future, sure. It’s bound to exist, given that humans identify “my tribe” instinctively. It’s the way we’re made. On the other hand, will it have anything to do with skin color and hair texture? Or will it be based on the modifications we take on in colonizing different environments? Or even “natural” and “bio engineered”? Compared to those differences skin color seems petty.

In the same way the interaction between men and women is bound to be fascinating, particularly as some form of bio-womb is invented. But it is highly unlikely to stay stuck in the 21st century neo-marxian narrative of “everything men do is wrong.”

It’s unlikely to stay stuck there, because if it’s stuck there we will not survive. Because women will bring their concerns to forums in which most of them (note I didn’t say all. I’m not writing myself out of this story) have no interest. Because “parity” and “feminism.” And in the process they’ll destroy outer space exploration, make it petty and ineffectual, in the same way they’re now trying to do to Science Fiction and gaming.

Women who like space exploration, or science fiction, or gaming are already perfectly welcome in those fields. Welcome with open arms, in fact.

Women who want to change them to be all about social justice and neo Marxism and a kind of ridiculous self-absorption that could only interest the subject and her giggly-girls club (see Lena Dunham) need not apply.

Because the truth, Ms. Eveleth, is that women who have an interest in space exploration will not be put off by a scientist’s shirt showing pretty women in next to nothing, holding ray guns. THOSE women – I’m one of them – will think it’s cool. They will dive into the field with renewed interest because there are Odd men there, and only Odd men get Odd girls, the same girls your cliques tend to treat as pariahs because we don’t wear the right clothes and we don’t emit the required bleats at the right time.

I know you’ll never get this, but you can keep your “social justice” and your damned Marxist-derived feminism.

I want my ray guns and my spaceships.

 

770 thoughts on “No Space for Sewing Circles”

        1. if it is in contact with the surface it will pass through that way as well. Done sound checks on a engine by sticking a long extension onto parts of the block and touching the other end to the bone protuberance behind the ear.

      2. Well, really, they didn’t.

        The recording is a conversion to audible range of the oscillations in the local magnetic field, which are thought to be caused by outgassing from the comet’s surface interacting with the solar wind (I think that’s how the article I read put it). They had to speed up the vibrations, because they were registering in milliHertz.

  3. SJWs destroy everything they touch, and they have touched a lot of our civilization….I agree that we must be able to do these things, but I presently question whether we will ever land humans on Mars…..

    1. We will if I have anything to say to it.
      You see, there’s this natural mechanism for countering their kind. It’s women like me, and Cedar, and Amanda, and Kate and…
      You gentlemen just stand back and let us take the fight to them for a change.

      1. Doing things like saying “I am a woman who’s interested in STEM, and I see nothing wrong with that shirt. He’s a geek, you morons” is a start. 😀

        1. I almost bought one of the pinup girl shirts. Then decided I really prefer the parrots… I thought about wearing one of those shirts to a work event (I’m a programmer) and I think my fellow programmers would have been fine with it. But I could picture some other woman getting bent out of shape. Sigh. I hate having to do that kind of a calculation.

          1. We Odds need to teach ourselves that it is not only acceptable, it’s nearly mandatory to tell a Social Justice Troll “Go F**K Yourself!”

            M

            1. and hold our middle fingers aloft.
              of course, I have the trained-in reflex of saying “Sit on this, I’ll take you to Lisbon.” Maybe that’s for the good. It tends to confuse them.

                1. Is “Sit and nutate” taking esoterica too far ?

                  (“Sit and precess” just got heard as “Sit and process” … (sigh))

              2. Pfagh! They will think you’ve mispronounced Lesbian and accuse you of Bad Think. They only effective approach to these types is to attack in force, they are terrible at defense, relying on supporting fire from their flankers — they can only attack harder and are subject to the usual counters of such (lack of) strategies.

              3. James Thurber was once accused of having “slapped” John Steinbeck in a review of Steinbeck’s “The Moon Is Down”. Thurber responded, “I am sorry – I did not realize my fist was open.”

              4. I’m a fan of “why?”, followed by “And why should your choice to be offended be my problem?”

              5. “I don’t care” works too, if you really want to see them froth.

                Or break down in tears.

                Either is good.

          2. I was “part of the computer field” 20 years ago. (The intersection of a moving car, and my left knee, put an end to that.) I’ve _long_ maintained that there is a Master’s Level project in. “Are computer people crazy, which is why the gravitate there, or made that way by field?” 🙂
            If you’re “normal,” you don’t “fit in.” I’m still a “computer nerd” at heart, and always will be. That’s why the “intense drive” to “make everyone fit in,” will destroy the very “society” they hope to create. Look at every heavily Muslim country. The conformity it generates, means that there is zero, zip, nada, creative energy there. Just as China, with there “drive for conformity” prevents them from doing an real creative breakthroughs. They can _steal_ ideas, and make them better but they can’t *create new.*
            Only those who *can* “refuse to fit in,” are able to do real creative work. Herd think sees everything not already done, as *dangerous.* Truth be told, it can be. Astronauts, Test Pilots, and explorers, all know and accept it. None of them _want_ to die, but they accept the risks. F&SF authors are others, if they are any good, who see and talk about “new (dangerous) ideas.”
            A few of which are: “If things keep going this way.”; “What if we _aren’t_ alone in the Universe?”; “What if the Universe is far more/less dangerous than we think?”; “What would Alien civilizations be like?”; “What will ‘Human beings’ be like on different planets, with different weather?”; “What if the ‘legends’ of ‘strange creatures’ are true?”; “How will ‘society’ react if some/all of the ‘legends’ are true?”; “What will change?”

            1. I’d say some of it can be induced, given the nature of developing software. What is one thing that you do constantly in creating software? The answer is going over the same loops and other control flows, again and again and again, and adding on other branches to other consecutive flows. This is similar (to my uneducated eye) to the description of Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder, where sufferers talk of “thinking the same thoughts over and over”. That is so similar to what I’ve had to do as a programmer that it was a bit shocking to realize, as it’s second nature to me, especially as I’ve migrated from developing software to debugging software in support roles. That being said, it could be that the nature of software development may be easier for people with OCD. I’ve known many developers with quirks, and I’ve worked with a couple on the edge of burnout (on both sides) that probably needed to be institutionalized, at least for a time. I’ve been developing software for over 30 years for over a dozen different companies, and I’ve seen a lot. One interesting thing, it seems like the number of “quirky” developers is smaller now, I’m not sure why. It may be that I’ve adapted to “quirky” so that it seems normal…

          3. The thing I like about some of the younger gamer guys is that they seem to have decided that they don’t care about what others think – to a certain degree at least. So they do get tattoos and/or wear shirts like Matt Taylor’s and if someone complains enough they just quit. The rest of us should probably man up and join them

          4. I’m super duper tempted to draw my own pattern with sexy space girls and put it up on my Spoonflower account. I’m not especially fond of the art on the shirt in question, but I wouldn’t wrinkle my nose if someone wore that around me. It’s cool in a sort of retro way that I dig.

    2. Depends on what you consider space armor, the only reason we haven’t developed it yet as far as I can see, is there has been no need. It would take minimal engineering to design a space suit with body armor incorporated into it.

      1. The current (i.e. old shuttle-era) EVA suit actually has some degree of projectile protection built in as micrometeor protection, but IIRC they cut off the impact to be protected against at an arbitrary projectile velocity level that’s not all that high, based on the projected survivability of an injury during EVA due to a faster projectile.
        Immobilizing and getting the perforated ‘naut back inside, then getting them down runs quite a bit past the ‘golden hour’ for trauma care, so the designers did the engineering thing and decided on base parameters that would keep the suit useful, just not artillery proof.

      2. Last I heard, the “Hard Suit”, which is basically a type of Space Armor, has joint problems. The joints can get into a position where they freeze (jam) and have to be basically dismantled to make them work again.

      1. Yes. I spent a lot of quality time with an axe as a girl, and later learned to throw a tomahawk pretty well. So that’s a must on my gear belt. (I need to make a list…) 😀

        1. For those who have never tried it, it is truly shocking how easy it is to throw a well balanced axe and not only hit your target (as long as you aren’t aiming for a target the size of quarter) but hit it blade first and stick the blade into it.

          But yes I’ve used axes enough to wear several out by sharpening them down until there isn’t enough blade left; so while I don’t use an axe all that much any more, every vehicle I own has an axe in it, that is one tool that I always like to have available.

    1. My favorite Schoolhouse Rock song used to be The Ballad of Mr. Morton. Then I found the money songs. ^_^ (I can’t decide if I like “Tyrannosaurus Debt” or “Where The Money Goes” better…)

      1. I’m assuming autocorrect is also why our man repeatedly landed on a comment? Or was that one intentional?

      2. A friend of mine had the issue you report and had to go in for what he called “spot welding” using a laser to tack down a grid across the inside back of his eyeball to keep things from detaching. Since he was in there he had the doc spot weld the other eye just in case.

        Hasn’t had a problem since.

  7. ” (She was afraid I’d get knocked up in a class of all guys. Fundamental misunderstanding of WHY I wanted to go into engineering and also the social couth of most engineers.)”

    Haven’t even finished the post, but I have to comment on this. From purely anecdotal evidence I would say that most women that are in primarily male groups tend to date outside the group (although their boyfriends may become accepted in the group, they aren’t from the group, and if a breakup occurs, the boyfriend is usually the one excluded) and most men in the group expect this. Men in primarily male groups tend to treat the lone females in their midst like a kid sister, or at least their buddies kid sister; tease them mercilessly, poke fun at them and… rip anyone from outside the groups head off if they even think about messing with her.

    1. Yep. I was “The People’s Sister” in my brother’s group, mostly.
      I had proposals from a couple of geek/sf guys I hung out with, but the problem is I thought of THEM as brothers and buddies, not marriage material.
      Besides, none of them was a mathematician.

        1. Not so much that — I just couldn’t get over the idea we were related. With one of them I REALLY wanted to like him that way. I just didn’t.
          Oh, you mean the mathematician? It’s a joke. My husband is a mathematician and this has evolved into a complex family joke. “Some day my mathematician will come” 🙂

                3. If I were a Linguistics Major, I know that I would definitely rather conjugate than decline …

    2. Unless “everyone knows” that two members of the group are involved– and I have yet to see an example where the two that “everyone knew” were together weren’t the last to know.

      That mostly happens in high turnover groups, though– military, or sometimes college.

      1. And then there’s the whole mutual “I lolve him/her but (s)he has no interest in me at all” thing. Which is of course a staple of romance novels but also true to life

      2. And sometimes it’s more than completely imaginary, as in the time I asked somebody why he’d never asked me out if he was interested in me and he replied, “Because you were dating that guy from Seattle.” 1. I wasn’t dating anyone at the time in question, and 2. Which guy? The identity of this phantom remains elusive, though it’s just possible it was my future husband, who was both dating someone else at the time and from Oregon.

        Of course, I only found out a couple of years ago that somebody I knew considered me his first serious girlfriend. I hadn’t known that at the time (we were coworkers at summer camp, so fraternizing was off the table), but I wouldn’t have minded.

    3. It ought be noted that such teasing as occurs is nowhere near the viciousness typical of female groups, bearing the same level of resemblance as kittens wrestling to a cat fight.

  8. Sarah, we are on exactly the same wavelength. Even if I am superficially a little different from you. 🙂 What I’m trying to do with my mid-Heinlein-style YA series is have a cast of get-it-done kids with all of the diverse characteristics so beloved of the SJWs, but who totally reject groupthink and victimhood.

    1. I’m gonna need that book soon. My nephew will be reading soon. His father and I used to design starships together, now he’s an astrophysicist, if there’s to be any hope, we must inspire the younglings.

        1. Such books might kinda sorta oughtta feature red neck kids — including some girls — a la Doc Travis. Gotta find a better way of transporting gran’pa’s ‘shine so they start tinkering and develop a … teleportation portal, rocket drone, space curving pair of Daisy Duke’s … out of parts found in the local junkyard.

  9. I’m not entirely sold on the huge difference between men and women in the abstract concepts department. I still think a great deal is still cultural. *Teaching* abstract concepts, such as math, needs to begin early and needs to keep accumulating to develop a useful level of skill. I noticed in grad school how there were a disproportionate number of Chinese women vs American women in physics. Now either Americans (even of Chinese ancestry) have more math and science-impaired women, or something in the Chinese culture was different. I currently work at a software company with a huge number of women coders. I’m the only American. I really, really don’t think that these women are somehow superior to women in this country. My speculation is that the STEM fields are considered very high status in their home countries, even for (in non-western countries) girls. Any interest in those fields, or even mere talent, is encouraged by the families that will benefit from a high-earning child that might get a coveted US green card (“my daughter the software developer” is right up there with “my son the doctor” for bragging rights, evidently).

    I am totally in agreement with slapping down the Harrison Bergeron feministas (we should make an effort to do so in a tired, bored way so they don’t get any vicarious pleasure from making us angry) but I also think we need to subvert their potential future recruits. The more women who think science and math is cool (or just high status) the better off we will be even if they *don’t* go into STEM, because we will have a population resistant to the SJW infection. We need some culture ninjas!

    1. Part of the issue with women NOW in America is “a star for being a woman” so they never learn to compete with men. Not your generation or mine, but my kids’.
      Look, people who are into math are a tiny group to begin with. In Portugal pure math is a woman’s degree.
      To that extent yeah, cultural. But look at the associated traits. Aspergers is OVERWHELMINGLY male. Yes, women have it too, but much fewer. It correlates to high abstract reasoning fairly well.
      That said, the problem is “genius” — there are few women with that intensity of interest (no matter what IQ) above a certain level, statistically. The ones there are often brilliant. but it’s not something in which we can demand 50/50. Because different.

      1. “star for being a woman”, exactly. THAT is what I want to eradicate, like smallpox. We need a high enough percentage inoculated population so the stupid can’t build up a reservoir.

        I know you are completely besotted with genius mathematicians 😉 but that is another myth that needs severe stomping. You do NOT need to be a genius mathematician to be a genius scientist. For us, math is a tool. A very nice, handy, wonderful tool that we appreciate and value highly, but a tool. It would be similar to expecting a super sniper to *also* be a master gunsmith and new weapon designer, in order to be a sniper at all.

              1. I’ll probably make use of them down the road. Right now, the most advanced “math” my daughter can handle is counting and correctly identifying a circle as a circle.

                    2. Yeah, the wife and I had a little chat about the writing. It’s very difficult to put on the headphones and get lost in my writing when my daughter so desperately wants interaction with Daddy, and trying to write without the music was…interesting (in the Chinese sense of the word).

                    3. Brother. This is still my life and the spawn are 20 and 23. BUT mommy is still essential (nowadays more as a political sparring partner or listener to cool scientific theory, but essential) I’m p*ssed my eye is out of commission the one week Robert is away for the foreseeable future. I love them dearly, but I’m hoping they’ll find women and jobs and move out :-p well, jobs at least.
                      When the kids were little I developed “rowdy play” times just so they’d nap…

                    4. Yeah, I live for nap times. Unfortunately, she’s not terribly consistent with how long she naps.

                      We’re talking about her going to my in-laws for a couple of days per week. It should help somewhat, but I still need more than a few days of work.

                      I’ll figure something out, I’m sure.

                    6. If I had the money, that would be a go. My church has a pre-school for a reasonable price. Just the mornings, but that would probably be enough to start with.

                      I just don’t have the cash.

      2. I think the reason why fewer women go into fields that require such intense focus is because (usually) women also have other things they MUST focus on (children, taking care of the house, other family members). These things cannot be neglected just because a woman wants to focus on her special interest, and they definitely take time away from that special interest. There are things I could easily focus on to the exclusion of all else (housework definitely suffers, LOL!), but I can’t do it because (used to be my children and husband needed attention, now all I have at home is Cedar’s youngest sister, who is severely mentally handicapped and requires a lot of my attention). Men can leave all that stuff to their wives, if they are even married. And, we are made this way. It was intentional (hey, I don’t believe in evolution 🙂 ).

          1. Lot of the best remembered women writers from earlier times seem to have been either spinsters, or married but childless, and of the married ones most seem to have started their careers well before getting married.

          2. I find it interesting to speculate as to the results of the wives of those same male writer friends acting on their “you need to ignore the house/family and just ” … by the time the sink(s) fill with dishes and the supply of clean sheets in the closet(s) runs out, I suspect the sentiments just might have changed …

            1. *slight smile* with me being somewhat incapacitated physically (and there’s still months to go before birth) and the men of my household needing to do work (because if they don’t we don’t eat or have a roof over our heads) the smoothness of the household’s background running has been far less than smooth. It’s somewhat mitigated by the fact my children are old enough to do a number of household tasks and have been taught ahead of time to be able to cook some basic meals. Yep, even the 7 year old knows how to scramble himself an egg. A practical thing, in case I need to be hospitalized.

        2. The problem is _really_ the “male stereotype” of “breadwinner.” One of the adjustments I *had* to make, when I became “disabled,” was could I be a house husband? Could/would I let my wife, be the “go out, hunt down bread, and kill it,” instead of me? That’s *very* hard mental shift, for a lot of (most?) men. Not from the “will it make her the happiest?,” but giving up the mental status. Men are “socialized” to be the protector/bread winner. (I’ve taken care of enough children that I know who *really* has the “harder” job.) I decided that if I married, and my wife wanted to be the one, I would support her 100%. I’d find whatever I could do, to add to the household income, and take care of the “woman’s work.” I like cooking, which is why I have over five MB’s of recipes, and three cookbooks in process. If I marry, my wife can take as turn cooking, if she wants, but part of _my_ job is doing things to “make her life easier.” To me that’s part of the “marriage contract.” Just as part of her’s is to make mine easier.

      3. I think men are a lot more likely to be “single focus” then women are, for whatever reason. Whether it’s a difference in brain organization or function or just with men being less “balanced” I don’t know. But when I think of how many technology and knowledge advances are due to “single focus” males, I really wish that people could just celebrate them, instead of complain at/about them.

        I’d say “celebrate diversity” but the word “diversity” tends to make me mildly nauseous these days.

    2. So as a father of two young ladies in the STEM fields (1 Senior in college Math/Education Double major, one Freshman mechanical engineer), and
      husband of A PHD chemist I think you are right Sabrina that the measurable differences are limited. That’s not to say the differences aren’t there,Both of my girls wanted to learm a little bit of programming/computer science, So I taught them a little and I find they solve problems very differently then would have as a young man. But the differences are subtle, and for some things a help, and for others a hindrance.

      I think as you surmised the cultural issues are more critical. Their peers (even VERY intelligent ones) in High school would often ask “Why would you WANT to do that?” when told what they wanted (This applies more to the younger girl, the older one was English teacher until Senior year with Calculus and Physics). The pressure was VERY strong, don’t show you’re strong in the math and sciences and DEFINITELY don’t best the boys at “Boy” things (Math, Science, Video Games). Somehow my younger girl didn’t get the message and would stomp them on a regular basis. For which the Nerd/Geek/Odd guys took her in as one of their own. Not a girl hanger on or a little sister but one of the club. I think she had more solid male friends then female.

      I think the ratio of women in the STEM fields is getting better. When I went to engineering school there were 7-8 men for each woman attending.
      My younger girl goes to the same school I attended and now its 2-3 men/women. Whats not clear is if that change is due to a change in attitudes or to the fact that its more likely the women will have the high academic standing coming out of High School. In my younger daughters class You had to get to 8th in the class before you hit a male, and of the top 10% of the class probably 80% were female. Its not that the guys were stupid. In fact the Geek Guys my daughter knew seemed top notch to me. It has just become very uncool for guys to be good at school. I mean not that it was ever cool just that now its even LESS cool.

      1. I wish the people who spend so much time saying “see, girls, science is cool and you can be in science and math and engineering too and we’ll give you lots of money” would spend more time saying “the rest of you hush. If Sally wants to be a physicist and Mildred gets straight As in math, quit treating them like pariahs.” But I was a history, physics, and Latin nerd who hung out with the ROTC kids, so I had a little protection . . . after I became a senior.

      2. There is a much higher requirement that women be “presentable” in appearance, and women even (especially) feminists are, I suspect, still very highly prone to judge women on their appearance. (Men, too — as witness the tempest over a shirt.)

        data point:
        TV anchor wears same suit for year, no one notices
        [SNIP]
        An Aussie TV anchor wore the same suit every day for a year as a sexism experiment – and no one noticed.

        Karl Stefanovic, whose interview with Grumpy Cat went viral last year, wore the same blue Burberry-knock off suit and white shirt each morning on Today to prove that his female colleagues get treated much more harshly regarding their appearance.

        1. Doesn’t that data point simply indicate that there’s far less variety in men’s fashion than women’s? I’m pretty sure that anyone who wears suits on a daily basis has two or three navy ones and a dozen white shirts.

          1. The question then becomes “why is there less variation in men’s fashion than women’s fashion?”.

            The answer seems to be that women are more concerned about what they and other women wear than men.

            IIRC there were once jokes about two society women coming to the same event wearing the same outfit and each woman felt insulted.

            1. Probably dates to the late 19th/early 20th century Era where women displayed their status in clothing. In an Era where clothing was expensive having a different outfit for each event was a statement of status. Even more so if the outfit featured expensive materials and intimate details. Of course having a custom outfit would be the pinnacle of status, which is why having the same outfit as another woman was such a horror, either the women involved were buying “off the rack” or they shared a seamstress who recycled designs.

              The question is why did men’s fashions settle on variations on the suit? One hundred years earlier you would find men just as obsessed with fabrics and lace.

              1. There are still men who are obsessed with fabrics and lace; but those aren’t the only obsessions they share with women.

              3. It has been a very long time since I read the argument, but it has been attributed to Beau Brummel. Read for more at own risk.

              4. Republican simplicity.

                Indeed, at the time of the revolutions, women’s fashion veered toward the simple too, but women managed to veer back.

            2. My Sister-in-Law nearly had apoplexy when she was at her son’s wedding reception and heard that there was another woman in the same building, also at a wedding reception, wearing the same dress.

              Strangely enough, they found that they knew each other, and wound up having fun with it.

        2. That doesn’t say anything, except that TV anchors don’t understand how to run an experiment. Where was the Control newscaster? Now, if he’d had one of his colleagues wear only one woman’s outfit for a whole year as well then it would have been a useful experiment.

    3. I work in a technical trade and there are minute numbers of women who work in the industry. The ones that do typically provide services to those who practice the trade.

      It comes down to something quite simple. Much of the time the work has to be done irregardless of anything else, which makes it difficult for people with other obligations such as family. And women lack upper body strength required. Generally. Lots of men are attracted to the work but don’t follow through because of the demands.

      Feminists are right that it is about fertility, and the trend is to put off children and work in a career during that time. But that means someone else will be having and raising the children, with all that is implied.

      In my province forest fire fighting was mandated to meet gender equality targets. The whole process from top to bottom was redesigned around the physical realities of women. Alright for a government agency with essentially no limit on spending. I have pondered how that could be done with what I do. Maybe in a generation or two where the entire physical plant is replaced with that in mind. It is still cheaper to hire a guy who can just lift it.

      1. “ … a government agency with essentially no limit on spending.”

        More accurately, with no concern for the direct and indirect costs of what they spend. That money could have been used to increase the number and quantity of hospital beds and services, or left in the private sector to be invested in business start-ups and expansions.

        Government is VERY good at not counting foregone alternatives and opportunity costs.

  10. I think that I am going to have to promise to be bad and NOT post blog fodder on the Sarah’s diner facebook page for a couple of weeks. Strictly for Sarah’s health. The fact that lets the SJWs off is not a good thing.

              2. I had a friend in high school that had them. But his body fat percentage was so low that if he didn’t eat breakfast he would pass out when he went to work out during body building class (2nd period, we had the class together).

                1. One of the interesting things one can do is watch old movies featuring athletes, especially prize-fighters. Very few such men had the highly-scupted bodies and low body fat %s that are common today for even the most average men.

                  IIRC, there is also ample evidence that most women find such men more attractive … suggesting that the fashion mode is catering to the standards of homosexual men. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.

                  Pick even a movie as recent as The Dirty Dozen and notice how the men are “fit.”

                2. I mainly noticed it because normally the last two are below the navel. I once pointed this out to an artist who produced amazingly well rendered images that were anatomically wrong. He was drawing based on image “Macros” without really understanding what goes on under the skin, which told him that in a muscular person, there are six lumps on the abdomen, so he’d draw that, but it would all be below the ribs and above the navel. (Other than that, he was pretty awesome).

          2. Sites like this and print on demand and 3D printing etc are why I love living in the 21st Century. Even if I can’t travel to the Space Wheel on Pan Am…

            2. I’m a little short to wear two prints together, so I’d probably go for a lace-up blue bodice and blue blouse with cuffed sleeves (the Dread Pirate Roberts look). Use the patriotic print for a second skirt, or a vest to wear with solid skirt and blouse.

  12. “…her mind appears petty, vulgar and effete.”

    Yep. With emphasis. She’s a sad, small minded bully. She can crow about her ‘victory’ in bullying an accomplished and enthusiastic individual on a momentous day, but the adults in the room will continue to look upon her with pity and disgust.

    He can dream, and create, and achieve. She can fade away.

    1. What makes you think he has much of a career going forward after this?

      The SJW types have largely captured the administration of institutional science (in this case, no small entity can spend a billion dollars and 10 years to put a probe on a comet). E.g. I’m reliably told that conservative undergrads are no longer tolerated at MIT.

      Hopefully he is or can become a good enough programmer to keep the 2 children hear he has fed.

      (OK, maybe after his groveling he’ll be able to continue for a while, but in the long term? Doubtful, especially in a literally Stalinist minefield as our host has outlined.)

      1. That’s bad, really bad. From long experience in engineering the liberal mindset and engineering do not mix well. There’s a reason engineers tend to be conservative and it has to do with lives that do not get dead.

        1. Libertarian undergraduates are still tolerated at MIT, it’s not all liberals and radicals (yet).

        2. Despite the pithy slogan, reality does not have a leftward bias. Gravity sucks, entropy always wins, and there ain’t no free lunch…

      2. I’m not so sure he’s done with. It’s not like any old schlub can hop in and be an astrophysicist (I believe, undergraduate in physics and PhD was all I could confirm).

        There are private companies getting into this stuff, now. If ESA caves under a pile of small minded idiots somebody else will likely snatch him up and pay him more.

        Dude’s got “landed on a comet” on his resume.

        1. “Dude’s got “landed on a comet” on his resume.”

          Doesn’t he have the added caveat of, “did so successfully with malfunctioning equipment.”?

      3. I think the tears are less from personal humiliation and more due to despair over what is happening to his field.

    2. Actually, who IS the bitch and why was she given so much attention?

      On the other hand, it doesn’t matter what she has achieved and how she got to where she is. She’s nothing compared to this guy because of what she’s done to him. She’s nothing compared to the people who actually GET THINGS DONE and do things that advance humanity. Nope, this petty minded little pile of steaming, festering jealousy doesn’t want any positive things to happen for the good of everyone, because this is all SHE can achieve.

  13. Future races of human . . .

    I’m seeing more and more people of obviously mixed races, and am sitting on my hands to not ask my young son “When’s the wedding?” As he moves back to Taiwan with his Chinese girlfriend. So I tend to think the old races are on their way out. Here in the West. Other places may hold out longer.

    But what will become of all this segregating of healthy fertile young humans in either Urban, Suburban, Prep, and Religious high schools? Will home schooling change this? Will huge universities sufficiently re-homoginize the youngsters before reproduction to avoid a speciation event?

    Bring in space colonies with seriously limited interbreeding with the home world and each other, and . . . I dunno what we’ll get. In my glummer moments I tend to think it’ll all be variations of Chinese.

    1. I’m not so sure I’d worry to much about it. The “old” races were pretty mixed already.

      Besides, even before the “mixing” you see today, there was a lot of mixing in the US between the Northern European settlers, and the Native Americans.

      Its so thorough, that its likely impossible today to find an American of Northern European ancestry who can date said ancestry to pre-revolutionary times that doesn’t have some Native American ancestry.

      You can probably almost say the same thing of most folks living on reservations right now. It will be very hard to find someone who doesn’t have the “taint” of euro blood in them.

      Shall we talk about just euro history for a moment? The Romans conquered much of Northern Europe, and had an active colony in what we now call England. They also recruited a cohort of Africans and had them serve in England.

      The Huns conquered a large swath of Eastern Europe and knocked on Rome’s door.

      The Moors conquered most of the Iberian peninsula, and got well into France until a fella nicknamed the “Hammer” smashed them back into Iberia.

      The Agars {sp} took Hungary and fought a war with Charlemaine {sp}.

      The Magyars followed up a couple of hundred years later and settled in Hungary.

      The Cumans conquered a bit of eastern Europe, and a few of the royal families of Eastern Europe traced their families to those incursions.

      The Mongols?

      I could go on, The point is the mixing has been going on forever, and will continue to do so.

      1. My guess is that if we get to where we have colonies in space, colonies where the people are isolated, we might start getting ‘African’ or ‘Chinese’ or ‘European’ or etc. colonies where people have nearly as many ancestors from all of the other groups as they have of the one whose looks have ended up dominant in that particular group. The types of looks now associated with certain races seems to something which keep coming up, you seem to get mixed individuals who look more like one of their ‘pure’ ancestors more often than ones who don’t look like anything easily recognizable. So, if you have some mixed small group to start with and isolate them long enough one of those looks might again become dominant with time.

        1. And yes, that ‘mixed ancestry’ part is presumably more or less true with most people living to today too, only I think you can mix the ingredients even way more thoroughly than they are mixed now and you may still get the current ‘races’ back, under right circumstances, and getting small isolated groups might be that.

      2. “The Huns conquered a large swath of Eastern Europe and knocked on Rome’s door.”

        Sarah’s fans have been quite busy, I see.

      3. I can trace several ancestral lines in North America to the 1600’s. And I’ve been looking for that elusive Native American link so my kids can avail themselves of all the government bennies that come with Native American ancestry. Haven’t yet found it. Did find a line that seems to go back to King Edward.

    2. One thing that would help would be if people stop falling into the trap of referring to different “races” of man. There is no such thing. This history of the study of “races” and even the current verbiage of race and racism and racist has, as it’s genesis, the effort to define non-white ethnicities as being of a separate race. Maybe if we could kill that nonsense and recognize that it’s invalid and a construct of people that wanted to hate and feel superior to others it would help us get over our teeny, tiny differences.

      1. *shrug* Thing is, there are races, and there aren’t.

        I know I do the “If by whiskey” thing all the time, but it’s so accurate…. it’s blindingly obvious that there are things, called races, where you can reasonably guess someone’s primary ancestry by some physical traits. (My grandfather, in spite of being either half or a quarter Indian, looked like a central casting “English Banker, skinny.”)

        At the same time, it’s blindingly obvious that “races” as some kind of physical cultural carrier, complete with all the wrongs done to or by your ancestors, is nonsense. At best, it’s some kind of mega-family, with all the known “so and so is a Smith, one of those Smiths, but he’s totally different” exceptions.

        The Nasties tend to use the first as proof of the second.

    3. I’m reminded a story one of the folks I follow was serializing, “Earthrise”: http://www.amazon.com/Earthrise-Her-Instruments-Volume-1/dp/1484996518

      I remember one of the comments being along the lines of how her being African-American might affect her perceptions of something-or-other… and the author (IIRC, I can’t find the comments) responded, confused, that she wasn’t African-American–she was Martian. Basically, that wherever her people from Earth might have been from… she’s the product of a very isolated, very proudly-self-identified Martian colony, and that’s going to be the culture she identifies with.

      The inability to conceive of different divisions than the current ones definitely seems like one of the issues, in any case. Even if you’re trying to talk about current divisions of one type or another–it’s incredibly helpful to be able to cast it into another mold, without the existing baggage, to be able to show it in a new light.

      The inability to do so in so many cases… seems like a problem.

  15. Someone elsewhere suggested writing the sponsors of The Atlantic and promising boycotts unless they corrected the Sniveling Jerk “Writer” that did this. Not a bad idea.

  17. Remember kids: bullying is bad. Unless it’s directed against someone who wears a shirt you disapprove of. Then it’s okay.

      1. She’s obviously stuck at a middle school level of thought.Eww, Ick! a badly dressed boy doing something in science.

        She’s worse than the girls I went to high school with. They didn’t read and were obsessed with clothes, but, they were interested in guys. They wouldn’t attempt to get a guy fired for a lack of fashion sense. In my crowd “everybody knew”.. that only gay guys had any fashion sense. In fact it was an indication of homosexuality.

        1. Possibly she made a pass at him, and this was getting even because he turned her down? Or more likely was oblivious to the fact she was making a pass and ignored her?

          1. She’s obviously a narcissist. Everything is about her. Not talking about his achievement, just going off about the shirt that offends her.

          2. The womyn making the comment was NOT the lady who interviewed him. It was some other bint from brooklyn. I don’t believe the lady interviewer thought anything other than “not a boring scientist in a lab coat or a PR person, we should talk”

    2. Because that’s how we want to show girls that the sciences are good and welcoming fields, by letting them see that it’s perfectly acceptable to harp on someone because they dress silly. That’s sure to get all the shallow and petty girls flocking to those fields, the thought that they can continue to be bullies and pick on people over the most pointless things will be so empowering for young and future so-called feminists.

      1. Aren’t most top female scientist in their early 20, and don’t they all look like models? Or is Hollywood up to it’s usual casting tricks again?

        1. Yes, they are so much smarter than men that they get to the top in their field at a much younger age.

  19. Back in the wild days of being a field engineer for Sperry Corp, I worked with a team that included Elmer J. Sperry’s(one of the founders of the company) granddaughter. Really sharp EE and as Bear said, we all looked at her as “our” little sis.
    One fun time we stuffed her tool case with a few extra one-pound bars of solder every day for about a week. She started complaining about the weight by about the third day… and of course one of the guys would pick up the bag and ask what she meant.

  20. I’m just wondering how the scientist is the one “guilty” of sexism and stereotyping here, when it was the SJW feminists who turned one of the great scientific accomplishments of the age into a debate about fashion sense.

    And speaking of fashion sense: These are the same fools who wear tampons as jewelry, dress up as giant vaginas, and parade around half-dressed or undressed in “Slutwalks” and dare people to look at them. So where the hell do these sniveling harpies get off attacking an honest-to-Gawd rocket scientist for wearing a loud shirt?

    1. Because women walking around naked and being loud and obnoxious are displaying empowerment. Shirts with pictures of attractive women holding laser pistols and riding rocket ships like something off of the cover of Heavy Metal magazine is objectifying women, because everyone knows that women don’t find it empowering to be depicted as being awesome.

      As for where they get off attacking a genuine rocket scientist over his shirt, it’s probably the only way they can get off, sorry to be crude. These women know that they’ll never be involved with a team working with a robot that was sent into space to harpoon a comet so they have to do the next best thing in their minds and attack a person who did, because that makes them better than the rocket scientist that they’re attacking.

      Also, wasn’t the person in charge of the whole project a women? Something that’s been conveniently forgotten by the media in this whole circus. We have an honest to goodness woman to hold up as an example and she’s being ignored in favor of a loud shirt. That’s a pretty harsh message to be sending to little girls out there interested in this sort of thing, that they can totally do it, but their achievements will be ignored in favor of nonissues.

      1. Let us pause to consider that the project head could have defended her employee. It would have been very easy to redirect the matter to the marvelous achievement producing such attention.

        “Yes, we keep telling Mark his girlfriend dresses him funny.”

        1. If the project head had been a man would he have defended his employee? If true, I think this shows one reason why you’d want a male project head. If false, it could be a display of personal cowardice or pragmatism, reasoning that it would be better to lose one member of the project than the whole team. Assuming that the team’s jobs are so insecure that if hostile attention is paid to the team it will be riffed.

          It is very sad that among some people such puerile concerns as how one is dressed outweigh the grandeur of advancing knowledge. It wasn’t always this way. We need to fight this focus on the immaterial and refocus on what’s really important: advancing knowledge.

        3. Nitpick: I understand a wedding band is visible on his hand, the woman friend who designed the shirt isn’t his wife, and apparently the wife was totally ok with both the shirt & the gift. So, not ‘girlfriend’ in the usual sense.

    2. In their minds anything they do is right and anything others do is wrong. It doesn’t matter that what they do is poisonous, everything they do is right. Feminism trumps achievement.

  23. Pingback: MY USA TODAY COLUMN IS UP EARLY: 1 small shirt for a man, 1 giant leap backward for women: How fem… | CRAGIN MEDIA

  24. A comment rich environment here. How many of the movies of the last twenty or thirty years have there been of the scientist dressed in something that said “Whoa.”? I thought that modern scientists were the new rebels. It makes you wonder where she’s been, No where in science or modern fashion. My being old fashioned, I thought it was tacky not to wear a suit; but, I accepted it because it’s ‘modern.’ I guess for her the cause is more important than just anything in the whole world.
    The SJW terror squads aren’t going to do anything more than the French ones did. Firefox is headed for the trash pile; because, they were already in trouble because of poor programing and getting rid of the founder who could put it back on track was the death blow. But, like indie for writers, open source systems will take its place eventually. Areas of immunity are growing and we will come up with bigger and better eventually in just about every field.
    Unless a ‘really, really, really’ big disaster happens; we will colonize this solar system and seed planets light years away. Inter-celestial travel maybe, maybe not, I don’t know enough science to judge. However, I know that we are learning more and more (Not so much in the big labs as small independent ones) about this world and how life works. That knowledge will change many of our ways of doing things.
    For example, they learned a few years ago that bacteria communicate. Most scientists shrugged it off. Some kept experimenting. They found that they can cause cancer cells to commit suicide by feeding it the right communication. Testing on animals is ongoing, humans unfortunately will have to wait. The point though is that perhaps we can eradicate most disease. Plus we might be able to create a living spaceship that houses an environment home to humanity that can cross to the Milky Way with a possible large enough population to survive the trip and colonization.
    True, we may have to survive more than one infestation of SJW before it happens. How many cycles have we gone through already. The most important factor is that we keep growing past the last infestation and once we get an idea, we don’t quit. May be in fifty years, maybe a thousand or more.

    1. Since their revision a couple weeks back it is a RARE day that my Firefox browser doesn’t crash 3 – 4 or more times A DAY. I am not eager to change primary browsers for a variety of reasons, but their unreliability is becoming their most reliable aspect.

      1. What are you doing when it crashes? I haven’t had that problem, but then, I have ABP and NoScript blocking so much stuff, I might be avoiding the problems.

        1. I don’t know if it’s usage patterns, or system quirks, or what, but I have a friend who has had issues with browsers for years. Lockups, slow performance, any problem you can name. We hit mostly the same sites, he has shut down his addons, and still has issues regardless of what browser he uses. It’s puzzling.

              1. Might be something else. I think housemate is going to start doing tech support foruming over at affsdiary.com so maybe you can have him look there. Just sign up and ask, I believe. What antivirus is he using? OS?

                It’s sometimes a memory conflict. Rhys had a similar issue of random crash, and recently I did too, but there was an add on that went and had a recent update make it stupid unstable so I had to stop using it. Sometimes, it’s the antivirus actually preventing something malicious from running, and the only way it can stop it is by killing or locking up the browser.

                1. He actually had to replace some memory a while back. Helped for a sort time, now his issues are back. He’s been having troubles ever since he finally gave up his Amiga. Linux was not kind, now he’s using Windows, 7 I think.

                  1. What distro of Linux was he using? I use Debian. Linux Mint Debian Edition was my start into the open-source world, and I know someone who could probably help him with that install.

                    7 has a number of security exploits and holes that are constantly being done. I think right after Windows XP, it’s the most targeted version of Windows out there.

                    1. It was a few years back, I believe it was Ubuntu. Our friend the security pro set him up, and it worked well for a while. I have a pet theory of Linux, that I think applies. Linux is like the mess of string that collects in a drawer. If you install it and run it without fooling with it, it’s fine. If you pull on something, like trying to update, you wind having to untangle the whole thing. Ken couldn’t refrain from tinkering on a bet, so there you go.

                    2. Eeegh. Ubuntu is a finicky, temperamental distro, and part of the reason why it’s so temperamental is because it always has the latest versions to stuff.

                      Debian stable is stable because they’re not on the bleeding edge borderline alpha stage of latest code (though if you want to, you CAN use Debian Sid, the Unstable betatests of stuff) because the code of anything released there is at least a few weeks to two months old, because the Debian devs aren’t gonna release to Stable (Jessie, I think?) until they’re sure the code will not screw up anything else or conflict with existing stable releases.

                      But yeah, I reckon he and Aff/Seda/David could have a fruitful chat over on the affsdiary tech forums. It is live as of last night.

              2. (Mainframe Computer Geek here – recently retired)
                Could your hard-core friend be overdoing the security ? Too frequent scans ? Multiple overlapping products ? Using Firefox ?

                (Did I just trip into religious wars here, with that last one ?)

                1. Only Firefox he uses is the Komodo version, Ice Dragon I think. IIRC, he just has a scheduled full scan once a week.

        2. What am I doing? Usually, getting coffee. I walk back and find the Mozilla Crash Reporter where my Firefox browser ought to be.

          I run NoScript, ABP and a Flashblocker and have told FF to suppress the desire of many sites to auto-reload or redirect. I often run many tabs in multiple tab groups, but I’ve done that for years without problems ere this.

          It has reached the point I no longer even cuss … very loudly.

          1. Just me but I’d wonder how old your hardware was.

            My Windows XP was giving me “interesting” problems and the repair guy wasn’t sure why.

            I broke down and purchased a new CPU. Had to go with Windows 8 (upgraded to 8.1) but the hardware is behaving. [Smile]

            1. You will find that if you run nothing but native 64 bit software, your computer will be very smooth, and more secure. A lot of security holes and software conflicts come from forcing cross-compatibility and legacy access from a 64 bit system being made to use a 32-bit era software. This was something housemate discovered by accident recently and was chatting with us about over dinner convo (so forgive me if I don’t have all the tech terminology / concepts correct.)

              Windows XP is NOT secure in any form or way. Even with an antivirus. No ifs, buts or maybes about it. If you use 32 bit software on a 64 bit machine, you pretty much have the same vulnerabilities now on that computer as a Windows XP box.

              Windows 10 will be free, I am hearing, so that’s a good thing. However, it will force an upgrade of hardware to 64 bit so start saving up for a new computer now; it’ll be better for folks in the long run.

              I know people have a bad memory of Norton Antivirus, but that’s what we are recommending for people to use to secure their computers. It’s the only one we’ve run into that doesn’t interfere with the native Windows security (which should be turned on, firewall and all.)

            2. It is possible that in the time since I installed both NoScript intruded on FlashBlock’s terrain — I had been running both for several years no without incident until recently. I have noticed, upon recovery, NoScript’s “Congratulations on updating our ap” page frequently appears.

              I can — obviously — try greenlighting FlashBlock and see whether the situation improves.

  25. “… because the feminists say women are better” If that is true, then why do they have a problem? They can just take over everything and there would be nothing men could do about it.

        1. Womyn felt sorry for the benighted men who couldn’t talk to vegetables, so they gave them drugs and let them control things as a consolation prize.

          (I may have some of the details wrong, but I’m not in the mood of dipping my toes into that pool of crazy today.)

        2. If I remember my sci-fi history correctly, it isn’t their fault because what they refer to as ‘the patriarchy’, which is really just the natural and mutually agreeable social relationship that had evolved between men and the original females, was already well established when they got here. That social arrangment is, obviously, very unsuited for the sort of society that the aliens wish to create. Once a sufficient number of the female-mimics had supplanted human women, interbred with and beguiled us men, and achieved positions of influence in our society they could agitate to undo the long established
          I’ll have to finish this in a future post. My wife just got home from work and I’d better not take any chances. I think she already suspects I know something

          1. There are feminists out there who insist that to be a proper feminist, you must regard men as mutant women.

            1. “Mutant“??? More like DAMAGED. Put “testosterone poisoning” in your search engine, then try looking for “estrogen overdose.” By ALL testimony, estrogen is a mind altering drug, destroying capacity for rational thought in high dosages.

    2. Yeah, it’s like that with the “men are paid more than women for the same work” gripe … in which case, why aren’t all the men out of jobs and all the women employed? ‘Cause any rational employer who paid that way would only hire the women …

        1. Logic is a tool of the Patriarchy, used to oppress Womyn. The only TRUE knowledge is that derived from higher ways of knowing, of which only womyn are capable because they are uncorrupted by testicles.

      2. They will solemnly say it would cause morale problems if they hired the women and got the men to train them.

        Because they really think the only way something like that could happen would be intentionally.

    1. Not to mention, if you quit because of someone’s shirt, you’d never have been able to handle the really difficult stuff. Like, oh, Calculus-based Physics for Engineers II, Dynamics (Because Statics wasn’t enough of a headache, now let’s make structures vibrate), Differential Equations, Organic Chemistry, Programming IV, and oh, yeah, some bullsh** mandatory liberal arts credit.

      My GPA and scholarship didn’t survive that semester, but I could walk away knowing that I did my best. It wasn’t good enough, but it sure wasn’t a shirt that kept me from space.

      1. My dreams of being a mathematician (and marrying Sarah) died in some of those classes too. Fortunately I could switch to CompSci and (bonus) stay in bed an hour longer because the Comp Sci lectures started at 10 not 9

          3. *chuckles* That reminded me of a convo Rhys and I had. He’s four/five years younger than I, depending on which half of the year it is, and we were joking that if I’d met him only a year earlier, I’d really be cradle robbing, because he’d have been only 17.

            He said something to the effect that he was sure he could have made me fall for him before I entered college, when we were both teenagers. I got into college at 18. “You,” I said, “would have been 13 years old and I would have been thrown into jail. Besides, you wouldn’t have known I’d existed.”

            And he gives me that “I am adorable and you love me,” outrageous expression, blue eyes absolutely HUGE, long eyelashes batting, and he goes “So, you would have fallen for me, to get thrown into jail!”

            Me: ….

            ……

            Rhys: *grin, turns the cute up even more*

            Me: I love you anyway.

            Rhys: Yay!

            When I think that our son inherited those big eyes with long eyelashes and charming smile… I am never sure if I should worry for the girls, or for him. Probably both.

      1. Of course it is. Since my journalism career didn’t work out, I’ve decided to be a rocket scientist. I just sent a resume to both NASA and SpaceX, along with PoP (Proof of penis), so I expect to be a rocket scientist by next week at the latest.

        I mean, I know nothing really about rockets except for the models I used to build, but I have a penis, so it’s all good.

          4. That’s the only thing that explains why anyone ever hired him to do anything. (IIRC, I was in his district. I have the right to snark about this forever.)

  27. ‘men are better at highly focused work’
    Some men, those descended from cursorial hunters.

    On the future of humanity in general and racism in particular
    Cordwainer Smith said it all, with uncanny, scary accuracy;
    I just reread ‘We the Underpeople’ and it still brings tears.
    Fisrt time since the second space shuttle loss.

  28. “It’s unlikely to stay stuck there, because if it’s stuck there we will not survive. ”

    Um, yep. And, you know, that sounds like there’s a great post-apocalyptic story idea in there somewhere.

  30. Sarah, yep raw is a kindness for the files I sent you. Basic first pass rush job on data lists from two separate sources. As it seemed time critical I turned the whole thing around from initial search to files sent in about 90 minutes. It seems that I, you, and Charlie all claim responsibility for any errors, but I was first so there! Nah, nah, nah.
    Had I taken the time to google every name I didn’t recognize it would have been a much cleaner list, which I would have sent you two days later. Still and all, the bulk of the data is spot on and totally debunks the SJW claims. Not that it will do any good, they operate on feelings not facts.
    I would point out that one telling statistic amongst all that data was that 20 of the last 33 Campbell awards were given to females. That must explain all the butthurt male authors protesting outside SFWA headquarters and the upcoming Justice Department probe on bias in the Hugo committee process.
    In some other alternate universe I suspect.
    Should you call on my help again I’ll try to take just a smidge more time and make things pretty.

  31. Ms. Eveleth made a classic logical error: correlation does not imply causation. Her argument can be summed up thus, “There aren’t enough women in the hard sciences, this scientist dude is wearing a shirt that offends me, therefore offensive shirts are the reason why there aren’t enough women in the hard sciences!” I am sure these kinds of assertions earn Rose a lot of internet high-fives from her like-minded friends and hangers-on, but since Ms. Eveleth herself seems to prize her science gadfly status–and flutters about the hot bulbs of several science-y publications–without herself being a Hard Scientist, I have to sigh and conclude she’s just whoring for re-tweets. And it worked. Boy, she sure spoke truth to power, didn’t she? Hooray for the brave woman putting the evil man in his place! Evil, evil man!

    1. And for those who are familiar with science guys, the fact he was wearing a clean shirt of ANY variety should get him a gold star and a lollipop 😀 If he was also wearing matched socks and showered sometime +-3 days and shoes that weren’t rotting away from his feet, extra points. (My first quantum professor had, er, hygiene issues that prevented anyone from standing within 3 feet of him without asphyxiation. Brain the size of a planet, but no social skills AT ALL.) Also, our clothing choices tend to focus on crucial issues like “does it hide pump oil stains” and “is it flammable?”

      2. You forgot:

        Will I get arrested for indecent exposure if I wear this outside my home? and/or will parts of my body that I like get frozen/burnt/lopped off if I wear this.

      3. I guess I’m not a science guy then. How sad. 🙂

        I often enough shower, wear a clean shirt and matching socks. (If I’ve been outside, and don’t wash that crud off I have worse trouble sleeping.) Okay, my shoes are not perfect, but that is because walking funny wears ’em out fast, and I’m too cheap to replace them often if I can help it.

        1. Hint: if you buy all the same type and color socks it is much easier to have matching pairs. And when you lose/get a hole in one you can throw it away and pair its mate up with another single sock and still have a matching pair.

          Of course I have been recently informed by my twin cousins who are in high school that mismatched socks are now the in fashion.

          1. They are. It took me a bit to get used to seeing that and not asking if there had been a laundry disaster or a visit from the sock-eating dryer monster.

          2. Hint: if you buy all the same type and color socks it is much easier to have matching pairs.

            I did this with my clothes. There was a reason why I wore nothing but black for years. The only time I noticed I wasn’t wearing the same sock pair was if I ended up using a thin sock on one foot and a thick sock on the other.

            Usually by the time I got to the office. But since I wore boots this was never noticed by anyone else! ^.^

    2. ” but since Ms. Eveleth herself seems to prize her science gadfly status–and flutters about the hot bulbs of several science-y publications–without herself being a Hard Scientist”

      She ain’t even a Soft Scientist.

    3. They assume that all women are as easily-offended and obsessed with finding misogyny under every rock as they are.

    4. About Ms Eveleth (is that “Evilist” with a lisp?) and her “friends vs Mark Bimboshirt, the adage comes to mind about dogs and caravans.

  32. As I posted on Twitter just now:

    “If a Bowling shirt is all it takes to repress women, let’s all dress up and end the scourge of #Feminism once and for all.”

  33. You know, in terms of stuff like exo-wombs and other bio-adjustment(like, say, life extension), I rather suspect it’ll take multiple generations of “Wow, those are some pretty severe long-term side effects we didn’t know about” before they’re statistically better than _in vivo_ gestation for any but the super-rich.

  35. You might like The Clock of the Long Now as fodder for long-term thinking. It was more interesting to me earlier on, before they got all semi-mystical, world-architect-y, catalyzing Brand’s spin off into mini-guru-dom. Big loss that. He used to be more explorer than pundit.

    Here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clock_of_the_Long_Now

    About nerds, see Rands’ the Nerd Handbook:
    http://randsinrepose.com/archives/the-nerd-handbook/

    Clearly, the spun up folks don’t know they’re dealing with a nerd, nor the place that The Project holds in a nerd’s life.

    Sigh.

  37. I’m just going to say that I’m generally not a fan of the pin-up concept in general (religious/personal reasons), and as such find the shirt in question to be in rather lousy taste.
    That having been said, if Miss Eveleth (yes, I am applying the diminutive form of address) is throwing a conniption fit over said shirt, claiming that such a thing is an example of why women don’t go into science, then I would love to know her explanation for why there are any women pop singers, rappers, or rockers out there. At all.
    Get over yourself, lady.

    2. The shirt was unprofessional. However, it’s not “what’s keeping wymyn out of STEM.” And the brainiac women the guy works with probably just oohed over the ray guns …

          1. The amusing thing about this whole mess is how clear it makes it, who is a “management” type and who actually deals with getting stuff done.

            There are a depressing number of people who want to insist that the guys actually doing stuff should look like the ones who explain it to everyone else.

          2. What? This bunch? Sabrina assured me NONE OF YOU OWNS PANTS. If you did, you’d probably wear them on your head.
            (No, I don’t know how the redoubtable Ms. Chase knows of ya’ll’s pantless condition. Some knocledge is mercifully hidden from human minds.)

        2. I did not realize he was not a designated spokesman … in the video clip I saw, he spoke well for a general audience … in that case, the parameters for “professional dress” would be different.

  39. The fear and loathing of differential equations ( and the like) are what keeps women from STEM fields. But for some inexplicable reason many seem to feel that it reflects better on them to maintain that the sight of men wearing shirts covered with babes and ray guns is so horrific that they must clutch their pearls of infinite dismay and run to safe industries such as journalism, cupcake baking and nannying.

    Twits.

  40. BTW, since this shirt was made by a woman, and there are lots of women who like to draw or paint such pin-up girls, myself included – what would that make of us, women who create such ‘sexist’ art? Or does it become sexist only when a man wears it, or buys such a picture, or is gifted such a picture? Does this SJW assume that other women would be intimidated if a woman scientist who has painting pin-up girls as her hobby were to display her art in her workplace, maybe as a painting hanging on her cubicle wall? Or would that painting become scary only after she had gifted it to a male co-worker who then hangs it on HIS cubicle wall?

        1. I have a few of her earlier ones. I should pull them out sometime, along with the Sorayama books, but I never seem to find the time, there are always new things to pursue.

          First world problem, I know.

    2. From experience, it’s only scary if a man looks at it. And if you’re a woman who draws it and/or appreciates pin-up art who doesn’t fall in line immediately and parrot what they say, they try to helpfully get you back on the right path by telling you that you’re internalizing sexism and contributing to the wakwakwakwak (memory fills in the blank with adult speak from Peanuts).

      1. Pin ups are hard. Especially if it’s a style you’re not fond of (I’m not and I suck at them. Not sure how closely the two are related but there it is.). It’s hard to see what makes the style work if you don’t like it enough to study it. Rather like creating a film nor style image, or an impressionist image if you don’t like the stuff to study beyond the ‘black and white’ or ‘not detailed’

        1. Yeah. Pinups have a very fine line of cute and sexy and teasingly appealing. Too much of a pose or too little of it, and it falls apart on you. I could do a sexy pin-up of Aya Brea in her iconic black gown, but a wrong move and I lose the essence of Aya. (Parasite Eve, for those who’re wondering.)

            1. Ooooh, quite pretty! I love how clean your linework is, and how solid your grasp of anatomy is!

              The shoulders on the short haired girl looking over her shoulder seem a bit wide, in comparison to her hips, but that’s just me and it may just be the angle from the viewer’s POV (I tend to draw generous hips on people, because I’m not fond of androgyny as a personal taste.) VERY nicely done on the lower back-hip-butt-thigh though – they’re never easy to get right and it takes me a lot of effort to get the bone and muscle placement done correctly.

              1. Thanks. One of my big problems is getting the proportions right, I may be able to draw a nice butt and nice legs and nice shoulders, but fitting them together can be a problem (and most often it’s the head, ends up either too small or too big in proportion to the body). Another problem which bugs me, well, I’ve got lots of practice drawing young women, since for some reason almost without exception in all the live drawing classes I have taken the models have been young, pretty women (maybe because there are lots of students in this city, we have two universities and several other schools, and the female students are more comfortable with modeling, who knows). I like male pin-ups as much, but I just don’t draw men even half as well as I can draw women. And it is harder to learn by using photos than it is with live models. Okay, or anatomically accurate statues, but there aren’t that many of those around here either.

                1. Spinning off your comment: I had a fantastic life drawing class in college. Our two primary models were: this lean man in his fifties (talk about muscle definition, guy was a rock) who could put yogis to shame with his poses — and just stay there; and this wonderfully plump woman in her late sixties/seventies who retired as a ballet dancer (she had this brilliant smile, and she loved to pose), also quite adept at these muscle burning poses of complexity.

                  Wonderful challenges.

                  1. One of the girls in the classes I took most recently was also fond of yoga poses, which, while interesting, tended to frustrate me as I was more eager to learn what a body looks like in more natural ones. Like just reaching, or holding something, or stepping up or stepping down or kneeling the way a person who is reaching for something on the floor does it. But no, half the time she would do something like put one leg behind her neck or something (it was a croquis class, so she didn’t have to hold them for long). 😀

                    1. There are these model cds which I use for drawing from at home and I keep wondering about the “spread them” not like the shirt, I MEAN SPREAD THEM poses. What possible use could I have for that drawing?

                    2. For those who draw erotica? Or p*rn…

                      Yes, I have a few cds too, and some of the poses are rather puzzling. Except maybe for just practice purposes, and maybe learning to see the body better (oh, it looks like that…).

                      And then finding something like how the muscles look in some sword fighting poses can be a pain. You’d think there are enough people around who draw and paint fantasy or superheroes etc nowadays that it should be starting to be more easy to find models for those, but noo… well, of course it’s not that difficult to find something like sword holding poses from manuals for sword fighting, but since those people tend to be fully clothed, and usually not wearing that garb you were planning to give to your hero, well. Even if you are not planning to draw a half naked barbarian, it is still a bit easier to figure how the imagined shirt or tunic or whatever would behave if you know exactly what the body beneath would look like in the pose you want.

                    4. They did those, as well. The man had a staff he used as a prop. He did “reaching high on a shelf” with the staff to balance him. “Spear throwing.” Lots of mid-motion of normal and athletic activities, that he’d use the staff to balance or counter-balance so he could hold the “action-point” for longer.

                      The lady did some great ballet and transition poses, and she did some wonderful seated poses where she’d plop down in a casual way and be so relaxed and comfortable.

                      I miss that class.

                    5. @ Sarah, Pohjalainen;

                      As weird as it might sound, those spread-em poses are really useful when it comes to action shot references and foreshortening. And I mean things like fights, acrobatic action poses. Think Spider Man, and How To Draw The Marvel Way.

                    8. “Yes, I have a few cds too, and some of the poses are rather puzzling. Except maybe for just practice purposes, and maybe learning to see the body better (oh, it looks like that…).”

                      Some of them poses make me think, “Oowww! It’s not supposed to look like that.”

                  2. Sarah, I have found this series very useful if you can get one with the CD more so: http://www.amazon.com/gp/bookseries/B00CJ7J7G0/ref=sr_1_5_acs_b_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1416232345&sr=8-5-acs

                    The Boys and Men, Girls and Women, and People and Poses are the three you want with CDs. The “Big book of” is a compilation of the images in those three, but it does not have the CDs. There’s also a deviant art account or three that does reference photos (I’ll have to look some of them up again to verify which…)

                2. The general rule of the thumb for female shoulder-hip ratio is they’re about the same width. There will be some women who’ll have wider hips, and some with slightly narrower hips (because nobody’s built the same way) but for classic standards of beauty, hip-shoulders are the same. There will be variations of waistline as well.

                  One of the best books I’ve read on anatomy with bone structure and muscle discussed in detail are the books by Burne Hogarth. WELL worth the investment.

                  1. Love the Burne Hogarth books! I’ve got Dynamic Anatomy, Drawing Dynamic Hands, and Drawing the Human Head in a box somewhere. At least, those, maybe more…

                    1. I — think — I have that one, too. Seems like I had it for a class.

                      What makes Burne Hogarth good is the dynamic stuff. Lot’s of tension and movement.

                      Like Shadow said, worth the investment.

                    3. You might try a Goggles* Image search for “Burne Hogarth Dynamic Anatomy.” Give you an idea of what’s in the book so you don’t have to drop money uncertainly.

                      He stresses the musculature dramatically, which gives good context from which to tone things back down.

                      But, I’m obviously a fan, so check the images and see what you think.

                      😀

                    5. I found this one, the Finnish edition, in a used books store. They keep making new printings, about once a decade or so, and it is the best one available as a Finnish translation so it has been quite popular here (I think there have been one or two made by Finns, but they are long out of print). But yes, since I don’t have any problems understanding English maybe it’s time to widen my selection (but where will I put them, I have no shelf space left….? Get rid of something? Argh, choices…).

                  3. Probably gratuitous query, but I presume you’ve looked at his Tarzan work?

                    It is truly stunning to contemplate that the American comics section was once graced by such artists as Hogarth, Foster, Raymond, Caniff, Herriman, McCay and George McManus, among others.

                    If you have the chance, look at Caniff’s artistic growth during the first year of his Terry & the Pirates strip. ABSOLUTELY stunning.

                    1. Hardly gratuitous. I’d only seen pictures of it, but not the actual comics. I’d heard of them though.
                      How to Draw the Marvel Way and Burne Hogarth were my first artbooks. As in, ‘mine’. Not the art books from museums my Dad collected.

                      I’ll have to look it up. At the moment, I’m distracted by minecraft. Housemate has discovered rocket launchers in one of the mods. The laughter I hear is … well, Aff has a deep voice.

                    3. Let’s see if I can post this time… damn computer.

                      I am quite familiar with those Tarzans, I used to dig for them in used books store as a kid – the ones in our town had everything, books, comics etc – read, take back and trade for more. Mother didn’t allow me to collect, unfortunately.

            1. Yep.

              And one of the prominent reasons why I laugh myself hysterical whenever I hear “BUT THERE ARE NO STRONG GIRL CHARACTERS. Q_Q ”

              Aya’s a freaking NEW YORK COP. The novel the games are a loose sequel of is written by a Japanese author. The game featured a strong female main character and protagonist, and a strong female antagonist.

              Seriously, they’re looking in the wrong places deliberately. The latest version of Princess Zelda is a magic wielding, bow and sword in accord badass… who still retains her high-toned feminine voice and smashes through reams of enemies like an overpowered badass.

              1. I wonder how they’d react to Izumi Curtis from the Fullmetal Alchemist anime/manga series. Just a mere housewife, after all. *snicker*

                  1. But… but… the patriarchy!

                    (Why isn’t there a Patrickarchy? Okay, I’d be more of the “why are you bothering me, figure it out yourself” sort of tyrant.)

        2. Such people would have been too busy complaining about WWII bomber nose art to thank the bombers who risked their lives delivering TNT candygrams to Nazi factories … and even then they’d complain because we didn’t warn civilians to clear out before our visits.

          Talk about being “close to porn,” check out the “Ready, Teddy” picture.

          1. BTW – estimated casualty rates of those crews, flying their uninsulated, unheated unpressurized death traps was on the order of over 50%:

            … 55,573 killed out of a total of 125,000 aircrew (a 44.4% death rate), a further 8,403 were wounded in action and 9,838 became prisoners of war.

            per Wiki

            Meanwhile …

            … check the nacelles on that bomber!

              1. Sure they did, just vicariously. I’m sure some of those women depicted on the noses caught bullets, and more when down in flames.

        1. Speaking of… *mischievous grin* I’m looking at the package I got in my mail today of a gender-flipped figure of Jason Voorhees by Shunya Yamashita.

          The side illustration of Yamashita’s original drawing has her… him? … with some serious abs.

          Since the character is originally male and only turned into a girl for illustrative purposes, is it objectification of a guy or girl? XD

          (I’m not being remotely serious here by the way.)

          1. Did you look at the handle on that axe? That thing would hurt to use, I’ve seen 2×4’s that were more ergonomic.

    4. I believe it officially makes her a “traitor to her sex”, according to other women who can neither do nor paint to the same standard.

  41. And another BTW… 🙂 Maybe the reason why I like those pin-ups, and like to create them myself, is that they kind of make me feel at home. Father owned a garage, and always had that customary pin-up calendar on the wall there…. 😀

  42. The thing to always keep in mind is that for the Vagina Warriors Outrage Brigade, it is never really about shirts, or trigger warnings or “yes means yes” or any number of mind-numbing games ..

    It is about Power. Naked, totalitarian, abject Power.

    All this is just the tools being employed to manipulate people who are basically decent and are appalled they may have offended someone.

    It is past time for us to see the game for what it is and STOP PLAYING it.

  43. For those that haven’t see in here’s what the shirts creator said (beyond the immediate twittering):

    http://ellyprizemanupdate.blogspot.co.uk/2014/11/decisions-and-comments.html

    I am pleased to note that amongst other things there is this:
    The people that have attacked and said horrible things I am not going to engage with as the supportive and very lovely comments I have also received outweigh those tenfold!

    The SJWs are in fact out numbered. We have to remember this fact and treat them accordingly

  45. I say we stick Ms. SJW into a room with the lady who made the man that shirt, open it an hour later, and see who comes out of it in tears … or one piece (my money will certainly be on the tatted up punkabilly lady who made the shirt being victorious in this endeavor)

  46. My personal theory, and yes this is a bit off the wall, about scientific advancement and why it is going so much faster is actually very simple. Consider that a truly exceptional person is perhaps 1 in a million. Consider that true breakthrough geniuses who not only have the ability but who are lucky enough to be directed, supported, guided and *survive* to exercise that genius might be 1 in a 100 million. Maybe more but let’s use for argument’s sake that it is 1 in a 100 million.

    With around 7 billion people on Earth today that leaves about 70 such individuals. Which implies to me that this might be the result of a simple numbers game. I know the trope about causation. But it does neatly explain a lot.

    Not that I advocate using Wikipedia for anything other than fishwrap but let’s use their “World Population” chart for the heck of it. At the 0 AD they estimate 300 million people on Earth so the number of breakthrough geniuses would be 3. Across the entire planet. At 1650 AD we’ve got 500 million world population. At 1850 AD it’s 1.265 billion (e.g. 12 super-geniuses). At 1950 AD it’s 2.5 billion or 25 super-geniuses.

    Why is technological advancement accelerating? Because communications technology allows these people the ability to reinforce one another. And they are surviving more and more due to advancements in medical science, agriculture, etc.

    It’s an odd theory I’ll grant you that. But an interesting diversion if nothing else.

    1. I was advised that Einstein was asked about publishing his theory. He said that he held back until he found out that there were at least three or four other scientists worldwide that would understand it. Therefore, he published. The rest is history.

      1. One notes that when he got the Nobel Prize, they didn’t even mention relativitiy. And they only barely mentioned the photo-electric effect.

        What they waxed rapturous about was his work on Brownian motion. Which was when we got evidence that there actually were atoms of a finite size.

    2. I don’t think it is odd, i just think it is incomplete. Other factors apply as well. When i was in elementary school half a century ago one of my teacher threw out an odd bit of trivia. Whether it was accurate or not I am unsure but it was probably close. That teacher said that 955 of all scientists in history were still alive and mostly working.I believe that was probably accurate. Science throughout history was a hobby for the elite and independently wealthy for the most part. It is hard to do quantum physics without a lab, mathematics or time. When your first priority in the morning is to get enough work done in the fields that you will be able to survive the winter abstract thought in a low priority, The geniuses back then wound up concentrating on how to keep the rats from eating the seed corn, not whether the albedo of the stars in x quadrant of the sky indicated states of matter.When you need leisure and intelligence to do science, and the combination was largely a matter of luck back then, not much gets done pre-industrial. I’m sure there are other factors impacting this as well but between your numbers and societies general wealth it probably cover a lot of it

      1. Add to that the modern force multipliers of:
        The Scientific Method
        Computers
        The Internet (Distinct from computers as computational devices) – rapid research and collaboration capabilities

        Plus, you simply have all the previous stuff to build WITH. Whether it’s machine shops, lasers, atomic force microscopes, or superconducting magnets, the precision, sensitivity, and variety of things we can make to help us do more with the science and technology we already know, increases the rapidity of the progress we make.

      2. And even that better method of protecting seed corn the local genius perhaps invented might never go any further than that one family. And unless the genius was the head of the family it might never be used by them either because not that many people in charge would have been likely to listen to the ideas of hired help, or the poor third or fourth cousin they had taken in as a family obligation.

        1. Many of the famous scientist before the nineteenth century were aristocrats. Thus, they had the time to devote themselves to scientific experiments, most often as a hobby.

        2. After all, the risk of trying it and find it worse was — quite high. Both in the chances and in the consequences.

  48. It’s funny that 99% of the time, the people protesting this kind of thing are never actually in the field.

    I recall in my first year of Engineering school, some SJWs heard that the Engineering Society (our student council) was going to bring in a stripper for frosh week so they came out to protest. The stripper was actually a well-loved (male) Calculus prof (who stripped down to some gym shorts), and the counter protest group from the faculty included several women. We (the female Engineering students) were confused as to what the fuss was about, since if it happened that a woman was choosing to be paid to strip, wasn’t she empowering herself by taking control of her sexuality?

    Social Justice is hard…I’d sooner spend the night doing differential equations.

    1. There’s an easy way to figure out the logic of SJW’s: You’re Wrong.

      Really, that’s all there is to it, whatever you’re doing, if you’re not one of their clique, You’re Wrong, and they can trot out some trite bit of critical theory to back it up, while ignoring any other bits they’re not using at the time that might contradict it (Those will be saved for later).

          1. poison ivy then. They aren’t pretty. Roses are pretty. They remind of (don’t know their name) the stuff that grows on and strangles trees in Portland, Oregon.

              1. There’s also the ugly stuff with puffy seed pods. English Ivy is at least pretty, this stuff looks like it should be but isn’t.

                Clematis vitalba, according to a quick poke-around. Also Irish ivy, but booger if I can see the difference between that and English.

            2. Multiflora roses aren’t particularly pretty, and they’re almost impossible to kill out. They were introduced into the Ozarks during the Depression in some sort of Government program as a fence row enhancement. Farmers have been trying to get rid of them ever since.

                1. I always thought our “wild rose” and their multiflora rose were the same thing, just different names in different parts of the country.

                  Oh, and over here in our low country we have not only the normal wild rose, but another “wild rose” that has rose hips and grows and looks like Himalayan blackberry vines except it has “rose leaves” and pink flowers. Great fun when where you need to be is in approximately the middle of a twenty acre patch of mixed wild rose, Himalayan and Evergreen blackberries.

                  1. The one in the edge of my garden I took off level with the ground is coming back. Please feel free to come by for a beer and bring your rebar.

              2. Rosa rugosa is listed as a noxious weed in several Midwestern states (Iowa comes to mind) because people tried to use it for fences and it did a little too well.

                1. It is useful for erosion control along highways because it’s salt tolerant, and also for keeping bums from sleeping in flower beds because it’s thorny.

                  Which may not outweigh its faults.

                1. +1

                  That stuff is great. It actually got rid of the bindweed infestation that had been taking over our yard for years.

  49. Maybe I am alone in noticing this, but the figures gracing his shirt strike me as derivative (if not outright swipes) of stereotypical “Golden Age” SF covers, with BEMs and steely-jawed, raygun-wielding rocket pilots excised. It is a salute to SF’s past which inspired so many of those who have driven the human race into space.

    Arguably the removal of the BEMs and rocket jockeys is speciest and sexist.

    Focusing on such complaints is akin to belly-aching that Columbus’ crews were insufficiently diverse.

    1. I believe the name of the fabric print pattern is “Fired Up Girls”.

      The derivation of the name from their obvious state of oppression is an exercise left to a gender studies major. Frankly, I can’t even fake that stupid.

  50. I might also note that such complaints as the ones about this shirt are why boys create their little clubs with a Prime Directive of “No Girls Allowed.” Because such Margaret Wades* ALWAYS eventually turn the activities into what they want to be doing and instead of Spaceman Spiff blasting BEMs they’re sitting down with them for High Tea and being ordered to wash their hands and not rest elbows on the table.

    If anything, the sexism here is coming from those demanding that all venues abide by their rules and standards.

    *Look it up — do I always have to link obscure references for you?! Try under “Dennis the Menace.”

    1. I hadn’t thought about that, but you’re right; and, going further, why is it that small children can seem to figure out a basic concept that adults can’t?

      1. Wikipedia has an interesting write up:

        Gina Gillotti — a fiercely independent young Italian-American girl, whom Dennis is mostly unaware that he has a crush on. Gina is tomboyish yet still feminine in appearance. She also likes Dennis in a future-romantic way, but in contrast to his dislike of Margaret, Dennis actually enjoys being with Gina. He likes her because she is as independent-minded as he is, and she enjoys the same things that he does. Gina is aware that she is a girl, and woe betide anyone who thinks otherwise.

        That last sentence… whooo, don’t let the feminists see that.

        1. Yeah, tomboy but still a girl. I liked her a lot. She was also colored – the few times I saw her in color – as sometimes being darker skinned than Dennis, so I initially thought she was Spanish/Hispanic, till I learned her last name and her family.

            1. I like Prickly City, but I read it on GoComics, and the commentators are…. ugh. I try to hit it around midnight when new strips are up but there are no comments.

  51. from Amy Alkon’s blog:
    ” feminism is no longer about demanding that women be treated as equals, but as eggshells. “

  53. OK, I’m a Crank. I admit it. But my gut reaction to this story is to want to say “Yes, sweetheart, we understand that you have been petted and made much of your whole worthless life. We get that you believe that center stage belongs to you as by right, and that the entire universe orbits around your twat. But right now we’re going to have to ask that you sit down and shut the fuck up, because the adults are talking about something that actually matters.”

  55. Cool science and space princess Hawaiian shirt. I fail to see why these do not mesh. I am not fond (extreme understatement) of reporters… I have to say this lady (and I use the term simply to be polite) is not doing anything to change my negative opinion of them. What that shirt says to little girl geeks: Women get to blow things up in space too!

    1. See — that’s what I thought.

      But I’m so lost in my own cis-male world I took the shirt as a celebration of the beauty of women, the joy in science and the future, and the awesome gift from a friend.

  56. Glossing over all the poor reasoning on display here- that if you put a raygun in the hand of a pinup with her legs splayed it’s ‘science fiction’, for one thing, or that addressing a cultural bias in STEM involves dumbing down the science in any way, for another- it takes a special kind of c*nt to call another woman a ‘fluffer’….for any reason. You lost the argument in that moment. I now return you to the dazzlingly bizarre comment section circle jerk in progress.

    1. You see, what is really bizarre is that you think I should agree with you or any woman because we share sexual organs.
      Apparently upbringing, reasoning, thought, nothing counts, except “sexual organs.”
      Also, fyi, there’s no spread legs, and you’re a troll and an idiot.
      Hey, guys, fresh meat.

        1. Nah, I’m going to let the “most dangerous of the species” handle this troll. [Very Big Evil Grin]

        1. First, you’re using the wrong shirt.
          Secondly, let’s pretend that there’s a woman in a similar pose on the shirt in question. If you’re referring to the woman in the center who is holding an assault rifle with a scope mounted on it and a rather oversized pistol, here’s what I have to say to you.
          As a heterosexual man, that pose screams “sexytimes” about as loud as a cabbage hollers anything.
          Also, for a person complaining about “poor reasoning,” your evidence-gathering skills need work.

        2. Actually, you claimed that the legs were in the “splayed” position, and now you’re saying “spread”. You strongly imply that women spreading (or splaying) their legs is a negative, so what is your problem with women doing whatever they’d like to do with their legs?

          Are you a slut shamer, or just a garden variety fool?

        3. Hardly requires courage to allow a lame post. The illustration cited is merely a standard example of what is a common “heroic pose” standing straddle-footed to assert spacial dominance, similar to this:

          The fact it is a leather clad female is merely consistent with the overall theme of the set, irrelevant to any but the sexually obsessed.

        4. Oh wow; didn’t expect you to have the courage to pass this comment through moderation. Fabulous!

          Wannabe martyr applicant. Check!

        5. Can anyone confirm whether that is an actual image of Matt Taylor’s shirt or merely a similar fabric? My understanding is that his was custom made, so any stressing over the fabric shown here seems straining at gnats.

          Stipulating that it is an accurate representation, the greatest problem with the femme cited is not her standing straddle-legged but rather her terrible shooting position. She needs to get her hands up and support those guns properly, however far her feet might be apart.

          And, addressing a point made lower down: that does not appear to be “camel-toe,” it is the seam of the leather trousers. Some people have difficulty with seeing what is right before their eyes for fantasizing about what they are looking at.

      1. I know. Isn’t it astonishing someone from the sisterhood of vagina comes in calling someone else a “cunt”? Am I supposed to melt into a puddle of apologies, now?
        These special snow flakes are so brain damaged it’s almost not worth the trouble of beating them, except for what they’re doing to our society and the idiots who are afraid of them.

        2. Oh, and now that I think about it, if she feels better thinking that I called the chick a “fluffer”, she’s more than welcome to.

          I mean, if it’s forbidden for a woman, I assume it’s alright for a guy to say it?

        3. I find it interesting that cunt is an acceptable insult, while fluffer* is beyond the pale. But since she deems it acceptable, that means I don’t have to censor myself when I respond to the small-minded, jealous little cunt.

          *I’m guessing fluffer is unacceptable because the term usually refers to someone servicing a male, and being associated with a male in anything but a totally dominating way is unthinkable?

          1. Just because someone cannot spell “count” properly, how does that make it an insult ?

            (He asked, innocently)

              1. Speaking of the animal kingdom, I just realized that Jenny is an entirely appropriate name for her.

          2. Don’t be giving yourself much in the way of props. Sarah wasn’t bothered by you, or surprised, inconvenienced, irritated…

            You’re a fairly minor disturbance in the daily fabric around here. Unable to even spawn a significant thread drift.

            No, you just got whacked by the troll reflex. And this little missive validates the reflex.

          3. Someone pooping on the carpet and declaring it an art commentary would upset her, as well.

            That you admit to be taking pleasure in upsetting people is a final nail in explaining what quality of person you are.

          4. That comment is the essence of trolldom in remarkably concise language. There is no indication of any purpose other than “bothering” — no hope of enlightening, no desire to challenge stale thinking, no effort to represent a different viewpoint; just “to bother you.”

            That same justification is expressed by any half-wit who ever mooned another person.

            1. well, to be fair she’s right. It does bother me. I don’t sleep well at night after being reminded of HOW MUCH RAW STUPID WRAPPED IN SMUG is running around out there.

    4. Genevieve Sabine – How does throwing profanity advance your stance that *you* are using something other than “poor reasoning”? You’ve already proved that you don’t have a basic command of English vocabulary, but know all the ‘nasties’. STEM, for you, evidently means “Sex, Tits, Excrement, and Menstruation”. “Circle jerk” – sorry, but neither Sarah, nor I, nor a lot of others here have the equipment to use in such an activity.

      I’m wagering, though, that having thrown your water balloon filled with your own bodily fluids, you will now run away and chortle to some group of like-minded lack-wits about your ‘bravery’ in speaking “truth to power”. All except for the bit about truth, of course. Oh, and the part about power.

        2. That’s rich, coming from someone whose first appearance here is to fling accusations without supporting evidence. All you’ve done here is make it look like you can’t think of anything better than a lame putdown.

            2. Yeah, but there’s been a lot of discussion in addition to the put downs, because we like to discuss things while insulting the idiotic (present company included, natch).

              Unfortunately, you don’t seem capable of the same level of multitasking.

              1. The lameness of the putdowns may be a reflection of the content-free material with which people are trying to work.

            4. Seventeen. That’s how many posts from Genevieve Sabine. I am perhaps being charitable as several could be counted for multiple lameness.

    5. We’re supposed to respect your estimation of “reasoning” when all you do is NAMECALLING? *

      What are you, a filthy mouthed teenager? “Oooh, I called her a body part, but I used an asterisk and declared she lost the argument by being nasty! That’s a winning argument that clearly demonstrates my grasp of reason and establishes my credentials to judge who has greater rational support for what they said!”

      *there’s also the lying about the facts of the case, and the adhomen/ actual sexism of making this about the sex of the person speaking, but it boils down to name calling fairly well.

        2. So the one thing that could be taken for an attempt at manners was you attempting to circumvent decency on a mechanical level, as well.

          You are disgusting.

    6. Dear me. This comment is so far off any kind of valid point it doesn’t have enough meat in it to even manage “wrong”. It’s not even in the same set of dimensions, much less the same universe.

      Let me tell you, as a woman who is employed in STEM and who has multiple STEM degrees, I’ve seen far more offensive things than a 50s retro gals with rayguns shirt. I’ve worked as the only female in an isolated mining camp (and by isolated I mean it took over an hour to FLY to the nearest town. Serious accidents – such as amputations – meant getting on satellite radio and calling for the Flying Doctor service. They meant giving painkilling injections to the instructions of someone on the radio while waiting for the plane and hoping it would arrive in time). I have not seen any fucking “cultural bias” except from the likes of you who presume that I am so idiotically fragile I need my eyes shielded from images of gals with rayguns.

      You and your ilk lost the argument when you focused on a shirt over the achievement of landing a spacecraft on a comet. But then, that’s what your kind always does. You don’t believe in science (“Logic is a tool of the patriarchy” as one of your kind has said – but I don’t see any of you rushing to give up the many things that logic has made possible. Like the computer or smartphone or tablet you used to make you sneering little excuse for a post. Computers run on logic. When you get right down to the guts of it, everything a computer does is governed by whether a switch is on or off. Logic.), you don’t believe in objective fact, all your kind cares about is how it looks and how it feels.

      Well, sweetie, those of us who deal in hard facts and logic have had enough of being polite to entitled bitches who think their cunt makes them too special of any of that dirty work. The gloves are off, and the boot is on the other foot.

      Enjoy it. You and your entitled friends have gone to so much trouble to earn it. I’d be kicking too, but you’re not even worth my contempt.

      1. 1. The figures on Matt Taylor’s shirt were evocative of 80’s centerfolds; in the style of Heavy Metal Magazine. Their poses are more explicit, and their facial expressions more lifeless, than those of 50’s pinups.

        2. I was talking about the comet landing first. I’ve only entered the conversation about the shirt because the reactionary hyperbole has been so ludicrous, violent and persistent….as you are demonstrating here.

        1. 1. I saw them as most evocative of classic SF covers. Maybe it’s because I wasn’t ever into 80s centerfolds.

          2. You were? Your first comment here has absolutely nothing about the comet landing. Frankly, I wouldn’t have even noticed the shirt without the harassment the guy got for wearing it.

          Oh, and “reactionary hyperbole”? You might want to check your Marxist rhetoric at the door. It doesn’t go over well here, what with the hostess having lived in a so-called communist “paradise”.

          1. 1. I’m a fan of many artists and authors who have produced work in Heavy Metal and similar outlets; I know the style well. You aren’t helping your argument by prevaricating about its essential nature; sexually fantastic, often a hairs-breadth away from porn. And porn is great, but not a considerate choice to wear to the office, or on international TV, as it turns out.

            2. I was, in the vast and diverse world beyond this blog.

            1. Hair’s breadth away from porn?

              And you wanna talk about the vast and diverse world?

              Um…

            2. Funny how that thoughtful art critique was completely absent from your first comment. The one calling your hostess a “cunt” because she used a word you disliked. Given that starting point, you don’t have any grounds to claim I’m not helping my argument.

              Prove that you were talking about the comet landing first and foremost. Your twitter feed has nothing.

              1. I’m sure she was totally talking about it on her father’s brother’s nephew’s cousin’s former roommate’s Facebook page.

                It’s all our fault for not knowing automatically.

                1. Well, I failed Telepathy101. If someone wants me to know something, they need to TELL me. I can’t magically divine it out of thin air.

                  2. Don’t worry about failing your Mind Reading courses. You can’t read a Blank Page.

                    1. Now Paul, don’t you think that is a trifle unfair? A graffitti-covered wall can hardly be deemed “blank.”

                      Incoherent, sure. Gibberish, absolutely. But not blank. A blank page can be useful.

                    3. Oh, but it’s fun to fake it. Trance pose, rubbing temples, laboriously reading out “This… space… available”.

                    1. When asked what superpower I would want, I’ve said Telepathy. The reason being that I would be able to learn things direct from other people, without having to take all the time of verbal communication, side comments, distractions from other people, etc.

                      Then I think about how the inside of some people’s heads must be, and think, “Maybe I don’t want that after all…”

                    6. As far as wanting telepathy/empathy, Imagine living in a recycling steel mill, with sirens, crashing metal, etc. *24 hours/day.* It takes a fair amount of effort to “shut it out.” Being at a party where drinking/drugs are in use, adds a Saturn 5 rocket engine firing.
                      You see/hear _all_ the nasty c–p that goes on in many people’s minds. There are more “nasty” not (actual) evil people out there than many realize. Everyone has the capacity to be evil, they just choose not to be. As much as people will deny it, I suspect that the incidence of socio/psychopaths is actually higher in the “white collar” environment. Certainly, the acceptance of what they are is lower. Blue collar is more likely to admit their attitudes.

                    7. Everyone has the capacity to be evil, they just choose not to be.

                      Kind of what makes a person “not evil.”

                      It’s hardly an accomplishment that I don’t do things I have no desire to do- although there is an effect of culture that some bad things are not even considered options. (ie, I do not have any urge to kill my children, or torture someone to death)

                      Something that tends to piss me off with how telepathy is used– the existence of not-nice thoughts shows someone is evil. Unless telepathy is twitched to be something like “only hear stuff that is chosen, a step or two below acting” then it’s ridiculous.

                    8. My default answer is “omnipotence”. Why settle for only being able to do one thing?

                      When they inevitably tell me that that’s cheating I go with “superhuman intelligence with no associated personality disorders”. That way I can figure out how to get omnipotence on my own:-). Something on the order of a Pak Protector should be adequate (Brennan-monster was an idiot…he should’ve figured out FTL and taken out the rest of the Pak long before his gggg-whatever grandson was even born).

                    10. I’ve never really understood when people in stories say they shouldn’t be used for everyday things. Practice makes well, maybe not perfect, but it makes you more familiar with what you’re using, so that it becomes easier.

                    13. I understand it if the power is finite and danger is imminent. Otherwise, I agree. I liked how, in the Practical Magic movie, Sandra Bullock’s character used magic to stir her drinks while she did whatever.

                    14. One of the silliest uses of that theme are where people who “see the future” aren’t supposed to use it for “playing the market”. It is said to be a “gift that can’t be used for personal gain”. Of course, it’s really the response to “if you can see the future, why aren’t you rich?”. [Evil Grin]

                      Oh, one of Anne McCaffrey’s “Talents” had flashes of the future and he was successful in “playing the market”. [Smile]

                    15. Playing the market, in amounts sufficient to create real wealth, would alter the market and thus impair its effectiveness. Think of Warren Buffet.

                      I wonder what the reaction would be to a truly selfless clairvoyant who used the ability to see the future to eliminate folk “what need killin’.”

                      The truly responsible use of such foresight, of course, would be to settle the most serious question of the ages, such as “VHS or Beta?” or whether to go ahead and buy a Windows Vista PC.

                    17. It’s _not_ as simple as you think. I have enough “precog” to see broad possibilities. It’s why I’m concerned with what’s happening. We’re fast approaching a “tipping point,” where entire “systems” will collapse. Most major cities, continue through inertia, not actual competence.
                      The last time I went through Chicago, it was mid-morning (about 11:00 A.M.). It took almost _three_ hours to travel about 10 miles. (Note: Chicago has about 6 _million_, pop. NYC has 8+, LA has 7-8 million, Indy has 750K. ) In a real disaster, the “big” cities will collapse completely. That means most of the East Coast will be written off. Starvation/riots are 24-36 hours away from loss of transport for food.
                      The LP “violence never solves anything,” means that it will spread rapidly. Only rarely can one “see” actual data, such as stock prices. When IBM still sold PC’s, I predicted that it would go from $110 to high 80’s. IIRC, it actually bottomed at about mid-high $70. But, I couldn’t have told you the dates for the fall and rise back. OTOH, I can do “well” at statistical card games (like Blackjack). It’s like killing flies, with a 155 howitzer.

                    18. This is why I always wanted Reed Richards superpowers. Incredible genius and the ability to get to that screw in the back corner behind the machine

                    20. I think the artists sometimes showed him wearing regular clothing with his arms “stretching” outside of his regular clothing.

                      The “fun” was that Sue’s regular clothing often didn’t turn invisible when she did so either she took off her regular clothing or the bad guys saw this empty dress walking toward them. [Evil Grin]

                    21. One of Susan Storm-Richards’ lesser-emphasized powers was the ability to turn other stuff invisible. It rarely had any use in either combat or anything else depicted in the comics, so it was rarely mentioned. It did explain how she could (once she mastered it) turn ordinary clothing invisible.

                      One time she used it was when the FF was trying to open a locked vault without destroying anything on the other side. Sue turned the outer layer invisible so Johnny could burn a tiny hole though the locking mechanism.

                    22. I am highly reluctant to expose the vast amount of time I have expended not speculating about Reed Richards screwing. On the first place, I wonder if even Viagra would stiffen that member of the Fantastic Four, and in the second place the consideration of a practically infinitly malleable extensible tongue suggest a whole realm of reasons as to why he is known as “Mr. Fantastic.”

                      OTOH, Sue Richards (nee Storm) never has to worry about being without her diaphragm thanks to her power to create invisible force fields.

                      You DO NOT want to think about her brother Johnny engaging in such activities.

                      For the record, I read Niven’s essay on the challenges of Kryptonian reproduction while in High School and it has left me forever marred.

                    23. I wanted Bouncing Boy’s powers (from the Legion of Super Heroes)… the ability for a chubby guy to get a hot girl who is really identical triplets.

                    24. If I had a superpower, I would want it to be the creation of special pocket universes. I would raise funds by creating safe locations for dangerous research, for when I have to interact with this universe, and have one of my very own to live in.

                      Or, on a smaller scale, hmm — invisibility would be nice.

            3. ” I know the style well. You aren’t helping your argument by prevaricating about its essential nature; sexually fantastic, often a hairs-breadth away from porn. ”

              Nobody here is prevaricating (including yourself) everybody here seems to be sticking to their guns and claiming that they said just what they meant to say. Kate most certainly is not.

              A hairs-breadth away from porn? Maybe if you let an Iranian mullah define porn, but myself I seen images that get closer to porn on the front of ERB covers in the middle school library.

                1. Yes, as “close to porn” as Hollywood is close to Salt Lake City.

                  Porn is generally considered to be in the mind of the beholder, so perhaps you need more cold showers and to lead a more active life.

                2. I’m not sure what _your_ background is, but *we* are all aware that “the map, does _not_ equal the territory.” IOW, because “porn” and “literature” share letters and words, does NOT make them equivalent. Although many laws, and political statements _do_ bear an uncanny resemblance to porn. (If you define it as abusing/treating people as objects.)
                  Actually that also applies to much “Social Justice inspired ‘literature.'” Males are treated as disposable objects, or inferior, at the very least. IOW, the “people” you “like so much” are actually guilty of the very same things you accuse us of doing. Except for the “difference” being that you “do it in the name of Social Justice.” I’m sorry, but racism/sexism/whateverism, is not “excusable.” it is either right or wrong.

                3. “The works in the title are close to porn.”

                  Gee, isn’t pronz usually closeups of genitalia engaged in sex acts? Funny how I didn’t see any of that on That Shirt.

                  Funny how your alleged brain immediately went there.

                  1. You know what is really close to porn? Victoria’s Secret catalogs and the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit issue.

                    OTOH, if, as Genny claims, the illustrations are a) so close to porn as to not matter* b) evocative of art featured in Heavy Metal, with which darlin’ Genny claims to be very familiar, then it follows that Genny was a heavy porn user.

                    Jenny made her mind up when she was twelve
                    That into foreign languages she would delve
                    But at seventeen to Vassar, it was quite a blow
                    That in twenty-seven languages she couldn’t say “no”

                    Poor Jenny, bright as a penny
                    Her equal would be hard to find
                    To Jenny I’m beholden
                    Her heart was big and golden
                    But she would make up her mind

                    *Otherwise, why complain? If being close to porn is equivalent to porn, then being close to close to porn is also equivalent to porn, and so on ad infinitum until you’ve got everything equivalent to porn.

            4. A hair’s breadth away is nonetheless some distance away.

              As to the second point, I spend considerable time in the vast and diverse world beyond this blog — I did not see you there. Perhaps you confuse muttering snide remarks to your (undoubtedly deliberately culled) FaceBook “friends” to being in the world? Or do you confuse having shouted cuss words out your car window with meriting the attention of anybody?

            5. 1. Apparently the only artistic genre you’re very familiar with; similar tropes are/were used in others – SF covers are more likely to come to mind to both space scientists and the readers of this blog. (Note: I’ve seen both – you must have very thick hair.)
              2. If you were, _elsewhere_, that’s kinda irrelevant to your postings here isn’t it!

            6. Um, so why is it okay for you to be a fan of that art style, but not okay for a scientist to wear it on a shirt? Furthermore, why is a scientist’s fashion sense more relevant than the achievement of his team?

        2. “I’ve only entered the conversation about the shirt because the reactionary hyperbole has been so ludicrous, violent and persistent….as you are demonstrating here.”

          The projection is strong with this one.

          1. Anyone using “reactionary” in a conversation outs herself as a Marxist “progressive”. Which means she a) believes that history comes with a directional arrow. b) believes history moves TOWARDS Marxism. c) knows no actual history. d) certainly has never experienced communism. e) might have other vices.

                2. If there was a sign over the hyperbole, along that lines of “Our aim is to please; we hope yours is as good !” – what problem could there be ?

            2. I told her the Romans would have killed the Sabines if they were like her. Since Rose Eveleth, her BFF, confuses “Go jump off a cliff” with a death threat, that might have been sufficient.

              3. Good heavens, of course. Indeed, I have know leftists to interpret “If we were as violent as you claim, you would be dead by now,” as a death threat.

        3. Heavy Metal’s illustrations were evocative of far earlier illustrative style, adjusted for less discrete standards of their times. Their stylistic origins extend back an additional fifty years, approximately. The elements you focus on are more representative of the diminution of artists’ techniques as skill and technical ability have been downgraded in the art community.

          Sadly, it is not just the artistic community where skill and technical ability count less.

    7. Yep the kneeling woman does have her legs open, sorry to burst your precious bubble, but kneeling on one knee is fairly common and time honored shooting stance; and it’s really difficult to do with your legs closed. I know guns are an evil tool of the patriarchy that a special kind of cunt like you wouldn’t dirty herself by any knowledge of, but then maybe you should take the time honored patriarchal advice of, “it is better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open your mouth and prove yourself one.”

      Yes a raygun does make it science fiction, regardless of whether the person wielding it is a pinup, a fat bald guy, or a woman in a burka. The same as the presence of a werewolf makes something paranormal, regardless of whether the rest of the story is about werewolves attacking and eating an army squad or one long sex scene interspersed with a few feminist diatribes.
      Women have been dressing to attract guys attention for thousands of years, and I suspect will continue to do so for thousands more, so yes their outfits, or lack thereof is immaterial to the genre they are representing.
      Of course Matt Taylor is the blue collar version of a scientist, and since you are too afraid to voice your opinion of the guys with sleeve tats out in the pipe ditch laying your sewer pipe (who might look at Matt’s shirt as a great inspiration to wear when they go out Friday night) you want to pick on somebody a couple thousand miles away, who might knuckle under to you instead telling you to STFU and “get out of my sight you stupid twat, or I’ll sic my girlfriend on you.”
      As for dumbing down the STEM, that is what cunts like you want to do, so you can feel all superior, without having to face the fact that you are too stupid to even get a job fluffing the dropouts. Notice that the spineless leader of the team who is unwilling to stand up for Matt is a woman, and while I don’t appreciate her lack of courage, she managed to get to the position without dumbing down the STEM, and the “bint” who made Matt the shirt is a Laser Technician; yep another STEM occupation. It isn’t that women can’t do it, or that they are driven out by tacky shirts; it’s that stupid twats like you can’t do it. We WOULD have to dumb down the STEM to let in stupid twats like you, and personally if I was doing something actually important, I’d rather have someone who knew what the hell they were doing helping me, regardless of their fashion sense, or lack thereof.

          1. Appears to be a spam account, from a quick look around.

            If only it was of higher quality than some kind of random generator designed to mimic an average high school kid trying to do put-downs.

            1. It’s sad. Troll quality is way down these days.

              I blame the Millenials.

              *Kidding! Kidding! Please put away the mom glare?*

              1. Don’t worry, I’m busy being annoyed by someone mistakenly thinking that being an immature idiot with no redeeming qualities is anything but a waste of time.

                I’m waiting for a swipe at Shadow, so we know it’s Clamps cross-dressing. The intelligence and rhetoric is about the right level, but it’s really unusual for there to not be some non sequitur about one of his stalking targets.

                2. As sad as I am to say this, quaint Geny here is showing more intelligence and comprehension than Clamps.

                    1. I don’t think this is Andrew Marston aka Clamps aka Yama aka “an imbecile,” because her posts are too coherent in terms of both content and grammar. Yama can’t write as well as she does.

                  2. Yeah, well, the bar ain’t that high. I’ve seen toe fungus that showed more intelligence and comprehension than Clamps.

                    Which, I guess, was kind of your point, wasn’t it?

        3. Considering those would be her ass cheeks that you’ve confused with a “camel toe”, I’d say you’re struggling in the anatomy department.

            1. Or familiarity of the way that muscles are soft when relaxed, and sat on.

              Yeah, I’m wondering if this is a Clampsian Delusion Girl. They seem to have about the same level of grasp of human bone structure as well as female body tissue.

              In fact, I am doubting that the critter in question is a female, or they’d KNOW that. You know, coz even flat boobs have soft tissue.

        4. “Anatomically impossible lunge”??? Girl, I used to fence and that lunge ain’t squat.

          I have also seen far more challenging positions taken on a Balance bean watching the Olympics. If ignorance were cheese yours could be cut with a spork.

        5. …aaaaaaand the chaff and flares are deployed by our little troll since she can’t respond to bearcat’s post.

          At all.

        6. Well, you’ve just told me something you didn’t intend to, namely that you are extremely unathletic. When I was in high school, one of my friends was a chubby 16-year-old girl. She had taken dance classes, and in consequence could go into a full split from a standing position, which is much harder than merely crouching with legs splayed. Mind you, my friend stated that the position was uncomfortable and a bit hard to get up from, but it was hardly “anatomically impossible.”

    8. So many people have already their fun, and I’m late to the party. 😦

      This brouhaha is what you call addressing a cultural bias in STEM? Clearly you have no particular stake in STEM or you’d understand that the type of personalities excelling in the field (regardless of equipment) aren’t going to be swayed by hysterics, bullying and abuse.

      Baffled by it, sure.

      See, dropping a 100kg probe on an object hurtling through the solar system 300+ million miles away — the people who do that sorta thing have to be able to reason intelligently from data found in the real world. They don’t have the luxury of making shit up and letting it count as their professional contribution.

      Since we’re on the topic of special kinds of cunts, what brought you here?

      1. “This brouhaha is what you call addressing a cultural bias in STEM? Clearly you have no particular stake in STEM or you’d understand that the type of personalities excelling in the field (regardless of equipment) aren’t going to be swayed by hysterics, bullying and abuse.”

        Oh, cool. Just as well, since it doesn’t appear anyone in this faction been subject to any. So what’s troubling you?

          1. Oh, cool. Just as well, since it doesn’t appear Matt Taylor, you, or anyone you’re referring to when you say ‘personalities excelling in the field’ have been subject to hysterics, bullying and abuse. So what’s troubling you?

            1. Thank you for clarifying, and illustrating your essential failure to understand the events leading to this discussion, the personalities involved, or the nature of the STEM community.

              Clarity is always appreciated.

              As for myself? No, I’ve suffered nothing from this fracas. I just disdain bullies.

                2. I fear I find that hard to credit.

                  You, after all, are the interloper in this community. Gleefully kicking mud about with abandon.

                  1. It’s a matter of perspective, isn’t it? I was linked through to this post and was so struck by how horrible, mean-spirited and absurd all of this material was (you’re actually complaining about *being* bullied?), I decided to stand up to it. True, it’s not my house; I was surprised the hostess posted my comment at all….but she clearly did so because she wanted you all to enjoy a vicious pile-on. Which brings me back to how absurd it is any of you would complain about being bullied, or call out bullying behavior in others.

                    I imagine you’re trying to dox me right now. That seems to be the kind of people you are. Am I wrong?

                    1. Why would we dox you? We don’t actually care who you are.

                      And since you care to comment about bullying, you really are establishing just how much of a moron you are. You haven’t been bullied here. You’re not being bullied at all. You see, you just just go the hell away, and we won’t care.

                      We’re just trying to encourage you.

                      Had you come here for discussion, you’d be welcomed. Instead, you came here to be an ass. You’ve succeeded. You can go away now.

                    8. As to this silly loop-de-loop argument, now we’re the bullies for calling out those who would use their social power to shame and cow a man for daring to offend their delicate sensibilities? Uh-huh.

                      It’s not a matter of perspective.

                    11. It’s depressing. I remember when my ideological opponents were wicked smart individuals who forced me to examine every facet and crevice of my philosophy.

                      Then I graduated high school.

                    12. Reading your comments here, I think you are projecting, and trying to dress people here in the temper of different people – perhaps even your own. Yes, you are wrong in the accusation of anyone here caring enough to dox you. This is not an uncommon tactic for people who come here with the intent to scold and shame us for having an opinion that disagrees with yours.

                      If that is bullying to you, then do not be surprised that we here are not rallying to your spurious accusations, or desperately bending over backward to try and prove to you we are not. We are quite familiar with these tactics that you have employed, and we are not falling for them.

                      Also, coming here to yell at us shows you also know nothing about the resident participants of this blog’s regular commentators. Quite a number of the people here are in the STEM fields, both men and women alike.

                      And since you came here opening with sexual insults, you are quite the cockjuggling cuntbucket, aren’t you, thinking that by opening with sex-shaming name calling, you’re lending YOUR nonarguments and idiocy even less validity. You’re a special snowflake SJW baby seal, who came here barking incoherently and is surprised that you’re being verbally clubbed.

                    18. No point in summoning the Corrieakin. Why have him waste his time in fighting a troll with so little substance? Where’s the fun in that?

                    19. Yeah, I know, and besides, it’s late over on that part of the world. But she does quite neatly fit the Special Snowflake SJW Seal, doesn’t she?

                      I mean, complaining about that pose. She’s never fallen on her arse, after slipping on a patch of ice, ever? Or is she implying that she’s never ever spread her legs for any reason, such as say, yoga, or other stretching exercises involving one’s legs. Such as walking, running, that kind of thing.

                      And yes, I could have gone for the cheap shot option, but let’s be serious here. If this seal couldn’t do what I said above, she’s not going to be able to do the stretching for sex, so it wasn’t worth the bother.

                    21. Lesbian would imply that they’d had had sexual attractions, as opposed to gynaecological obsession.

                      With this seal’s utter fixation on the body and nether regions versus the very sassy, confident expressions, and other interesting details mentioned before (trigger safety, holster details, etc) the most I can figure is that the prude who cannot help but be fascinated by the illustration’s crotch is someone who has never seen an attractive female in the nude.

                      Kind of like how back in the day, a flasher would get screaming women who are ‘all offended’. (And I remember this tongue-in-cheek Playboy cartoon where instead of a screaming old lady, the flasher has the old woman in question adjusting her glasses with a slight smile, as if to imply ‘that’s it? That’s all you’ve got?’ and the flasher’s grin is noticeably fading…)

                      We’re the unimpressed, amused old lady adjusting our glasses for mocking scrutiny. The seal is the flasher, who came here with the clear intent to shock and insult and offend (you) and is being laughed at for the pissant little effort.

                    22. She reminds me of the high school students who called me a “bitch” and expected me to apologize/appease them.
                      Heaven knows where people get these notions.

                      I’ve been SHOT AT. With REAL guns. (okay, they were shooting into a demonstration, and I was in the middle of it.) I’ve faced down military with machine guns and refused to back.
                      But they think “cunt” and “bitch” will make me fold.
                      Honest, HOW PROTECTED ARE THEY?

                    24. They’re shrieking violets who wilt and whither at the slightest provocation, rather than REAL women.

                      You know, the kind that are tough, intelligent, and don’t take crap off of the SJWs. 😀

                    27. I saw the original in Larry’s post. Didn’t realize others had popped up!

                      I’m missing things! AH!!

                    32. Wasn’t that a Herman’s Hermits song? No glassing today, my troll has run away?

                      I may have Mondegreened that lyric …

                    34. Obviously, this idiot has never been around/see MadMike at work. =8-0 (Think Larry Correia but less refined, and less patient. I’ve known MM for almost 23 years, so _I_ can say that. 🙂 )

                    36. Glossing over all the poor reasoning on display here

                      That is how you started your first comment. Not exactly a way to show you want to have a dialog, is it?

                      that if you put a raygun in the hand of a pinup with her legs splayed it’s ‘science fiction’

                      There you are misrepresenting what was said. You take your own characterization of the images and then try to make it look like that is what someone said — and they didn’t. I could go on, but you will no more discuss the issue with me than you have with anyone else here. You came in from another site, you came in with an agenda and you have failed to do anything more than call names and ignore the fact that what everyone is upset with is the fact that a scientific milestone was being shouted down by some folks simply because someone wore a shirt they didn’t like.

                      You proved you had an agenda when you came here with your comment about how you were surprised Sarah let your comment out of moderation. Then, you seem to expect us to know what you are thinking or tweeting or whatever because at no point prior to being called on it had you discussed the actual landing or the science behind what happened. When called on it, you made the basic assertion that you had discussed it in the greater scheme of things beyond this blog.

                      As for bullying, I suggest that is exactly what happened to the ESA scientist. As for what happened here, nope. Not bullying. Just folks from different walks of life, including more than one female scientist, letting you know that you’ve shown bad form and bad manners and your tactics aren’t appreciated.

                    37. “Just folks from different walks of life, including more than one female scientist, letting you know that you’ve shown bad form and bad manners and your tactics aren’t appreciated.”

                      And, well, we’re not exactly being polite about it, but since her first comment sought to called our hostess a “c*nt” (but the star was just her un-clever attempt to get through site filters despite the fact she didn’t think it would be published anyways), it’s clear there wasn’t really any point in being polite.

                      I’m just worried I’m wasting good snark on an oxygen thief.

                    39. Ah! You were right all along! You knew us, the real us, the evil us.

                      I feel so unmasked, so exposed. It’s almost like — I’m glue. The bouncing sound is driving me crazy…

                    41. It’s a matter of perspective, isn’t it?
                      Perspective does not trump facts, madam. The facts are that some mean-spirited female chose to focus on the shirt one scientist wore (while failing to notice that his team lead is female and clearly had no issues with it) rather than the team’s achievement of sending a probe into space to fly for years before landing on a comet – an achievement of engineering that is truly magnificent. You have chosen to believe that decrying this focus as mean-spirited is horrible, mean-spirited, and absurd.

                      Your response was to be deliberately offensive and provocative, then claim the result is bullying.

                      This is the effective “conversation” here:
                      Madam Sabine: *slap* you nasty cunt how dare you!
                      Everyone else: Oh look, another one looking to be all offended at us.
                      Madam Sabine: You’re BULLYING MEEEEEEEEE.

                      she clearly did so because she wanted you all to enjoy a vicious pile-on
                      Madam, if you think this is vicious you’re sorely deluded. This is merely vigorous debate. Nobody has bothered to search out your real identity, or anything much past the mindless twitter feed you link to in your ID.

                      Thus far you’ve done nothing but spit insults then whine that you’re not being respected. It’s the same thing we’ve seen from any number of trolls.

                      Oh, and I have been bullied. Most of my school life I couldn’t let anything of mine out out of my sight or it would be vandalized. But as a woman working in a STEM field, I have never been bullied or victimized. The only people who bullied me were the mean girl cliques – and those, madam, are the ones whose behavior you are echoing.

                    42. Well, in all fairness, I’ve been spitting out a lot of insults at her. Of course, with her introduction here, I couldn’t help but figure that’s what she was here for.

                    43. Yes, that was obvious. Now she gets to go back to her friends and brag about how she was beaten up here. Almost as good as getting a medal.

                    47. To quote my friend Pat Richardson, a gentleman and a scholar, in this type of situation, “Jesus Cookies, but they insist on proving we’re right about them, even when we wish we weren’t.”

                    49. She set the tone when she walked in the door. All followed from there, whatever claims to mad warrior skillz she wants to make elsewhere.

                      She was a bore, but it was a slow night with sleet sheeting against the window.

                    51. You are absolutely correct. Please do accept my abject apologies.

                      I can only humbly suggest, perhaps the cold has slowed my wits…

                    52. Um, if you go back and actually read the post and the comments, references to bullying being with the bullying of Matt Taylor, and then expand into the general case of Social Justice Warrior Feminists bullying any male (and any female who doesn’t toe the feminist line) whenever they can find something to be outraged about. And they seem to be able to find a reason to be outraged about anything at all.

                      As for people here being bullied, you’re really in the wrong territory to be making claims that WE don’t know what it’s like to be bullied.

                    53. It’s good to know that as a white male, I was incapable of being bullied.

                      I guess the bullies at my school were unaware of this and failed to act accordingly.

                    54. When I get my time machine built, I’ll send you back so you can tell them, and keep it from happening, because I’m sure that if they knew, they would leave you alone.

                    57. Ah, yes. Hey! Everybody! Wayne’s making his famous LIME PIE with WHIPPED CREAM over here.

                      Just foodies. Talking food. Yep.

                    59. *head in hands, waves the team forward*

                      Have care with her. RAH made me promise she’d make Jovian station for the anniversary steak dinner. He made a special trip to pick up a barrel of Devil’s Cut for extra aging, just for her.

                      You guys flub this, I’m giving him your names. And I suggest you retire to the late Pleistocene.

                    60. Of course. It simply had to be a case of them not knowing rather than a case of they just didn’t give a damn.

                      I mean, white male privilege is a thing, right?

                    61. I was the kid no one liked in grade school. No one would talk to me (talk about me, yes, but not to me). If I went to a piece of playground equipment, everyone else would leave. In the winter they threw snowballs with rocks in them at me. And “Ignore them and they’ll go away” didn’t work.

                      Compared to a lot of people here, my childhood was idyllic.

                    62. “Well, in all fairness, I’ve been spitting out a lot of insults at her. Of course, with her introduction here, I couldn’t help but figure that’s what she was here for.”

                      Yeah, my original response was no doubt cruder than necessary, I had to dredge up my high school vocabulary to make it (well I didn’t really have to dredge very far, my mind still tends to think rather more profanely than my post, I have found it much easier to censor my mouth than my thoughts.) But it was still at or above her level of discourse.

                      You know the old adage about only being able to communicate if you speak in language they understand?

                    63. Well, since she opened up with such witty remarks as objecting to “fluffer” and calling people cunts, it was clear that she is truly a student of the English language.

                    67. Have I ever mentioned how I hate all of you email posters whose comments thread properly, pushing the comments by those of us who use the internet comment function, as god intended, pages on down the screen?

                    69. “as god intended”?

                      Now where is that in the Bible?

                      I wonder if it’s in the Book of Bevloudan? [Very Big Grin]

                      Note, the Book of Bevloudan is the creation of my Uncle Walter, a former Pastor. He joking gave “commands” from that book to my cousins (his kids), myself and my sister. Oh, my cousins were named Bev, Lou and Dan. [Wink]

                    72. “Did I say Time Machine? Wow, what an autocorrect! I meant “Lime Pie with Whipped Cream” (that’s my story and I’m sticking to it).”

                    73. Ignorance is blissful, so you must be delighted. The hostess blocks very few trolls, even those as obvious as you, under the presumption that freedom of speech entails letting people engage. It is hardly her fault that you’ve contributed but noxious hectoring and been responded to appropriately.

                      As for doxxing you? How long have you suffered delusions of significance? It isn’t worth anybody’s bother.

                    74. I imagine you’re trying to dox me right now. That seems to be the kind of people you are. Am I wrong?

                      Just projecting.

                      Pity, if I weren’t at work, I’d post a clip from Spaceballs that describes idiots like you quite well.

                    76. Was I the only one who noticed this?

                      “I was linked through to this post”

                      So, was this some kind of assignment you were given, to come troll this blog? Who sent you this link?

                    77. I just assumed she was linked through from another blog, much as Sarah often provides links in her posts. And telling us where she was linked through from would be doxxing herself.

                    1. Worry? Nay, I see no worry ‘pon your draconic countenance, but I note that you are edging eagerly out of the line of fire with a toothy grin of anticipation, like a smart dragon getting out of the way of Lina Inverse’s Dragonslave as soon as she mouths “Darkness beyond twilight, crimson beyond blood that flows…”

        2. And now the fluffer shows why she is stuck in that profession, lack of reading comprehension. Which is a shame since she is so ovviously obsessed with what she sees as cameltoe in a draw3ing. Funny, no one else was that drawn to that particular facet

            1. I was busy checking out the guns.

              Guess I’ll have to stay for detention after the patriarchy meeting.

              Again.

              1. No, it’s common amongst geeks like us.

                “I wish the pretty lady would [move/turn] so I can get a better look at [technical device/gun]”
                😉

                  1. *grin* Nah, that white stuff is her using whipped cream so it’ll drip off her chin while she’s setting up her next wounded gazelle gambit while she screams e-rape bullying and harassment from us ‘white men’.

                    But hey, since she so focused on the crotch of fictional characters…

                    2. We’re talking about someone who’s burning out braincells with illogic. She’s not gonna worry about wasting whipped cream, only if it’s low fat and using fake sugar and vegan.

                      Me, I’m wondering how she’ll be screaming gang -e-rape false accusations with all that clogging her throat as she sucks on the bloody can.

                    4. “She’s not gonna worry about wasting whipped cream, only if it’s low fat and using fake sugar and vegan.”

                      This is why I haven’t told her to shut up and go make me a sandwich.

                    7. Extra funny– look below and to the left of the supposedly “splayed, camel-toed, physically impossible pose” gal.

                      Notice the robo-man with a six pack, skin tight gas mask suit and a giant spikey mace?

                      She was able to mistake a seam for the outline of a bodypart, but didn’t notice a humanoid figure that’s significantly larger, even if it is in the background.

                      (Out of curiosity, I tried the pose; I’m not holding guns at the moment, but in my 30s, after three kids, wearing socks on a carpet floor, and with bad knees— I managed it. It’s not a great shooting pose, but the idea is “look cool,” girl version of the Terminator shooting up that bar.)

                    8. Sweet Kami, are all SJWs so completely unable to do these poses? Clamps spent pages of bitching about how he couldn’t bend a leg and sit like a man who is cuddling his wife, saying the poses were impossible.

                      Toss these poseurs out of anatomy art class! They fail it in every single way!

                      I’m hugely pregnant and I could do the pose. Frankly if I’m dual wielding sci-fi M16 and Desert Eagle – like things, I’d probably have to splay your legs like that AND lean against something big and solid to help lift long enough for a quick squeeze of the trigger. But that gal dual wielding has a touch more muscle than I do, so I reckon she’d hold it up a bit longer than I could manage…

                    10. Yeah, I’m seriously late to the party so I kinda agree. Maybe this is Clamps’ headspace female friend?

                      We’re dealing with a delusion? That would explain so much about why fictional depictions of fictional women are so highly focused on and slut-shamed.

                      …On the other hand, this does make me wonder what’s up with the SJW swarm that they can’t do simple poses that someone who regularly jogs can do, and can do. You know, as a pre-run and post-run warm-up and stretch?

                      Was the seal flopping around more of an actual descriptor than a metaphor than I thought?

                    11. “I’d probably have to splay your legs like that AND lean against something big and solid …”

                      Fortunately, Rhys has your back.

                      AND it is just mean of you to put such tempting comments out there for the pun-endowed, otherwise I’d be saying “I’ve got something big and solid for you right here” in a New New York minute.

                    14. Hey, I never noticed until you posted the link where you can scroll around on it, but the chick in the purple cat suit; she is using a crossdraw holster. It is even realistically portrayed, with a flap to go over the hammer portion of her pistol and a slot for the trigger guard.

                      Oh I’m sorry, I was supposed to focusing a leg to the right, wasn’t I, it’s all that dang gun porn, it keeps distracting me.

                    15. So THAT is what the fluffer meant when she said it was borderline porn. She forgot the word “gun”. If she’d included that, we wouldn’t have had that to disagree over at least.

                      I’m sure she doesn’t think of gun porn like we do. For us, it’s awesome. I’m sure she thinks we’re awful for that.

                    16. I know. The first thing I noticed about the pics were that while the women had their fingers inside the trigger ring/guard, they were off the triggers themselves, as if they’d just fired, or are about to.

                      Makes such a HUGE difference to me, as an artist, those itty little details.

                    17. Hey, let’s not be crazy. Clamps doesn’t have *any* female friends, even in his head.

                    19. Nay, sir, I misdoubt your suggestion that he does not pay by the quarter hour; ’tis unlikely that any would tolerate an hour of him for any quantity of lucre.

                    21. Oh well, he likes to claim there are, so let’s pretend for the sake of theory.

                      Besides, she’s ‘using’ the same arguments Clamps did about my artwork. “Impossible’ poses that any reasonably healthy person with working limbs could do.

                      Hell, Crampsy is probably talking to her right now, since we may have found him a potential girlfriend. They seem to have the same mental wavelength issues.

                      Now that I think about it a bit more, I once said that Clamps’ ancestors must have gone out for tacos while God was handing out brains and people were sampling fruit from the Tree of Knowledge – and maybe this is someone who came from that same ancestral stock, so hey, they’ll fulfil a few SJW non-heteronormative checkboxes there!

                      This dumb twat-instead-of-brains (‘coz clearly she’s not using the area above her neck and the area between the legs has nothing to do with thinking) may just be the way that we’ll get a few months of peace and quiet from Clamps while he attempts to court her, until he is distracted by a new jihad to wage, and their relationship blows up in a fiery storm of flaming fish semen.

                      I rather doubt they’d have offspring, since you know, that’s something SJWs aren’t capable of doing. They’re too busy using their reproductive organs for something else. Or are using organs of some sort for unintended functions.

                      I posit this new theory. The typical SJW cerebellum (not the cerebrum), being the area of involuntary action, is directly connected to the colon, which is why they spew such horrifyingly copious amounts of shit.

                    22. “Impossible poses”? Idiot must have never seen a Jack Kirby drawing of Captain America.
                      https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.statuemarvels.com%2Ff523%2Fwho-your-top-ten-captain-america-artists-24105.html&ei=X51pVI-xB8WkNpXug9AI&bvm=bv.79142246,d.eXY&psig=AFQjCNE5o6xTvGJ_Xj7tdduFOv94Pn3V0g&ust=1416294059465894

                      It is called “enhancement” or “ultra-realism” by the pretentious sorts who imagined Heavy Metal the acme of comic illustration. It’s been many years since I even flipped through an issue of that magazine, but I don’t recall being struck by the realistic anatomy and/or poses depicted therein.

                      Next thing you know these twits will complain that artists are forcing Spiderwoman to mimic poses taken by Spiderman.

                    24. Actually I believe Shadow posted a link here a while back to Clamps outing himself as a homosexual… and a Muslim sympathizer… which yes is a perfect example of his reasoning capabilities.

                    25. It was rather impressive how he did it too, in an attempt to paint me as a hater of homosexual men.

                      I’d drawn a character, a male, wearing tight, soft leather pants.

                      Clamps spent a long time obsessing about the details about the loins and crotches of my male characters.

                      I speculated that perhaps he was made insecure of the implied size of the fictional character’s … er… staff of life. (The character is a mage, and I was tempted to say ‘magic wand’) This, I reckoned, was the only reason why he would be nitpicking about it.

                      Clamps lets loose with this gem: “… wait, homosexual people don’t have normal sized genitalia, what?”

                      Cue everyone there blinking, catching that, and having the reaction of: “Oh, so you’re homosexual and that’s why you’re constantly staring at the crotches of my male illustrations? Okay. Makes more sense now.”

                      Clamps: *tantrum*

                    27. Probably spent that time weighing whether or not it was more advantageous for him to play omg victimized by homophobics card versus being showered by SJW thundercunts (coz, apparently, it’s totally okay to use that word now, right? XD ) because he’s a yellow-bellied, screeching pussy.

                      Hell, just from how dense he is, he’s clearly a huge faggot, in the classic English concept of the term. Dumb as a stump, a blockhead, with termites having devoured twisting holes in his skull.

                      There’s no other way that he could have otherwise twisted things around so much that ‘gays have small genitalia’ were the end result.

                    29. Etymological aside:
                      It is my understanding that the term “faggot” achieved its current derogatory meaning a bit more than a century ago, when cigarettes were just coming into fashion. Most men smoked cigars and mocked the cigarette users for “smoking those little faggots” instead of a proper manly cigar.

                      In America it seems likely that the cigarette came in to vogue among range hands for whom the difficulty of keeping a supply of intact cigars would seem obvious, but that is purely conjecture as the definitive monograph on methods of tobacco smoking is as yet unwritten.

                    32. I had always heard that cigarettes were first popular with the Spanish and then Mexicans. The Texan cowboys and the Californos picked it up from them, and then spread the habit north with the trail herds.

                  2. I don’t think she’s a fluffer. I live on a street with “Prostitution Activities Not Allowed” on signs you can’t miss on both ends of it.

                    Having chatted with a couple of the gals a time or three, I’d say they have more functioning brain cells than she does.

            2. Yeah, from my limited understanding camel toe is usually only present when the legs are closed, it goes away when they are stretched open.

        3. I’ve been subject to all sorts of “hysterics; bullying and abuse” in my 50 years of life. What I’ve learned is to ignore it until it gets physical; then put down the bully as fast as possible. Certainly, I don’t respect it — were I in that scientist’s shoes, I would have told the imbeciles tweeting at him about his damned shirt to sit on a stick and spin. Or something markedly ruder.

          If you want to live in the real world, you grow a thick skin. It’s that effing simple. Only fools like you obsess about little things.

            1. Kinda spongy, not much to get the teeth into.

              But thanks!

              They’re so rare on the ground around here. You’d think we weren’t hospitable…

                1. Clamps is a special case of boring predator. Not worth anybody’s time, and irritating with it.

    9. Nah, let’s not use the c word to describe these female bullies who hate shirts. That’s a useful body part. They are not useful.

      The correct term for a female useful idiot is the more Elizabethan spelling, “quaint.” Because her brain has already reached obsolescence.

        1. Are you suggesting that “Genevieve Sabine” is but loosely ‘quainted with rationality, Eamon ?

    11. Tsk. Talk about “poor reasoning on display”! Entering a discussion with a tendentious claim*, false accusation**, undemonstrated factual claim*** and gratuitous insults to hostess**** and commeters***** constitutes a special kind of demonstrated poor reasoning.

      It is no wonder such a one defends those who can only see the oyster and not the pearl.

      *That there is poor reasoning, absent any disputation or example of such reasoning

      **That anyone had claimed that the specific element of the illustratiion cited constituted “science fiction” — an impossibility given that SF is a literary art. The closest any came was to accurately cite the cumulative relation of the illustratiions to vintage SF art.

      ***Addressing any “cultural bias” in STEM is dumbing down the science by distracting from what is the essence of STEM.

      **** & * No explanation necessary, except to note that what some deem “bizarre” is often an indication of how bizarre the critic is.

    12. Just out of mild curiosity, Genny, can you perform a simple STEM demonstration for us and tell us the time lag between commands sent from Mission Control and the exploration module … and the change in position of that comet during that period?

      If you are going to complain about such trivialities as Matt’s shirt being a possible distraction it would be supportive of your authority of you could demonstrate comprehension of the difficulty of the task.

    13. Ah yes, “skim til offended” reached.

      Do we have a checklist available for this sort of thing?

          1. Copy & paste as needed:

            INTERNET ARGUING CHECKLIST

            See ‹http://monsterhunternation.com/2013/09/20/the-internet-arguing-checklist/›.

            ✨🌟<b>Achievement(s) Unlocked:</b>🌟✨
            ☑ 1. Skim until Offended
            ☑ 2. Disqualify that Opinion (Subcategories: “”)
            ☑ 3. Attack, Attack, Attack
            ☑ 4. Disregard Inconvenient facts (Subcategories: “”)
            ☑ 5. Make S——t Up
            ☑ 6. Resort to Moral Equivalency
            ☑ 7. Concern Trolling
            ☑ 8. When all else fails, Racism!
            ☑ Bonus: Justify the Moon Ferrets!

            ❇️<b>Efficiency bonus!</b>❇️

            (<i>Just ‹x› more for a complete checklist!</i>)

            Ballot box: ☐ ☑ ☒
            w/ U+FE0E: ☐︎ ☑︎ ☒︎ (suppressed image)
            w/ U+FE0F: ☐️ ☑️ ☒️ (forced image)

            Sub-species of #2 (AKA “Dismiss!”):
            • Privilege
            • “You sound angry.”
            • “How rude.”
            • “You know too much/too little.”
            • “You sure did write a lot.”

            #3 = ad hominem.

            #4 = “The Drudge Report? That’s not a real newspaper!”, “That’s anecdote, not evidence!”, or “Link or it didn’t happen!”

            #6 = “Well, Republicans did it too!” (So? Was it okay then?)

            #7 = Boycott threats, also “I read your article, and it like totally would have swayed me to your side, BUT the way you called liberal ideas liberal and talked about people who are liberals by using the word liberal just ruined the whole thing. You’d be more effective if you used no labels.”

            view raw

            checklist.md

            hosted with ❤ by GitHub

    14. Glossing over all the poor reasoning on display here- that if you put a raygun in the hand of a pinup with her legs splayed it’s ‘science fiction’ …

      This is extremely good reasoning, as the sexy pinup girl with a ray gun was a standard figure on the science-fiction pulp covers from the 1930’s through 1950’s. But then, unlike you, I actually know somthing about the history of science fiction.

      it takes a special kind of c*nt to call another woman a ‘fluffer’….for any reason.

      What if the woman is, in point of fact, a ‘fluffer’? (FYI, that is an occupation).

      You display your own ignorance of many things here.

  57. Found on Twitter:

    “Laurie Penny @PennyRed · 14 mins14 minutes ago As the first ever photographs FROM A COMET appear, some guys are doxxing women for daring to speak about sexism in science. Go human race!”

    It shouldn’t surprise me how they twist things around, but it still does.

    1. So someone who isn’t involved in science bitches about a shirt that most of the women I know involved in science don’t see an issue with is “daring to speak about sexism in science”? Really?

      Someone’s smoking crack. It’s the only explanation.

    2. So including the info that someone has a column at a well-known magazine is now doxxing? Learn something new every day.

      Typical SJW – get it all bass-ackwards.

    3. It’s Laurie Penny, she’s a particular, special case.

      Oh, and a/the voice of her generation.

      3. The what of her generation? Well, that explains the nails-on-chalkboard shrillness of it as well as the utter lack of factually accurate content.

    4. Don’t you love it when the glittery ones proudly display their ignorance?

      That should be “sexism in scientists” or even sexism in science laboratories.

      Admittedly, there is indeed sexism in science, and all the efforts of the Specially Judgmental Wons can’t drive it out. Because Science, my dear children, is evidence and fact based, and the evidence and facts are biased against those who deny their reality.

  58. Wow, I missed all the fun. I could be wrong, but her name sounds like a French porn star from the 1970’s. Maybe that’s why she’s so offended by the whole fluffer thing? :-p

  59. @Dr. Mauser – I think we’re something of a kimodameshi for the SJWs now. Test of courage for cowards. Because when it really comes down to it, they’re too afraid to actually do anything except through cats paws and sneering from the Internet and from afar, and we’ve got much better things to do with our time than ‘dox’ or hunt them down.

    Coz, well, we have lives.

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  62. Mentioning “sewing circle” in connection with feminism immediately calls to mind a t-shirt that was very popular in feminist circles back in the 70’s and 80’s: “Ladies Sewing Circle and Terrorist Society”.

      1. It’s based on the assumption that social scientists know what they’re doing. One sociologist comes up with a set of bylaws for the Watashaw Sewing Circle that ensures it will grow rapidly.

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